So confused.

Bartizan

Bartizan
Been away for a few months and now that I am back I am itching to see the new VRs in action but trying to make sense of all the VR threads has me gassed. I have a DK2, and like it for what it is. I was seconds away from clicking confirm order on a Vive but stopped and read more threads and just stopped the order. There must be a thousand varying opinions on Vive, CV1, DK2, how it is now, what's coming, wait for this, don't buy that, this sucks no wait this sucks....

...I have even less of an idea what to do than when I started to consider upgrading from the DK2. So I guess stay with DK2 until the fog clears?

This might be the least helpful forum section I ever tried to make sense of [blah]
 

Hell Razor5543

H
I have the DK2 as well. I would be inclined to wait a while. The next generation graphics cards are coming through, and may well change things (apparently they are about 3 times more powerful, but for similar costs and power demands). You also have to consider what will happen in the VR technology. If I upgrade it will be in the New Year, as prices should drop (they will be high around Christmas), and things will possibly have cleared up somewhat.
 

dutchy2000

D
Its a matter of which annoys you the least

DK2:
Dev kit, that may or may work for much longer, all depends on the FB/Oculus people and how long they will keep their software running with it.
Fairly heavy, long sessions will lead to some neck/back pains (it does for me, I am getting old).
SDE is very prominent but you learn to tune it out.
Works flawlessly on 970 in ED right now, I know I have one of those (although recently upgraded to 980ti).
Lenses don't have god rays, but have chromatic abboration which can be quite noticeable at times.
Some people have really bad smearing, personally don't have it with latest Nvidia drivers.

CV1:
Current officially support HDM by Oculus. Higher resolution than DK2, higher required frame rate (90 vs 75).
Great ergonomics, much lighter than DK2 and Vive.
Works flawlessly on 970 if you can live with dialing down some settings.
SDE not 100% gone, but 95% of the way there.
Apparently has noticeable god rays due to using fresnel lenses. Fresnel lenses are lighter and eliminate the chromatic abboration.
Perfectly supported in ED.
Smearing is mostly gone.
Huge wait time on it, August+ when you order now.

Vive:
Same resolution as CV1, with same frame rate requirements.
Need to use steam vr to run ED with it.
Decent ergonomics, lighter than DK2, heavier than CV1, more balanced than DK2 but apparently can still cause fatigue issues.
Due to steam vr not having ATW (Asynchronous TimeWarp) needs something beefier than a 970 to be use-able.
Currently a bug in how Vive and ED interact that is causing terrible aliasing and graphics issues, its being worked on (don't believe all the doom sayers, I am sure they will work it out, just like with the oculus runtime).
Uses different fresnel lenses, but still has god rays, some people say they are less than CV1.
Has room scale which CV1 does not, but for ED that is irrelevant (for now).
People are reporting more production issues with Vive than CV1 (dead pixels and things of that nature).
More expensive than CV1 due to extra controllers, once oculus has controllers too price will be the sameish.
SDE almost gone too, apparently slightly more notice-able than CV1, but don't take my word for it.

That is about it I think, I probably forgot something that people will correct me on I am sure.
 
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Bartizan

Bartizan
dutchy2000 said:
Its a matter of which annoys you the least

DK2:
Dev kit, that may or may work for much longer, all depends on the FB/Oculus people and how long they will keep their software running with it.
Fairly heavy, long sessions will lead to some neck/back pains (it does for me, I am getting old).
SDE is very prominent but you learn to tune it out.
Works flawlessly on 970 in ED right now, I know I have one of those (although recently upgraded to 980ti).
Lenses don't have god rays, but have chromatic abboration which can be quite noticeable at times.
Some people have really bad smearing, personally don't have it with latest Nvidia drivers.

CV1:
Current officially support HDM by Oculus. Higher resolution than DK2, higher required frame rate (90 vs 75).
Great ergonomics, much lighter than DK2 and Vive.
Works flawlessly on 970 if you can live with dialing down some settings.
SDE not 100% gone, but 95% of the way there.
Apparently has noticeable god rays due to using fresnel lenses. Fresnel lenses are lighter and eliminate the chromatic abboration.
Perfectly supported in ED.
Smearing is mostly gone.
Huge wait time on it, August+ when you order now.

