Shutdown Field as ultimate self defense system

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

I'm not a PvP'er, neither in ED nor any other game, but even I'm aware that most graphics-card software and gaming monitors come with options to overlay crosshairs on the screen these days. And I'm sure there's far more bespoke overlays available..

So glitching the in-game HUD may affect Cmdrs on consoles and more casual PvPers, but I doubt this would impact fixed aiming of the more dedicated players all that much..

Having said that, it's an interesting (and less exploitable) idea than the OPs and by losing tracking (radar is garbled) means the target has a chance of getting away if they can get out of the field-of-view, especially if they then dump a heatsink before the effect vanishes and have gone "invisible" (FA-off and thrusters not firing to hide contrails) until their FSD spools up.

The downside of course is that unless they are already pointing directly at their high-wake destination (or have memorised the star pattern) trying to align with the jump vector is also a bit more difficult for the escapee...

The other downside is how frustrated would PvE combat pilots get if NPCs also have access to this tech? Just by sheer numbers in CZ's/HazRes's, there'd always be at least one NPC around which would have it so it'd probably be going off quite regularly.

Thanks for the feedback. I was starting to think no one read it. Lol

I don't think "stuck on" crosshairs would be an issue, because when you move your ship, your "head" (view point) moves differently, so the crosshairs aren't fixed on the screen like say, Counter Strike.

Waking out with a garbled HUD wouldn't be too bad, because your compass could still be in working order, or only partially blurred.
It's how I navigate with no canopy.

I wouldn't like NPC's to use it, and probably just not let them. Because even with the cooldown I suggested, it would be more annoying than chaff spam. Lol

 

[Micha]

Thanks for the feedback. I was starting to think no one read it. Lol

I -try- to read an entire thread before adding my 2Cr...

I don't think "stuck on" crosshairs would be an issue, because when you move your ship, your "head" (view point) moves differently, so the crosshairs aren't fixed on the screen like say, Counter Strike.

Mm, fair enough; I've been playing in VR so much recently that I forgot how much the 2D view moves around (something I -really- wish we could turn off). And of course you'd lose the "leading sight" but I'm sure well-practised combateers only use it as an aid, not a necessity.

I wouldn't like NPC's to use it, and probably just not let them. Because even with the cooldown I suggested, it would be more annoying than chaff spam. Lol

This would be my main concern; there'd be bound to be one going off every 20s just from the NPCs fighting amongst each other. And of course they'd completely cheat and ignore its effects anyway.

 

[[VR] M4st0d0n]

Did they?

Are you able to quote more than eight words of a response post you're not even implied with and develop a full sentence to communicate whatever your take on the subject is?

Or is it some kind of petty talk you want to start?

What's up my dude. Nice weather.

Of course they did. And those in open who got ganked switched to PG. And those already in PG who got ganked blocked or switched to another PG or solo.

 

[Sylow]

I'm not a PvP'er, neither in ED nor any other game, but even I'm aware that most graphics-card software and gaming monitors come with options to overlay crosshairs on the screen these days. And I'm sure there's far more bespoke overlays available.

Hehe. See how far we've come. I remember old AvP2 times. People were using the sniper rifle as one-shot-one-kill weapon also on the move. The developers had the great idea of removing the crosshair when not scoped. It stopped one dedicated sniper rifle user of my clan of that time for about half a minute. Then he told us that he took some transparent tape, drew a crosshair on it and stuck it to his monitor. Problem solved.

I don't think "stuck on" crosshairs would be an issue, because when you move your ship, your "head" (view point) moves differently, so the crosshairs aren't fixed on the screen like say, Counter Strike.

That'll only add two more minutes of work. When ED detects my eye tracker, the moving head is disabled. It instead uses the position settings provided by the eye tracker. Which means that when my eye tracker is switched on but not activated, my pilots head is like bolted to the ship. No movement sway or anything.

You don't need to buy an eye tracker either. You just install some eye tracking software and start it, so ED detects it. So again "problem solved".

 

[Kaocraft]

Here's another idea: What if mines were good?

 

[Bigmaec]

Here's another idea: What if mines were good?

Then gankers would use them on Explorers who wouldn't use them because they cost precious lightyears

Seriously, the tools are already in game. An Explorer will never be able to fight a PvP vessel,
but he can perfectly run away without harm without losing all too much range.

Or use PG.

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

Here's another idea: What if mines were good?

I have to respectfully disagree and tell you why mines are actually the most good weapon there is.

One day I will pirate a player with a bazillion void opals in their shieldless t-9 and they won't combat log.

I'll have them jettison half a bazillion void opals, but not permit them to leave yet.

I'll lay about 30 mines among the void opals, and tell them they can have their shinies back if they can get it with cargo scoop not collectors.

And the t-9 will try, and it will explode, and on that day I can finally quit playing this game because I will never do anything better in it.

This is my Elite Dangerous white whale.

 

[Kaocraft]

Then gankers would use them on Explorers who wouldn't use them because they cost precious lightyears

Seriously, the tools are already in game. An Explorer will never be able to fight a PvP vessel,
but he can perfectly run away without harm without losing all too much range.

