Stellar forge 'fixed' to the point of broken

[Nutter]

I'm a little upset at this and my hunger for exploration just took a knock.

Whilst fixing bugs like the beige plague makes total sense. Thank you for that FDev (Although you did break it in the first place) Great job fixed now and we are happy we got a realistic view in the forge again. [up][big grin]

What did not need fixing and is NOT a BUG are the crazy things that happen in real life such as...

Planets/moons colliding
Planets/moons orbiting through a star
Planets/moons intersecting with other objects
Planets/Moons intersecting with parent ring systems

Yep, these things happen and our own planet earth is a perfect example, it's how we got the moon you know!

So can someone please tell me why you (FDev) in Patch 2.2 decided to 'break' the universe as we know it and continue to break it with each release?

A few examples....

“Fix ring fog from being being lit in black hole systems” = Rings are now BLACK and core does not light them

“Have a hard cap in the noise graph for max geometry height, to prevent planets you can fly through or from being able to drive into space” = No more fun worlds or crazy craters to discover

"Check spin rates for neutron stars and black holes are something more sensible" = Really, what is a sensible speed for the universe?

"Fix issues with close orbiting bodies with large eccentricities intersecting their parent star" = Oh how Dull - Physics broken again

"Fix an issue when generating a system when a highly eccentric orbit goes outside the hillsphere of its parent, we will now reduce the eccentricity to fit inside the hillsphere" = Oh how Dull - Physics broken again

"When checking for moon-ring intersection, need to account for any objects orbiting the moon so that they don't intersect at any point in their orbit" = Speachless? Why? Physics?

"Ring around Archerbas in the Carthage system no longer intersects the planet"

And why fix worlds collide? Sorry I mean worlds get close?[mad]


Source: - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...s-2-2-update?p=4674791&viewfull=1#post4674791

So we are left with a DULL plain unexciting emersion breaking utopia universe - Very sad at this point.. I had to do a lot of digging to find out why my favourite systems are all broken.. or 'fixed' as you put it. Also sad knowing you cannot ever hope to discover anything like the above again.

 

[Bortas]

Planets/moons colliding
Planets/moons orbiting through a star
Planets/moons intersecting with other objects
Planets/Moons intersecting with parent ring systems

Yep, these things happen and our own planet earth is a perfect example, it's how we got the moon you know!

Sure, these things happen in reality, but the game engine can't simulate them.

- Colliding planets/moons in reality would be pretty spectacular, result in a huge explosion probably ripping apart one or both of the bodies. In the game however they are just 2 planets clipping into each other.
- Planets/moons orbiting through a star, would be vaporized/ripped apart in reality. In the game, they are - again - just 2 bodies clipping into each other
- Plantes/moons intersecting with ring systens would destroy the ring. A massive body inside a ring would basically suck up the ring material. A massive body getting close to a ring would probably look spectacular in reality, but in the game nothing happes and it just looks weird.

So if the game engine can't simulate certain edge cases, it's better not to have them at all instead of some weird looking crap, IMHO.

 

[GreyAreaUK]

Planets/moons orbiting through a star

Um...that doesn't happen in real life. At least not more than once per object

 

[babelfisch]

I agree that it would be awesome to have colliding objects. But only if we also see the impact, explosion, generation of smaller new bodies, dust clouds, etc. That's asking for too much in my opinion though. So we can either have it 'fixed' or objects clip through each other without something happening, which is worse.
Also, these events would be pretty rare, most of the time nobody would be present to observe it. So while I agree that it would be great, it also seems to be quite a lot of effort.

 

[Burke]

Pretty much agree with OP tbh. I wouldnt say its 100% correct but close enough.

babelfisch yeah the clipping was ugly but it was something to find. I dont think it actually bothered anybody and if it happened far from the bubble, who cares?

 

[GormDeGamle]

(...) not more than once per object (...)

This!
Chances would be very low for you to acutally be there to witness the moment of colission...
Afterwards you would only see the effects of the events (more rings, new moons...)

 

[Burke]

A more inventive and explorer friendly fix would have been to hand place "collision systems" perhaps with their own backdrops, it could be static SAG A* could use one aswell. All the debris and rocks and dust you could ever want and people would have been like "wow"

 

[Nutter]

Thank you for your responses and I was expecting the common feedback that the engine can't show destruction and birth. But think a little further ahead of the game....

Now that FDev have broken the universe and these things cannot happen because they are 'fixed' you can wave goodbye to EVER seeing this interaction being developed. If worlds can't collide then there is no need to create these 'effects'. If rings can't intersect then that will save some more dev time right?

I know that if a planet hits a star it's a one time moment in reality but I'm happier having fun with these objects even if there are no GFX to go with them.

So before this gets fixed.... enjoy, glad I captured it before the 'fix'

[video=youtube_share;8QJqiV_p1ow]https://youtu.be/8QJqiV_p1ow[/video]

 

[Deleted member 38366]

I think the main issue is that Stellar Forge only ever generated those sterile, generic and usually boring perfect Systems. Seen a few hundred, you've seen them all.

There's almost no such thing as true outliers or really interesting Systems. Bugs were often the one single quirk that were able to give places something interesting.