Vive:
Same resolution as CV1, with same frame rate requirements.
Need to use steam vr to run ED with it.
Decent ergonomics, lighter than DK2, heavier than CV1, more balanced than DK2 but apparently can still cause fatigue issues.
Due to steam vr not having ATW (Asynchronous TimeWarp) needs something beefier than a 970 to be use-able.
Currently a bug in how Vive and ED interact that is causing terrible aliasing and graphics issues, its being worked on (don't believe all the doom sayers, I am sure they will work it out, just like with the oculus runtime).
Uses different fresnel lenses, but still has god rays, some people say they are less than CV1.
Has room scale which CV1 does not, but for ED that is irrelevant (for now).
People are reporting more production issues with Vive than CV1 (dead pixels and things of that nature).
More expensive than CV1 due to extra controllers, once oculus has controllers too price will be the sameish.
SDE almost gone too, apparently slightly more notice-able than CV1, but don't take my word for it.

That is about it I think, I probably forgot something that people will correct me on I am sure.
Click to expand...

I really appreciate you taking the time to type all that....very helpful, thank you.
 

Lestenio

L
I was a DK2 user for over a year. Long story short. I bought a Vive and totally love it. Room scale is amazing. People kept telling me how amazing but I didn't realise just how so until I tried it.

ED is a little blurry with the Vive (the CV1 also has issues I believe) but FD will no doubt sort those issue out soon.
The upgrade is worth it for the reduced SDE and better tracking alone.
 

Hell Razor5543

H
Unless things dramatically change I will go the CV1 route, as ED has native support, while the Vive has to use SteamVR. I have no issues with SteamVR per se, as I had to use it to allow my DK2 to work using 0.8 SDK, but now I can use SDK 1.3 directly it has hugely increased the level of enjoyment.
 

Captain N

C
Lestenio said:
Room scale is amazing. People kept telling me how amazing but I didn't realise just how so until I tried it.
Click to expand...

This. I had the luxury of getting to try the Vive before ordering, and that sold it to me in a matter of minutes. I just immediately realised what a world of difference the ability to interact with your surroundings (almost) naturally makes.

Rift might be ok if literally all you plan to use it for is ED and other sitting down cockpit sims. In general use, no room-scale and no motion controllers is too much of a limitation imo. You'll be basically barred from all the most vivid VR experiences (besides ED anyway!)
 

freejack

F
Lestenio said:
I was a DK2 user for over a year. Long story short. I bought a Vive and totally love it. Room scale is amazing. People kept telling me how amazing but I didn't realise just how so until I tried it.

ED is a little blurry with the Vive (the CV1 also has issues I believe) but FD will no doubt sort those issue out soon.
The upgrade is worth it for the reduced SDE and better tracking alone.
Click to expand...

How does ED look on the Vive compared to the DK2? Some say it's worse. If it is, I don't want to spoil my first impression until they fix it.
 
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Lestenio

L
freejack said:
How does ED look on the Vive compared to the DK2? Some say it's worse. If it is, I don't want to spoil my first impression until they fix it.
Click to expand...

If you used a DK2 then your probably already used to the fact that VR isn't perfect. I think a lot of people trying VR for the first time have a majority of the issues.

My first impression was wow no screen door effect, my second impression was I have left the little plastic covers on the lenses.
Turns out that was the God Ray's. Either there was a partial fix in the last update or I have tweaked some setting or just got used to it, because now I have no real issues. The text is a little blurry but still better than the DK2 and perfectly readable.
Even better is FD are planning a fix so it can only get better.

The FOV is also much better (and can be adjusted to make it better still). The DK2 I felt like I was looking out a dirty diving helmet. I have no such issues with the Vive.

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Captain N said:
Rift might be ok if literally all you plan to use it for is ED and other sitting down cockpit sims. In general use, no room-scale and no motion controllers is too much of a limitation imo. You'll be basically barred from all the most vivid VR experiences (besides ED anyway!)
Click to expand...

Exactly. With the Vive you get the best of both worlds. When I look in the store now for games, it's room scale or nothing. I can't imagine limiting my experience to sitting down.
 

stripealipe

stripealipe
Hell Razor5543 said:
Unless things dramatically change I will go the CV1 route, as ED has native support, while the Vive has to use SteamVR. I have no issues with SteamVR per se, as I had to use it to allow my DK2 to work using 0.8 SDK, but now I can use SDK 1.3 directly it has hugely increased the level of enjoyment.
Click to expand...

