I read this again but i could not find it? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/cig/star-citizen?lang=de
Game Discussions Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12
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we should all take a deep breath and remember that any single one of us is simply talking for the most part. We have very few precious facts in regards to Star Citizens development despite its claim of being transparent. Most of the pages are filled with personal interpretations and regardless how some people claim to be able to "see the design or intention" and link certain events and statetments in hindsight to support their own view on things none of us have definitite answers because we are not CIG, we dont work for CIG (1 exception) and we just dont know enough to make absolute statements above our own opinion. Additionally some of us have specific experience in certain areas but not all that are involved in the development of Star Citizen. All I have for example is my common sense as I have nil experience in coding, project management (apart from "managing" a relationship) or computers in general except for the very basics (and maybe I should scratch the "all I have" because it seems that common sense is in pretty short supply these days
). As such I am willing to listen to other peoples experiences and learn in the process.Usually I like how people are treated here overall. You get your occasional ribbing and jokes are flying everywhere on behalf of others costs but generally its a friendly and informative place. Many people will make the effort and take the time to explain their points, background, share details etc. Clueless people are not ridiculed or laughed off or ignored at first sight. That might come after a lengthy process of probing and evaluating. Its pretty entertaining and once again underlines how the community surrounding Star Citizen provides more content and entertainment then the alpha itself. Most important for me is that criticism of SC and CIG is allowed and even protected (your opinion, that is...) so when criticism is standing in the open its also open to rebuttal or discussion. What I learned throughout the years in that aspect is that Star Citizen seems to be unable to refute most criticism on behalf of competence and honesty. Any number of possibilities are valid but many require increasing levels of effort and self-adjusting to make them probable (CIG gives out a date, fails, gives out another date, fails again and does so a few more times. At some point believing them makes you desperate and a victim rather then an optimist)
I realize that it can be frustrating to run into somebody who doesnt want his view changed, regardless how obvious certain things are or become during the discussion. Some are open and honest enough to eventually change their mind depending on the arguments and events unfolding. Unfortunately CIG itself is providing most of the hardest criticism even confirming certain past speculations in hindsight. After 8 years of back and forth and watching this thing you cant really claim innocence or honesty anymore when you continue to defend certain aspects of this project because doing so (already better then most AAA games....) reveals your state of mind of intention.
Its tragic if you run into a person that seems to want to be abused and deludes himself to a degree that borders on manic but these are all adults (I hope considering how much money they command.....) so you cant really "force" them. It just doesnt work. Neither does with any type of addiction. The more you push the more resistence you will encounter. Theres also the possibility that its not a tragedy but simply trolling at your expense (btw I m talking about the internet in general not specificially about this forum)
So the best you can do is to accept this and move on. Anything else is just recipee for forum moderation and toxicity when frustration spikes and minds become heated.
I have also made the decision in the past to "step up for somebodies or somethings defense" because the observable argument seemed to be pretty one-sided and unfair. By doing so I opened myself up to counter-arguments, criticism and of course hostilities but also....and thats the main point to take away....I learned quickly if my first impression was warranted or not. If I stay honest throughout the discussion with my information and intention then I ll discover whats what but of course that could also mean I was wrong.
If all I m doing is looking for validation or confirmation of my own opinion then its a waste of time to begin with.
"It takes one to recognize one" is a saying that applies here and isnt just limited to liars. If you encounter a troll or addict (applies to the real world as well) then the best thing you can do is to avoid that person and stay clear of his or her course. Various factors affect this conclusion (and internet anonymity certainly does that). Even if "poking the extremist" is your thing you can also run into the point at which the extreme overcomes your tolerance and we all know that doing so is an open invitation for hostility and toxicity and personally I dont find that very appealing or funny anymore. I ve been trolling
I ve also been blind to the truth before I hope that I managed to escape either and not get trapped in its fangs but of course I can see others who didnt manage that or are still in the process of waking up.SC fanboy toxicity is a pretty good catalyst to quicken that development. If you walk into the SC project with an innocent mind then asking the wrong questions will make you a target for unjustified cruelty and hostility. Changes can happen under these conditions of course but they are very unlikely. For the most part people react rather then continue on their intended path. I dont know how often I encountered this phenomena in EVE online when I first joined and was unaware of so many things so of course......a lot appeared to be stupid or strange. Simple questions from me asked in honest innocence quickly triggered the fanboys and trolls and I soon was defending myself against personal attacks or trying to hurt others rather then finding any answers to my original query. Once the witch hunting started (bounties and attacks in high sec) "enjoying the game" became impossible.
