So confused.

dogbite · May 18, 2016

Dutchy2000 pretty much covered the important stuff.
If you want room scale and can wait for ED to fix it's issues then VIVE.
If you want somewhat clearer ED and can wait for likely room scale and hand controllers then CV1
If you can wait for this new tech to mature then I would say stay with your DK2. At least you have one and it apparently works well with 1.3 driver and Sweet Effects
You should be good this year for support on DK2 and perhaps longer.
Really depends on how big an erection you have for the newer tech

PS If you play other things including DCS Iracing PCARs etc you might want to seek out their forums. If you are considering Vireio or Vporx for older titles their forums as well.

If I had a DK2 I would be inclined to hold out till they hit the retail stream so I could demo but since I don't I went CV1 because I will be playing all the above and Oculus support is ahead in most of those choices. I suspect all will be quite even by Christmas. Then again this is all somewhat subjective at this time.
Many here even prefer the DK2 in ED for now.

If Elite Dangerous is your main reason for VR then Oculus seems to have some advantages for many but this could change by the time you got your hands on one.

ps Oculus will do room scale. This is just the 1 camera and a 2nd will come wit TOUCH controllers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_HlXzELHgo

Lestenio · May 18, 2016

Mosait said:
I am actually quite happy with a seated experience, as all I use VR for is elite. Maybe some day I will have full scale.

Room scale is one of those things you have to try to appreciate. When the Oculus Touch controllers arrive you'll see what the fuss is about.

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Darkfyre99 said:
+1 All the way. I had the opportunity to try a DK1 once at a con, but I'm really glad I decided to go with the Vive. The ability to walk around in VR is mind blowing... especially when you forget where you are and try to lean against something that isn't really there.

I'm still getting up out of my chair and exploring the cockpits of the ships I own. I'm also enjoying poking my head out an "open"window to look at what I can see outside my ship... just don't try to grab the sills. I'm even putting a second chair in my VR space, so I can sit down in the copilot's seat of my Cobra Mk3 from time to time.

I have found myself whistling at robots to attract their attention. I have punched the window with my controller while fighting monsters and only just stopped myself from leaning on the castle wall in the Longbow demo. I love every second of it.

At some point I have to figure out how I can get into the second cockpit in the Asp.

CATPAIN KIRK · May 18, 2016

dutchy2000 said:
CV1:
[...]

Vive:
Need to use steam vr to run ED with it.
[...]

That is about it I think, I probably forgot something that people will correct me on I am sure.

Good points, but you indeed forgot to point out that you'll need the 1.3+ oculus runtime to use the CV1.

Pointing out you'll need SteamVR in regards to the Vive whilst omitting the fact you'll need Oculus Home for the rift is like pointing out that you might sneeze from using the Vive whilst omitting you'll be infected with HIV when using the CV1.

dutchy2000 · May 19, 2016

CATPAIN KIRK said:
Good points, but you indeed forgot to point out that you'll need the 1.3+ oculus runtime to use the CV1.

Pointing out you'll need SteamVR in regards to the Vive whilst omitting the fact you'll need Oculus Home for the rift is like pointing out that you might sneeze from using the Vive whilst omitting you'll be infected with HIV when using the CV1.

Fair point, there are titles for the DK2 that you can run with older runtimes, or indeed only run with the older runtime. But those should get upgraded soon enough if not already. So yes you need oculus home for CV1 and DK2 if you want to run ED.

[HJ]-RedRaven · May 19, 2016

Bartizan said:
I have a DK2, and like it for what it is.

My advice - stick with the DK2 until you can sit down and demo the Vive or Rift CV1 (preferably both, and preferably with ED if that is your main VR target software title).

This might be of some use - a map showing the locations of those willing to demo their VR hardware - obviously you'll need to find contacts local to you with a CV1 or Vive.
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1M1fVCROrK4g1MVHqRNpfkUjf0G8&hl=en_US

Right now, the Rift CV1 is the best VR solution for ED, but it still has les that some find troublesome (god-rays, no room scale although it does track in a similar volume to the Vive, no touch controllers yet, and higher PC horsepower needed to run than the DK2).

The Vive currently has some rendering issues but once FD sorts them out, it should have similar visuals to the Rift CV1. The hardware specs for both HMD's are very similar (both 90fps, both same resolution, with some differences in the lenses etc).

So if you're on the fence with respect to a possible upgrade, wait and get a demo if at all possible with the new hardware.

Mosait · May 19, 2016

Lestenio said:
Room scale is one of those things you have to try to appreciate. When the Oculus Touch controllers arrive you'll see what the fuss is about.

I appreciate that, and you're probably correct. Room scale just isn't feasible where I live. I have at most a square meter, probably less, around my chair. And a little bit of space behind where I can kind of venture around the ship.

My hope is is that when I move in a few years, I will have more space and the HMD market will have a clearer vision and better solutions for the current issues.

And honestly, I like the idea of integrated headphones (I'm sure the voice will have something similar on the next version). It is one less thing I have to plug in. I have to unplug/plug/hide just about everything whenever I play, otherwise, my cat will make short work of cables and such.