In all fairness, doesn't ED run 'native' with the Vive too? Having SteamVR running just means the runtime is active which is necessary for VR to work. Uninstall the Oculus runtime and Elite will not run either.
Their is no real 'native' support as all software has to support and have the relevant runtime running in order to work in VR.

What we're all needing in a future build of Elite is a properly optimised for VR experience.. The game has had VR support very early on, but they've never really had time or needed to properly give time to optimising for an exprience when they've not had the final hardware and runtime in their hands. Now that both consumer versions have dropped, i'm sure FD will get round to producing some optimised code to overcome each of the headsets shortcomings and make it look better that what it currently is. We just need to hang in there whilst they get this huge 2.1 update out of the way...
 
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dutchy2000

D
stripealipe said:
In all fairness, doesn't ED run 'native' with the Vive too? Having SteamVR running just means the runtime is active which is necessary for VR to work. Uninstall the Oculus runtime and Elite will not run either.
Their is no real 'native' support as all software has to support and have the relevant runtime running in order to work in VR.

What we're all needing in a future build of Elite is a properly optimised for VR experience.. The game has had VR support very early on, but they've never really had time or needed to properly give time to optimising for an exprience when they've not had the final hardware and runtime in their hands. Now that both consumer versions have dropped, i'm sure FD will get round to producing some optimised code to overcome each of the headsets shortcomings and make it look better that what it currently is. We just need to hang in there whilst they get this huge 2.1 update out of the way...
Click to expand...
No you don't need the oculus runtime for the Vive to work, that would make no sense whatsoever. Before the 1.3 runtime was release you could use steam VR to make your DK2 work with Ed which had been released a few days before the runtime dropped.
 

Bartizan

Bartizan
Full room sounds cool, but I might be a ways off for that to be practical. My gaming room is not much larger than a walk in closet. For now I am happy with seated only. I want to upgrade so bad but I am so gun shy on it right now. I will probably wait.
 

stripealipe

stripealipe
dutchy2000 said:
No you don't need the oculus runtime for the Vive to work, that would make no sense whatsoever. Before the 1.3 runtime was release you could use steam VR to make your DK2 work with Ed which had been released a few days before the runtime dropped.
Click to expand...

No, i didn't say that.. i said you needed either the Oculus runtime for Oculus to work, or SteamVR for Vive to work... and running Elite from SteamVR for Oculus was a dodgy workaround when the runtimes started messing around in the Dev days when FD didn't keep up with the latest runtime build.. You always needed the Oculus runtime loaded and working regardless.
 
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Darkfyre99

Darkfyre99
Lestenio said:
I was a DK2 user for over a year. Long story short. I bought a Vive and totally love it. Room scale is amazing. People kept telling me how amazing but I didn't realise just how so until I tried it.
Click to expand...

+1 All the way. I had the opportunity to try a DK1 once at a con, but I'm really glad I decided to go with the Vive. The ability to walk around in VR is mind blowing... especially when you forget where you are and try to lean against something that isn't really there. ;)

I'm still getting up out of my chair and exploring the cockpits of the ships I own. I'm also enjoying poking my head out an "open"window to look at what I can see outside my ship... just don't try to grab the sills. I'm even putting a second chair in my VR space, so I can sit down in the copilot's seat of my Cobra Mk3 from time to time. :)
 

Kremator

K
The seated exprience of the Rift is just amazing. Perfect for comfort and has a higher build quality and feel to it than the Vive.
 

Cruise

Cruise
The seated experience with the Vive is also amazing!.......but the added room scale experience is something truly fantastic.
Vive comfort is fine, & I'm speaking from experience.
Build quality of Vive is perfectly fine, can't see how it's inferior to the rift at all.
 

Skaldy

Skaldy
Almost every day since getting the Vive I have been playing Holopoint. I now feel like an expert with a bow and arrow (in my own mind at least), plus my arms and legs have never been fitter. Room scale has so much potential. My small office is 1.5m x 2.0m, but it's enough.
 
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