A lot of people, aware of SCs toxicity try to make up their own mind rather then enter any discussions beforehand so either cough up the money or wait for a free fly event and here it becomes very obvious that without constant justification, enforcment and indoctrination (all fiercly protected) the project itself offers more negatives then positives and when you start to talk to others "hope" often turns into "desperation" when the reality of the situation threatens your own world view. This forum is often judged as an "echo chamber of SC hate" or something. But personally I think its one of the best places to figure out Star Citizens true state and thats also the reason why I keep posting.
In regards to Star Citizen I have encountered the often mentioned toxicity a lot but also managed to find polite and friendly individuals along the way who hold an opposite view to my own. I wont be able to change them (I tried) and the same counts for them but I still like them and I wouldnt want to hurt or "defeat" them but of course.....CIG has different ideas. The company holds the power to prove either of us wrong at any given time. I gotta say that statements alone will not sway me anymore. Too often has CIG sweettalked its way out of a revolt in the past and hasnt come through on its promises or statements. The community has discovered too many shady things too often in hindsight for me to allow them to "change´my opinion" by mere words. Action is required and pretty good one too and to be honest I m not sure even that would be enough anymore.
I see others (previously very pro SC) going through the same change becoming increasingly cynical or even frustrated over time and I feel for them because it shows how "standing with SC" can be real work and bordering on delusion or self-deception. Its often said that this forum back in V1 was pretty optimistic and hopeful regarding SCs chances and course and its true. A lot of newcomers join the discussion in a similar state of mind. Impressed and hopeful but I never saw it survive. If it does it usually turns the person into a delusional fanatic because he or she will not listen to reason, logic or reality. After 8 years the few "defenders" the project still has appear to be so detached from reality that interacting with them is affecting me as well.
I m pretty sure Star Citizen will birth BOOKs and lots of class works but not because of the game or its course of action. If it turns out to be a scam then there will be one or two crushing articles offering evidence or logical conclusion (and IMO...that already has happened numerous times). Star Citizen rather fascinates with all the other related topics and I can easily see stuff like "how a video game managed to turn into a cult" or "my jouney into the maws of fanatiscism and back" becoming interesting to the public. Maybe some of these are already prepared as we speak or are even finished....just waiting for the prpoject to collapse or die to avoid legal consequences from CIG.
Allo...What's this 'chasing the equinox' credit on Chris' imdb and where can I pledge to ensure it gets made?
"Location Producer"
I don't know anything about film or TV - but isn't that the role where jetsetting around the world, lounging on beaches and looking at yachts to find that one perfect shot of yachts from a beach 90% of the groundwork?
I don't know anything about film or TV - but isn't that the role where jetsetting around the world, lounging on beaches and looking at yachts to find that one perfect shot of yachts from a beach 90% of the groundwork?