- no System entry emergency-dumps you straight into normal space, where Collision alarms scream and you find your Ship in a chaotic dense field of huge planetary debris
- there's no Proto Systems, just nice and perfect Tauris with already perfectly formed Planets (like that could ever happen within a few Million years lol)
- there's no exotic Objects causing gravitational havoc to Systems and their Orbits
- there's no events inside Systems, no Asteroids crashing into Planets, no Meteor showers lighting up atmospheres, no Gamma bursts that fried some Planets, no Supernova, no collapsing Stars... nothing
- there's no Systems that nearly got torn apart because a rogue Black Hole traversed through it

Frankly, I expected a re-run and extension of Stellar Forge to fill all those blanks to some extent in the Beyond 3.3 Update.
Was very surprised that one of the weakest parts of Exploration wasn't even addressed.

 

[Bortas]

Now that FDev have broken the universe and these things cannot happen because they are 'fixed' you can wave goodbye to EVER seeing this interaction being developed. If worlds can't collide then there is no need to create these 'effects'. If rings can't intersect then that will save some more dev time right?

Sure, but tbh such events would be incredibly rare and very unlikely to happen in the exact moment when somebody is around to see them. All the "colliding" planets and stuff you have seen in the past could well have happened a billion years ago and nothing would have even been there to see, if the game engine could simulate them. Rings with intersecting moons would simply not exist, stars which have been "hit" by a planet would simply have a ring and so on.

I doubt it would be a good idea to "waste" valuable dev time to implement such complex things when the chances that anyone ever even sees them are so low.

 

[Nutter]

Sure, but tbh such events would be incredibly rare and very unlikely to happen in the exact moment when somebody is around to see them. All the "colliding" planets and stuff you have seen in the past could well have happened a billion years ago and nothing would have even been there to see, if the game engine could simulate them. Rings with intersecting moons would simply not exist, stars which have been "hit" by a planet would simply have a ring and so on.

I doubt it would be a good idea to "waste" valuable dev time to implement such complex things when the chances that anyone ever even sees them are so low.

Ah so we won't be encountering the aftermath either then? Just clean dull repeating perfect systems - Oh Joy!

 

[Bortas]

Ah so we won't be encountering the aftermath either then? Just clean dull repeating perfect systems - Oh Joy!

We do... As I said, stars with rings do exist... that could be the aftermath of a planet, which has been ripped to pieces in the past
Belt Clusters could be aftermaths of colliding planets
Ringless Planets with moons could be planets which had their original ring eradicated by one of their moons

and so on. What ecactly would you expect to encounter?

 

[Jukelo]

The stellar force cannot (currently) represent transient events, so yes all of these supposedly cataclysmic events are silly to watch when all that's happening is two objects clipping into each other.
As an explorer I find these things silly and they need to be fixed until Frontier can properly handle these edge cases (if ever, it would require a lot of work to add manual overrides on top of the procgen stuff to detect and handle collision).

 

[varonica]

- no System entry emergency-dumps you straight into normal space, where Collision alarms scream and you find your Ship in a chaotic dense field of huge planetary debris

Ah the old days, I remember them well when you could jump into a binary system and be roasted from both sides and frantically try and escape because your heat warning immediately jumped into the red, there were sparks everywhere and if you made a wrong decision you were toast, literally, then the complaints rolled in and FDEV tweaked it so you would jump into those systems outside the binary pair. I haven't have a stellar heat warning in hundreds of thousands of light years.

You do realise if they did introduce that scenario within a month we would dropping safely outside the debris field due to complaints over lost ships. Personally I think they should make dangerous systems and post a warning before you jump, "Warning hazardous system ahead, press hyperspace again to jump anyway." And I'm not talking about minor danger, I'm talking about needing engineered shields, heat sinks, the works so you would have to build a special dangerous systems exploration ship just to go there, then they fill it with really nice stuff so people willing to take the risk get the rewards. Just dreaming I guess, I sympathise with the OP, but think the clipping thing was correctly fixed.

 

[thistle]

Frontier fixed some bugs with the galaxy.

Well done, I say.

 

[babelfisch]

babelfisch yeah the clipping was ugly but it was something to find. I dont think it actually bothered anybody and if it happened far from the bubble, who cares?

How about everyone who cares for a realistic representation of the galaxy?

 

[GreyAreaUK]

How about everyone who cares for a realistic representation of the galaxy?

Two words: Mitterand Hollow

I think the galaxy is big enough for a few hand-crafted 'oddities'. Plus there's plenty of things that would be realistic, such as two rocky worlds orbiting close enough for Roche Limits to be tearing them apart, leading to a single, shared ring system. That would be cool.

 

[babelfisch]

Two words: Mitterand Hollow

I think the galaxy is big enough for a few hand-crafted 'oddities'. Plus there's plenty of things that would be realistic, such as two rocky worlds orbiting close enough for Roche Limits to be tearing them apart, leading to a single, shared ring system. That would be cool.

Yes, but the topic was a planet clipping through a star, without anything happening. If you want to keep that in game, fine. I don't.

 

[GreyAreaUK]

Yes, but the topic was a planet clipping through a star, without anything happening. If you want to keep that in game, fine. I don't.

I get that, but MH shouldn't exist - it should have been torn apart eons ago. It was kept in as a deliberate decision by Frontier.

To be clear, I'm definitely against blatantly non-sensical stuff (two sets of rings orbiting in different planes around the same body, for example), but there's room for improvement in plausibly cool stuff.

 

[babelfisch]

I get that, but MH shouldn't exist - it should have been torn apart eons ago. It was kept in as a deliberate decision by Frontier.

To be clear, I'm definitely against blatantly non-sensical stuff (two sets of rings orbiting in different planes around the same body, for example), but there's room for improvement in plausibly cool stuff.

Sure, I never argued against that.