I do appreciate the polite candor about the subject here. Too often these discussions get nasty.

Raptoyd · May 19, 2016

wrong quote attached itself- erased

Darkfyre99 · May 19, 2016

Lestenio said:
Room scale is one of those things you have to try to appreciate. When the Oculus Touch controllers arrive you'll see what the fuss is about.

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I have found myself whistling at robots to attract their attention. I have punched the window with my controller while fighting monsters and only just stopped myself from leaning on the castle wall in the Longbow demo. I love every second of it.

At some point I have to figure out how I can get into the second cockpit in the Asp.

You can take advantage of the fact that your head position resets if you reset your HMD position. You can only reposition it within your chaperone bounds, but it does allow you to poke your head into places it doesn't belong. It's fascinating what parts of your ship are currently rendered.

For example, if you crouch down low, you can look under the deck of the cockpit. In the Sidewinder, your cockpit is over and slightly foreword of the cargo scoop, so if you poke your head through the floor or the door, you're looking into the area where your SRV deploys.

Lestenio · May 19, 2016

Darkfyre99 said:
For example, if you crouch down low, you can look under the deck of the cockpit. In the Sidewinder, your cockpit is over and slightly foreword of the cargo scoop, so if you poke your head through the floor or the door, you're looking into the area where your SRV deploys.

Cheers for that. I managed to get into the lower asp cockpit. Sadly it's empty, not even a seat. Had a look through the door too. Can't wait for proper walking around

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Mosait said:
I do appreciate the polite candor about the subject here. Too often these discussions get nasty.

I think some people need to justify their purchase by trashing the competition. It helps reinforce the purchase decision.
Once Oculus Touch is released I suspect there will be very little between the two Huds. Certainly if it was available now then it would have made my purchase decision that much harder. But in the end I really wanted to try the controllers.

The DK2 used to be a pain with putting it on and then trying to manage headphones so I see the attraction of integration.

shadragon · May 19, 2016

Mosait said:
I am actually quite happy with a seated experience, as all I use VR for is elite. Maybe some day I will have full scale.

While I have the same attitude (I bought my Vive primarily for seated E: D) the room experience keeps my WIFE happy. She and her friends are spending a lot of time in the Lab, The Blu and Job Simulator. Takes away a bit of time from my gaming, but domestic harmony is more important.

I do enjoy the other VR titles like Apollo 11 and Call of the Starseed as well, but with the Vive you have the option to stand up and game. Nice to have that option available.

Mosait · May 19, 2016

Lestenio said:
I think some people need to justify their purchase by trashing the competition. It helps reinforce the purchase decision.
Once Oculus Touch is released I suspect there will be very little between the two Huds. Certainly if it was available now then it would have made my purchase decision that much harder. But in the end I really wanted to try the controllers.

The DK2 used to be a pain with putting it on and then trying to manage headphones so I see the attraction of integration.

I very much agree, in particular your point about the trash talk around purchase justification. It's a repeated theme in all competing products (the console "wars" are a brightly shining dark star in that respect).

The way I see it is that the resounding stress/fear ppl have with making the wrong purchase is centered on the implication of being incompetent and irresponsible consumer. Or, commonly in forums, "...an idiot for buying something so stupid".

Instead of fighting over the "best" HMD, it would be better to focus on the positives of each and the areas where improvement is needed (this occurs often here, which is great to see). How would it help? Because, the general public looks at the VR community as "idiots for buying something stupid that will fail".

I want to see VR thrive, and it won't if the general public continues to see it as an niche/elitist platform. It's possible that the PSVR will help in that respect.

TL;DR: I would like VR to succeed, and we are the ones that can help or hurt that. Of course, all my opinion above, and I could be wrong.

shadragon · May 19, 2016

Regardless of what others say, you need to buy the VR solution that works best for you. OC and Vive are almost identical in performance. The differences are few. Look at both systems (try them out if at all possible) and make your own mind up. If you are rich, get them both. In either case, you won't be disappointed.

Bartizan · May 24, 2016

After a GREAT deal of back and forth of pros and cons, reading thread after thread after thread.....I finally pulled the trigger on the Vive. No idea when I might see it but I'm going to take a chance on it as it's becoming clear the DK2 is not long for this world as the updates progress.
Thanks for everyone's opinion and stuff.

CATPAIN KIRK · May 24, 2016

dutchy2000 said:
So yes you need oculus home for CV1 and DK2 if you want to run ED.

Well - this bears further implications. Looking at how Oculus stated they wont implement facebook business practices (whilst reserving the option to do so later), they're actively counteracting using their store with other HMDs already - and that's assuming the current OH version is the least restrictive and intrusive version we'll ever see.

I'd say buying a CV1 is fine - just don't buy anything from their store as you'll most likely lose access to all of them should you ever decide to switch the brand.

CylonSurfer · May 25, 2016

Darkfyre99 said:
+1 All the way. I had the opportunity to try a DK1 once at a con, but I'm really glad I decided to go with the Vive. The ability to walk around in VR is mind blowing... especially when you forget where you are and try to lean against something that isn't really there.