We have some facts fore sure. Zero Games delivered in nearly a decade. CR bought a mansion, a space door and Sandy and Erin will have a good living. And all this for delivering a buggy tech demo with some poc.we should all take a deep breath and remember that any single one of us is simply talking for the most part. We have very few precious facts in regards to Star Citizens development despite its claim of being transparent. Most of the pages are filled with personal interpretations and regardless how some people claim to be able to "see the design or intention" and link certain events and statetments in hindsight to support their own view on things none of us have definitite answers because we are not CIG, we dont work for CIG (1 exception) and we just dont know enough to make absolute statements above our own opinion. Additionally some of us have specific experience in certain areas but not all that are involved in the development of Star Citizen. All I have for example is my common sense as I have nil experience in coding, project management (apart from "managing" a relationship) or computers in general except for the very basics (and maybe I should scratch the "all I have" because it seems that common sense is in pretty short supply these days
Usually I like how people are treated here overall. You get your occasional ribbing and jokes are flying everywhere on behalf of others costs but generally its a friendly and informative place. Many people will make the effort and take the time to explain their points, background, share details etc. Clueless people are not ridiculed or laughed off or ignored at first sight. That might come after a lengthy process of probing and evaluating. Its pretty entertaining and once again underlines how the community surrounding Star Citizen provides more content and entertainment then the alpha itself. Most important for me is that criticism of SC and CIG is allowed and even protected (your opinion, that is...) so when criticism is standing in the open its also open to rebuttal or discussion. What I learned throughout the years in that aspect is that Star Citizen seems to be unable to refute most criticism on behalf of competence and honesty. Any number of possibilities are valid but many require increasing levels of effort and self-adjusting to make them probable (CIG gives out a date, fails, gives out another date, fails again and does so a few more times. At some point believing them makes you desperate and a victim rather then an optimist)
I realize that it can be frustrating to run into somebody who doesnt want his view changed, regardless how obvious certain things are or become during the discussion. Some are open and honest enough to eventually change their mind depending on the arguments and events unfolding. Unfortunately CIG itself is providing most of the hardest criticism even confirming certain past speculations in hindsight. After 8 years of back and forth and watching this thing you cant really claim innocence or honesty anymore when you continue to defend certain aspects of this project because doing so (already better then most AAA games....) reveals your state of mind of intention.
Its tragic if you run into a person that seems to want to be abused and deludes himself to a degree that borders on manic but these are all adults (I hope considering how much money they command.....) so you cant really "force" them. It just doesnt work. Neither does with any type of addiction. The more you push the more resistence you will encounter. Theres also the possibility that its not a tragedy but simply trolling at your expense (btw I m talking about the internet in general not specificially about this forum)
So the best you can do is to accept this and move on. Anything else is just recipee for forum moderation and toxicity when frustration spikes and minds become heated.
I have also made the decision in the past to "step up for somebodies or somethings defense" because the observable argument seemed to be pretty one-sided and unfair. By doing so I opened myself up to counter-arguments, criticism and of course hostilities but also....and thats the main point to take away....I learned quickly if my first impression was warranted or not. If I stay honest throughout the discussion with my information and intention then I ll discover whats what but of course that could also mean I was wrong.
If all I m doing is looking for validation or confirmation of my own opinion then its a waste of time to begin with.
"It takes one to recognize one" is a saying that applies here and isnt just limited to liars. If you encounter a troll or addict (applies to the real world as well) then the best thing you can do is to avoid that person and stay clear of his or her course. Various factors affect this conclusion (and internet anonymity certainly does that). Even if "poking the extremist" is your thing you can also run into the point at which the extreme overcomes your tolerance and we all know that doing so is an open invitation for hostility and toxicity and personally I dont find that very appealing or funny anymore. I ve been trolling
SC fanboy toxicity is a pretty good catalyst to quicken that development. If you walk into the SC project with an innocent mind then asking the wrong questions will make you a target for unjustified cruelty and hostility. Changes can happen under these conditions of course but they are very unlikely. For the most part people react rather then continue on their intended path. I dont know how often I encountered this phenomena in EVE online when I first joined and was unaware of so many things so of course......a lot appeared to be stupid or strange. Simple questions from me asked in honest innocence quickly triggered the fanboys and trolls and I soon was defending myself against personal attacks or trying to hurt others rather then finding any answers to my original query. Once the witch hunting started (bounties and attacks in high sec) "enjoying the game" became impossible.
A lot of people, aware of SCs toxicity try to make up their own mind rather then enter any discussions beforehand so either cough up the money or wait for a free fly event and here it becomes very obvious that without constant justification, enforcment and indoctrination (all fiercly protected) the project itself offers more negatives then positives and when you start to talk to others "hope" often turns into "desperation" when the reality of the situation threatens your own world view. This forum is often judged as an "echo chamber of SC hate" or something. But personally I think its one of the best places to figure out Star Citizens true state and thats also the reason why I keep posting.