Or use PG.

If they primarily served as effective area-denial weapons I don't think PvPers would choose to use them against their targets. The trouble with them right now is they are *only* useful for PvP dive-bombing type attacks. However even now they are of no use against a fleeing target. I've seen clever use of mines in PvP dogfights but I'm not aware of any ganking of fleeing targets using mines.

If a trail of mines could do anything to shake a pursuer or disable their weapons or knock them around so they can't aim, or disable their FSD long enough to prevent a follow-up interdiction, it would be worth equipping them for defense.

And I don't think this conversation is about explorers exclusively. Traders could sure use them. Passenger ships, too. And probably if a single mine launcher were effective enough, explorers would at least consider them.

 

[Bigmaec]

If they primarily served as effective area-denial weapons I don't think PvPers would choose to use them against their targets. The trouble with them right now is they are *only* useful for PvP dive-bombing type attacks. However even now they are of no use against a fleeing target. I've seen clever use of mines in PvP dogfights but I'm not aware of any ganking of fleeing targets using mines.

If a trail of mines could do anything to shake a pursuer or disable their weapons or knock them around so they can't aim, or disable their FSD long enough to prevent a follow-up interdiction, it would be worth equipping them for defense.

And I don't think this conversation is about explorers exclusively. Traders could sure use them. Passenger ships, too. And probably if a single mine launcher were effective enough, explorers would at least consider them.

The problem with any effect disabling FSD is that it can be applied to the Explorer/Trader/Miner/etc. too. And it WILL be.

Imagine your typical T9 fitted with FSD disruption mines. And now imagine a meta FdL dropping in, with one slot with FSD disruption mines fitted too.
T9 disrupts FdL 2D frame shift drive D). FdL disrupts T9 fsd. Result: one dead T9.

 

[Kaocraft]

The problem with any effect disabling FSD is that it can be applied to the Explorer/Trader/Miner/etc. too. And it WILL be.

Imagine your typical T9 fitted with FSD disruption mines. And now imagine a meta FdL dropping in, with one slot with FSD disruption mines fitted too.
T9 disrupts FdL 2D frame shift drive D). FdL disrupts T9 fsd. Result: one dead T9.

Right but how does the FdL actually hit the T9, which is flying AWAY from the FdL?

 

[Bigmaec]

Right but how does the FdL actually hit the T9, which is flying AWAY from the FdL?

550 m/s > 300 m/s

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

550 m/s > 300 m/s

You're not wrong but in practice any t-9 pilot who flies into the mines is gonna die to that FdL no matter what is on its hardpoints.

Hitting a pilot who has decent skill with mines is really hard.

Keep in mind there's an arming time/distance for mines (I don't recall the exact mechanic off the top of my head).

There are some cases like a wing gank and one is stealth where it's not quite as hard but mines are not easy to use at all and generally used for the experimental effects not the weapon itself.

Most vids I've seen where mines work, it's because the victim isn't paying enough attention / ignorant.

I had a really good PS4 PvP'er try me from a viper mining build (I was in a chally) and I think he only hit once or twice before we just called it a draw. And the guy is definitely a better pilot than me.

I know the t-9 handles like a pig but it's not like they're out there dying to reverb mines a lot. Usually just to standard murder stuff, PA, rails, MC etc.

 

[Bigmaec]

You're not wrong but in practice any t-9 pilot who flies into the mines is gonna die to that FdL no matter what is on its hardpoints.

Hitting a pilot who has decent skill with mines is really hard.

Keep in mind there's an arming time/distance for mines (I don't recall the exact mechanic off the top of my head).

There are some cases like a wing gank and one is stealth where it's not quite as hard but mines are not easy to use at all and generally used for the experimental effects not the weapon itself.

Most vids I've seen where mines work, it's because the victim isn't paying enough attention / ignorant.

I had a really good PS4 PvP'er try me from a viper mining build (I was in a chally) and I think he only hit once or twice before we just called it a draw. And the guy is definitely a better pilot than me.

I know the t-9 handles like a pig but it's not like they're out there dying to reverb mines a lot. Usually just to standard murder stuff, PA, rails, MC etc.

I totally agree with you but I have a feeling you didn't read the whole chain of arguments with Kao.
He said "what if mines are good"
I said "then T9s get ganked by them"
He said "but how is the T9 hit by mines"
And I said "by being faster than a T9"...



Mines won't work at all or they will work worse against Traders then for Traders.

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

I totally agree with you but I have a feeling you didn't read the whole chain of arguments with Kao.
He said "what if mines are good"
I said "then T9s get ganked by them"
He said "but how is the T9 hit by mines"
And I said "by being faster than a T9"...



Mines won't work at all or they will work worse against Traders then for Traders.

You're right, I missed step 2. It's because I'm having a pitched battle with all of DW2 over in console scrub galaxy

I'm trying to maintain control of Open WP4 from my SRV

v hard much challenge v busy