I'm still getting up out of my chair and exploring the cockpits of the ships I own. I'm also enjoying poking my head out an "open"window to look at what I can see outside my ship... just don't try to grab the sills. I'm even putting a second chair in my VR space, so I can sit down in the copilot's seat of my Cobra Mk3 from time to time.

I do that in my CV1 just fine, with timewarp keeping my frames nice n hight as well. I also have a second chair just in he right spot while piloting a Cobra MKIII, shame the in game seat is much lower than the primary pilots seat though eh!

Aelemar · May 25, 2016

Bartizan said:
After a GREAT deal of back and forth of pros and cons, reading thread after thread after thread.....I finally pulled the trigger on the Vive. No idea when I might see it but I'm going to take a chance on it as it's becoming clear the DK2 is not long for this world as the updates progress.
Thanks for everyone's opinion and stuff.

Congratulations: You have made a great choice

I have a Vive myself, and Elite was one of the reasons I got it. True, Elite has some issues in VR, but this will be sorted out eventually.

Reasons why I preferred the Vive:

Room Tracking: Yes, Oculus claims they can do this too, but Oculus is limited to a 5x11ft (55sq ft) space. In contrast, the Vive specifies a 15x15ft space (225sq ft). If you wanted the extra space with the Oculus, you would probably have to buy another tracking station down the line (more $$) Add to that the cost of Oculus touch and it will end up being more expensive than the Vive in the long run. The Vive comes with the complete package, right now.

Better Tracking Technology: The Oculus uses dot matrix tracking. The Vive uses laser tracking. Need I say more? Look at it this way: The Vive's tracking is so good, that I actually play in a 20x20ft room, and my stations are further away from each other than the recommended 16ft. Still, I have 0 tracking issues.

Once you get your Vive, and you are in a dungeon room, dodging, ducking, and strafing around your opponent to stab them in the back... Yeah you will see that room-gameplay is awesome

Additionally, there seems to be confusion about the Vive's sitting experience. "The Oculus is better for sitting" "The Vive is for standing". Wrong... The Vive can do sitting just fine. In fact, you only need 1 of the tracking stations running for it.

No Exclusivity: Oculus is pushing hard for exclusivity. That is, games that will run on Oculus, but not on any other headset. Um... I'm sorry Oculus, but my PC is a PC, not a damn console. Thank you very much. Additionally, exclusivity means consumers will have to make choices between one or the other, and for a new technology such as VR, that could seriously hamper the advancement of the technology. Anybody remembers PhysX when it was still owned by Ageia? How many games actually even used it? And other "exclusive" technologies?

In comparison, the Vive is inclined to support any and all VR devices out there. The idea is simple: The more people that adopt VR, the better they will be able to advance the technology. And the better for us gamers.

Also, while the Vives lineup doesn't seem to great right now, compared even to the Oculus. This is bound to change. Millions of people use Steam, and it happens to be the Vive's distributing platform. Valve will push (and they already are, by even helping fund developers) for future Steam games to support VR. Let's not forget which companies are backing the Vive. Google, Lionhead Studios, HBO, and of course, Valve. Let's see... Facebook backed Oculus, or Google backed Vive? Which company do you think has the higher monetary power to make the product they back advance?

You might read about Oculus "ATW" (someone mentioned it here) which basically stands for Asynchronous Timewarp. Well... The Vive happens to have a similar technology with "Reprojection". It does the same thing, in a different way. Reprojection, however, is designed to also smooth out room tracking.

Lastly, I don't like the idea of Facebook being attached to the Oculus. Social networking site attached to an HMD headset with a microphone and a camera in it? Who knows what they could do with such a thing.

Initially, I wanted the Oculus. But my interest quickly dwindled when they sold out to Facebook.

Oculus is going the Apple way. Vive is going the Google Android way. Myself, I prefer my hardware and software open, not walled off with unnecessary limitations.

Like I said, great choice with the Vive.

If you have any questions about the Vive, let me know in a pm. I'd be happy to oblige

Bartizan · May 25, 2016

Thank you and I'll keep your offer in mind.

dogbite · May 25, 2016

Bartizan said:
Thank you and I'll keep your offer in mind.

All the politics and fanboy biases aside, one of the best reviews by a guy who uses both and plays ED is this one:

https://youtu.be/agrc2OmAEYg

Kremator · May 25, 2016

dogbite said:
All the politics and fanboy biases aside, one of the best reviews by a guys who uses both and plays ED is this one:

https://youtu.be/agrc2OmAEYg

Totally agree. If you are playing ED then there is only one choice .... Rift.

NoshDaMinsk · May 25, 2016

Don't give a toss about rolling about a room like a spanner - just want to sit down - fly and drive. Both good at that (allegedly).

Key thing for me is the comfort - and whatever review you read, the CV1 seems to win on that front.

That's what did it for me - but each to his own.........

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dogbite said:
All the politics and fanboy biases aside, one of the best reviews by a guys who uses both and plays ED is this one:

https://youtu.be/agrc2OmAEYg

Totally agree - a great review.

Nosh