In regards to Star Citizen I have encountered the often mentioned toxicity a lot but also managed to find polite and friendly individuals along the way who hold an opposite view to my own. I wont be able to change them (I tried) and the same counts for them but I still like them and I wouldnt want to hurt or "defeat" them but of course.....CIG has different ideas. The company holds the power to prove either of us wrong at any given time. I gotta say that statements alone will not sway me anymore. Too often has CIG sweettalked its way out of a revolt in the past and hasnt come through on its promises or statements. The community has discovered too many shady things too often in hindsight for me to allow them to "change´my opinion" by mere words. Action is required and pretty good one too and to be honest I m not sure even that would be enough anymore.
I see others (previously very pro SC) going through the same change becoming increasingly cynical or even frustrated over time and I feel for them because it shows how "standing with SC" can be real work and bordering on delusion or self-deception. Its often said that this forum back in V1 was pretty optimistic and hopeful regarding SCs chances and course and its true. A lot of newcomers join the discussion in a similar state of mind. Impressed and hopeful but I never saw it survive. If it does it usually turns the person into a delusional fanatic because he or she will not listen to reason, logic or reality. After 8 years the few "defenders" the project still has appear to be so detached from reality that interacting with them is affecting me as well.
I m pretty sure Star Citizen will birth BOOKs and lots of class works but not because of the game or its course of action. If it turns out to be a scam then there will be one or two crushing articles offering evidence or logical conclusion (and IMO...that already has happened numerous times). Star Citizen rather fascinates with all the other related topics and I can easily see stuff like "how a video game managed to turn into a cult" or "my jouney into the maws of fanatiscism and back" becoming interesting to the public. Maybe some of these are already prepared as we speak or are even finished....just waiting for the prpoject to collapse or die to avoid legal consequences from CIG.
"Documentary examines how ancient civilizations built iconic monuments that align with the sun on the same day."
I bet Chris will enlighten us with his archeology and architecture knowledges. And conclude planets orbiting their star isn't a reality then not fidelicious enough for his Grand Vision.
I bet Chris will enlighten us with his archeology and architecture knowledges. And conclude planets orbiting their star isn't a reality then not fidelicious enough for his Grand Vision.
Is he going to be writing the server meshing code while he's doing all that or has he completed it?
Are we still pretending to believe that Chris is in anyway involved with Star Citizen's development team on a day-to-day basis or indeed the whole thing where he took all the money because he said he had a vision?
SC is ALSO a ship sales platform...because selling ships is the main means to fund the ambitions of the project
The problem there is that the 'ambitions of the project' are to sell more ships. It's like a snake eating itself from the tail. Or maybe a dog eating its own mess.
I have to say, I don't doubt at all that in his singular mind Roberts does genuinely have a vision for what the game will eventually become. The problem is that it's utterly untempered by reality as you or I would recognise it.
1,000 years ago people who had visions were venerated and put on a pedestal. These days they're ridiculed and put on anti-psychotic medication. I think the modern approach would be more appropriate for Chris.
Dreams versus reality. Because the normal reaction based on streams and forums I ve sampled seems to be "wait for the time to elapse". Same as waking up in your pod and walking/running through the station its funny and impressive for the first or a few times but eventually you ll turn a blind eye and not even see all the effort to detail anymore. Eventually going through the chores gets annoying and if you fall victim to bugs and glitches you try to avoid throwing a hissy fit seems to be a perfectly normal reaction to me.
Watching from that corner....Star Citizen seems to be full of busy work for the most part. I can see solutions that make stuff work or might come in handy but I really dont see any design that makes me go "whoa....this is awesome". Thats really only reserved for its looks...not gameplay or features. And I can say that CIG played me for a fool in that regard as well....pulling the (beautiful) wool ovr my eyes.
The early days of Star Citizens history is full of examples with hopeful and optimistic people imagining gameplay or thinking of possibilities...it all had so much potential. In 2020 it looks like Chris Roberts was one of those people himself. He never had a clue what was possible or not and the projects history itself protrays that very clearly in hindsight.
I dont think anybody is particularly fond of the prison gameplay. Its generally seen as pure punishment and apart from some extreme cases I dont know anybody who willingly goes in or "tests" it anymore. So while it can be immersive and great to dream up scenarios where your whole org or friends rush to your rescue because you ended up innocently in the prison its more probable that nobody would bat an eye, give you directions how to cheese your way out or laugh at you. I ve never seen the prison feature as a major gameplay loop to be honest. It was supposed to be a proof of concept opening up other venues, marking the beginning of "real consequences" for wrongdoing etc. But prison gameplay has been introduced how many months ago? Since then....what other features building on that stepping stone have been implemented or worked on? Like so many things within Star Citizen the prison has given CIG some more time but it didnt help to re-establish consumer confidence or trust into the companies capabilities...at least not for me.
If you wonder why people ask you these questions its probably because you appear to have a lot of answers to them so I think its great you confirm the fact from tó time that you have exactly as much proof, evicence or answers as the rest of us
Typo? Your argument leads to the conclusion that SCs design and CIGs capabilities are the restraining factors. Not the community itself.
Even the fuel rats are exceptional people within EDs community and they ve been a surprise to the game as a whole. But they established themselves despite ridicule, exploitation and griefing and I dare to say the same would be possible within Star Citizens community. All atruistic people appear to be selfless but they are not. At its core such people do things because they enjoy doing them and of course they are perfect victims for abuse or exploitation because of it. In regards to fuel rats I dont think members think "oh no, this innocent poor guy has misjudged his capabilities and is facing death, its my duty to help him" even tho thats the headline and overall propaganda which comes to mind right? Why not think "darn, another dumb fud who didnt know jack crap about the game ended up in a bad place and whines about it" and tell them to die instead? Death in ED is pretty much non-consequential and even if it is of consequence (loss of ship without insurance) the normal reply is "you should ve known" or "never fly without insurance".
EDs fuel rat faction survives and continues because the gameplay loop involving its task is rewarding and entertaining itself. I m sure fuel rats rather help people who are thankful and glad about the help rather then being taken for granted or helping people who didnt put in the effort to avoid their misery in the first place, And thats a stark contrast to Star Citizen which only offers the same under very distinct conditions. Fuel ratting requires knowledge, experience, equipment, preperation and skill. Fuel rats offer these things for free or for a small cost but its always effort thats provided because people enjoy the activity. So "helping others" really is not the priority here. I dont think I ever could be a fuel rat but I certainly understand the underlying factors that allows enjoyment for others. I admit I struggle to do the same for a lot of SC claims or hope.
Coming back to SC people stating "I enjoy mining or running over barren landscapes" is A) valid and B) happens anyway because these people really do enjoy it (when possible I also go to mining myself and I can enjoy beautiful vistas in games but neither is fullfillinw or rewarding if its not tied to a bigger or more complex system. EVEs mining offers progression and complexity. Avorions mining offers progression but is overall less impressive in detail as EVE. Mining in Star Citizen offers progression (aquiring mining capable ships and gear) and exploration but at the same time remains in its basic state of implementation for so long without meaningful change or advancement that it becomes a point of criticism rather then praise.
And these people will continue doing it without others permission or acceptance. But it always triggers a question or interest to figure out why they do. Fuel rats were examined in this regard same as the SC screenshotters. And they have provided conclusive answers to that question putting it to rest. And that explanation is what sets them apart because in one case you have fleshed out and complete gameloops interacting or coming together to allow a result in short.....quality gameplay and design. The other doesnt and only allow conclusions about the person doing it.
Thats why the statement "I m having fun ̶p̶̶l̶̶a̶̶y̶̶i̶̶n̶̶g̶ testing Star Citizen" is perfectly fine and valid. But the reason for that is the interesting and revealing part. So when others query with "why" upon such a statement its not an attenpt to disallow enjoyment (a common misconception it seems) but in order to find out what the game has to offer to make it so. Others might very likely see things you are blind to...or maybe....the person making that statement is unaware of things you know so an exchange is potentially rewarding for both.
And often enough somebody making that statement has no answer. So "why" is also a way to figure out the persons intentions. The fact is never challenged (funny how so many get the impression that they are not "allowed" ´to have fun) but of course the answer might be a little ridiculous or leaving you in a spot that you realize is pretty weak so no wonder many refuse to answer truthfully (it seems) or beome offensive qhen questioned.
It sounds like you want to contracit my statement but essentially we are on the same page?
Sticking to the Fuel Rats thing since it's something I know a bit about...I have my doubts that the Star Citizen community by way of it's org dominated focus.. outside of and despite the mostly casual player base... would support or even understand Fuel Rats or the reasoning behind them. The Fuel Rats would be just another minority org among many thousands of no name orgs...besides having no actual gameplay mechanic to support their basic function of course...Dreams versus reality. Because the normal reaction based on streams and forums I ve sampled seems to be "wait for the time to elapse". Same as waking up in your pod and walking/running through the station its funny and impressive for the first or a few times but eventually you ll turn a blind eye and not even see all the effort to detail anymore. Eventually going through the chores gets annoying and if you fall victim to bugs and glitches you try to avoid throwing a hissy fit seems to be a perfectly normal reaction to me.
Watching from that corner....Star Citizen seems to be full of busy work for the most part. I can see solutions that make stuff work or might come in handy but I really dont see any design that makes me go "whoa....this is awesome". Thats really only reserved for its looks...not gameplay or features. And I can say that CIG played me for a fool in that regard as well....pulling the (beautiful) wool ovr my eyes.
The early days of Star Citizens history is full of examples with hopeful and optimistic people imagining gameplay or thinking of possibilities...it all had so much potential. In 2020 it looks like Chris Roberts was one of those people himself. He never had a clue what was possible or not and the projects history itself protrays that very clearly in hindsight.
I dont think anybody is particularly fond of the prison gameplay. Its generally seen as pure punishment and apart from some extreme cases I dont know anybody who willingly goes in or "tests" it anymore. So while it can be immersive and great to dream up scenarios where your whole org or friends rush to your rescue because you ended up innocently in the prison its more probable that nobody would bat an eye, give you directions how to cheese your way out or laugh at you. I ve never seen the prison feature as a major gameplay loop to be honest. It was supposed to be a proof of concept opening up other venues, marking the beginning of "real consequences" for wrongdoing etc. But prison gameplay has been introduced how many months ago? Since then....what other features building on that stepping stone have been implemented or worked on? Like so many things within Star Citizen the prison has given CIG some more time but it didnt help to re-establish consumer confidence or trust into the companies capabilities...at least not for me.
If you wonder why people ask you these questions its probably because you appear to have a lot of answers to them so I think its great you confirm the fact from tó time that you have exactly as much proof, evicence or answers as the rest of us
Typo? Your argument leads to the conclusion that SCs design and CIGs capabilities are the restraining factors. Not the community itself.
Even the fuel rats are exceptional people within EDs community and they ve been a surprise to the game as a whole. But they established themselves despite ridicule, exploitation and griefing and I dare to say the same would be possible within Star Citizens community. All atruistic people appear to be selfless but they are not. At its core such people do things because they enjoy doing them and of course they are perfect victims for abuse or exploitation because of it. In regards to fuel rats I dont think members think "oh no, this innocent poor guy has misjudged his capabilities and is facing death, its my duty to help him" even tho thats the headline and overall propaganda which comes to mind right? Why not think "darn, another dumb fud who didnt know jack crap about the game ended up in a bad place and whines about it" and tell them to die instead? Death in ED is pretty much non-consequential and even if it is of consequence (loss of ship without insurance) the normal reply is "you should ve known" or "never fly without insurance".
EDs fuel rat faction survives and continues because the gameplay loop involving its task is rewarding and entertaining itself. I m sure fuel rats rather help people who are thankful and glad about the help rather then being taken for granted or helping people who didnt put in the effort to avoid their misery in the first place, And thats a stark contrast to Star Citizen which only offers the same under very distinct conditions. Fuel ratting requires knowledge, experience, equipment, preperation and skill. Fuel rats offer these things for free or for a small cost but its always effort thats provided because people enjoy the activity. So "helping others" really is not the priority here. I dont think I ever could be a fuel rat but I certainly understand the underlying factors that allows enjoyment for others. I admit I struggle to do the same for a lot of SC claims or hope.
Coming back to SC people stating "I enjoy mining or running over barren landscapes" is A) valid and B) happens anyway because these people really do enjoy it (when possible I also go to mining myself and I can enjoy beautiful vistas in games but neither is fullfillinw or rewarding if its not tied to a bigger or more complex system. EVEs mining offers progression and complexity. Avorions mining offers progression but is overall less impressive in detail as EVE. Mining in Star Citizen offers progression (aquiring mining capable ships and gear) and exploration but at the same time remains in its basic state of implementation for so long without meaningful change or advancement that it becomes a point of criticism rather then praise.
And these people will continue doing it without others permission or acceptance. But it always triggers a question or interest to figure out why they do. Fuel rats were examined in this regard same as the SC screenshotters. And they have provided conclusive answers to that question putting it to rest. And that explanation is what sets them apart because in one case you have fleshed out and complete gameloops interacting or coming together to allow a result in short.....quality gameplay and design. The other doesnt and only allow conclusions about the person doing it.
Thats why the statement "I m having fun ̶p̶̶l̶̶a̶̶y̶̶i̶̶n̶̶g̶ testing Star Citizen" is perfectly fine and valid. But the reason for that is the interesting and revealing part. So when others query with "why" upon such a statement its not an attenpt to disallow enjoyment (a common misconception it seems) but in order to find out what the game has to offer to make it so. Others might very likely see things you are blind to...or maybe....the person making that statement is unaware of things you know so an exchange is potentially rewarding for both.
And often enough somebody making that statement has no answer. So "why" is also a way to figure out the persons intentions. The fact is never challenged (funny how so many get the impression that they are not "allowed" ´to have fun) but of course the answer might be a little ridiculous or leaving you in a spot that you realize is pretty weak so no wonder many refuse to answer truthfully (it seems) or beome offensive qhen questioned.
It sounds like you want to contracit my statement but essentially we are on the same page?
Star Citizen isn't at all like Elite with a generally supportive and immersed community...more like Eve with cockpits mixed with Fortnite minus the gameplay from either of them
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And to be honest it would be the responsibility of the people supporting or empowering him to control the outcome. When Chris Robert is given free reign, no limitations and hardly any oversight sitting back stating "lets wait what he makes of it" despite clear signs of mismanagement or incompetence I m not sure he can be blamed alone anymore or the people doing it have any right for judgement. When I tell my nephew to not do anything specific and then watch him like a hawk because I know he doesnt understand so I can punish him the moment he breaks my earlier restriction then its not only my fault in part but I m also a horrible person setting him for up for failure so I can dish out punishment. If I know I cant change something (his understanding) then my goal should be to reduce the potential for self-harm or injury but allow for learning and growing on his part.
CIG has been given the chance for growth and success. People who point out irregularities or stick to the ugly facts of the project are actually the ones who try to limit the fallout....like an investor would do in any other game development. Stepping in trying to close the gushing wound bleeding resources all over the place. Publishers get blamed for a games shortcomings but people forget all too willingly that they didnt made the game or restricted it by intention. A publisher wants the developer to do as he said he would do. Its that original intention that makes him provide and entrust millions and years of time. Its just that after a sufficient time of chance and waiting when the developer in question has failed to come through on his end of his promises the publisher/investor will enact his powers to limit the damage as much as he can.
Star Citizens debacle only proves how powerless the providing people really are in all this. And even when damage and mismanagement is crystal clear theres nothing that can be done about it. And when I see people who rather blame themselves or other powerless people for it I am instantly reminded of fanatical believers who protect their faith at all cost, punishing themselves and others instead of holding the reason accountable.
Sticking to the Fuel Rats thing...I have my doubts that the Star Citizen community by the way of it's mainly org dominated focus.. outside of the mostly casual player base... would support or even understand Fuel Rats or the reasoning behind them. The Fuel Rats would be just another minority org among many thousands of no name orgs...besides having no actual gameplay mechanic to support their basic function of course
Star Citizen isn't at all like Elite with a generally supportive and immersed community...more like Eve with cockpits mixed with Fortnite.
Yes but ED didnt start out that way either. And I doubt the developers had something like the Fuel Rat organization in mind when they designed the refuling mechanic (so fuel ratting is actually emergent gameplay). The number of fuel rats within EDs community compared to its total playerbase or orgs is miniscul but everybody heard about them. Thats because what they do (even tho not appealing to most) is pretty impressive on its own. Star Citizens community has the same potential.....given the chance that it will develop the connected mechanics and features. It doesnt matter that "most" wouldnt do it or support it. If a few do and stick to it then they could become the very same.
That Star Citizens current state doesnt support it yet and all hints point to it being impossible doesnt change it.
Basically the people who currently enjoy Star Citizen in its barebone form are essentially fuel rats you know
Doing something the broad majority doesnt understand and doesnt do ^^And 1,000 years ago scientists were nailed to the stake for claiming Earth is round...
Maybe people are a little more educated now? Not all though, it seems
Actually during beta we had a "call for help" button.
And 1,000 years ago scientists were nailed to the stake for claiming Earth is round...
Maybe people are a little more educated now? Not all though, it seems
2016 and 2020 respectively have driven the brutal and cruel fact home for me that human advancement and civility is an illusion. People mask it better due to regulations and rules (which again were put in place to avoid mass murder or violence on a grand scale both logical consequences when you cram lots of people into a small space nd earth has become pretty crammed by now) but overall the average human is dumb, violent and pretty harsh in how he treats others or inferior beings. Exceptions stand out as noble or "good" but if you take the norm its pretty crushing. Doesnt look like humanity as a whole has gone all that far. Probably because it dragged all the scum along on its way,
It still remains my most prized virtual possession...the Fuel Rats official ship badge. Simply because you can't buy one in the FDev store. All the bought ships in Star Citizen pale to insignificance in comparison since seeing any ship in game, no matter how big or fancy schmancy it may be...someone didn't earn it, they merely paid cash for it.
I didnt know that ^^
But apart from design support given by the devs is that really an argument against my own point? Star Citizen has been reported as a supportive and friendly environment. Just ask and people will help with knowledge, money, ships etc. SC doesnt have a button but the people within in are willing to help for no compensation so fuel rats in SC sound perfectly possible given that the alpha will progress enough to make it a reality yes?
It still remains my most prized virtual possession...the Fuel Rats official ship badge. Simply because you can't buy one in the FDev store. All the bought ships in Star Citizen pale to insignificance in comparison since seeing any ship in game, no matter how big or fancy schmancy it may be...someone didn't earn it, they merely paid cash for it.
Perceived achievements or results for hard work usually stand out. Thats why grinding is a thing in video games these days or parents being proud ^^
edit: couldnt resist ^^
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I'd agree to a certain point that the SC community are helpful...not so much in recent times as perhaps in the past, but the level of support for newbies is still there. I meant supportive in the sense of supporting the project, not monetarily but immersively...perhaps I didn't make that clear. Orgs help themselves...the casual players treat SC like any other short term pewfest...most of both player types are combatitive or competitive in nature.
That mentality certainly isn't different from Elite in any significant way except that no-one seems to want to break the mould, added to that is the aforementioned lack of gameplay mechanics that offer the opportunity to do so. Star Citizen is increasingly becoming solely combat focused...mainly since there's nothing else to do that is engaging for general or casual players either in the short or long term...Mining and bulk Trading are locked behind a prohibitive pay wall...leaving what else?
There's absolutely no sense of achievement in Star Citizen...neither earning aUEC, in game ship purchases nor even individual personal armour...everything of any note can and has been bought for cash. The few individual items that can only be bought with aUEC are so insignificant that they're completely meaningless. Ci¬G have purposely made it a showcase of show-offs parading their virtual wealth in real terms by visually flaunting the amount of cash they've personally thrown into the ever burning fires of Star Citizen development.
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