From the person who has only had 1 idea since 2016.
Even I posted a list of 6 ideas.
Come on Elsa, let it go.
Modes [Suggestion] How to incentivise open play and make it relevant
- Thread starter Lateralus
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From the person who has only had 1 idea since 2016.
Even I posted a list of 6 ideas.
Come on Elsa, let it go.
WorldsGreatestForumDad
Banned
I dont want anyone to be angry though to be honest. I want a balanced game to play. Thats it. And right now its not. And because of the imbalances that heavily reward solo and private modes. None of the multiplayer aspects of the game are truly working as intended. 1 month jump around with powerplay for modules.
People not caring about their BGS systems because there is no interaction. Our group knows it quite well though
. But we really just keep things smooth running. We dont attack people because whats the point. Where is the game play? Killing and trading? The first thing you did to start the game?Give the multiplayer mode the multiplayer experience. Give solo mode the narrative and personal growth, because like people said. They are playing for themselves. Now I dont think any of you here that I've been talking to have attacked another player faction and I can see why these changes would screw with you.
However, if you guys have your own little area's in space you are working on. Then you could go into open and never see anyone. Like ever. And still work on your stuff. Just dont go around CG's or whatever. And you will be fine.
Anyways, the game needs to grow. And the multiplayer part of this game is in major need of help. Everyone is going to take the least possible resistance to accomplish a goal. Its human nature. But the devs have the power to change this. And give the game its multiplayer features, which they clearly WANT WORKING.
Listen no one that creates a game says, Im going to put this in but I dont want it to work. Hmm whats holding these features back? Ahhh yes, the same influence across all modes. What comes next after that?
C H A N G E S
You missed a perfect Ziggy quote opportunity there
I do feel however, that you don't understand how many other people play the game. Multiplayer is fine and all, but it's not the be all and end all - especially when the experience is poor not just because you've got lulzbunnies blowing up everything for lulz, but some of those lulzbunnies are on connections so poor you almost feel sorry enough for them to buy them an ISP upgrade yourself.
Also, many players want no involvement from other players at all, interacting with AI is more interesting because it's AI.
That's why the modes work so well. They keep everybody happy, apart from those demanding everyone be in Open.
I do feel however, that you don't understand how many other people play the game. Multiplayer is fine and all, but it's not the be all and end all - especially when the experience is poor not just because you've got lulzbunnies blowing up everything for lulz, but some of those lulzbunnies are on connections so poor you almost feel sorry enough for them to buy them an ISP upgrade yourself.
Also, many players want no involvement from other players at all, interacting with AI is more interesting because it's AI.
That's why the modes work so well. They keep everybody happy, apart from those demanding everyone be in Open.
WorldsGreatestForumDad
Banned
You missed a perfect Ziggy quote opportunity there
I do feel however, that you don't understand how many other people play the game. Multiplayer is fine and all, but it's not the be all and end all - especially when the experience is poor not just because you've got lulzbunnies blowing up everything for lulz, but some of those lulzbunnies are on connections so poor you almost feel sorry enough for them to buy them an ISP upgrade yourself.
Also, many players want no involvement from other players at all, interacting with AI is more interesting because it's AI.
That's why the modes work so well. They keep everybody happy, apart from those demanding everyone be in Open.
Exactly. So remove them from effecting any multiplayer experience. Give them personal growth and narrative. So they get the solo experience. If they want to effect the BGS. Do it in open as it effects everyone else. No multiplayer, or multiplayer. You cant have both. Because it puts the people in Open at a disadvantage. Its not all about PEW PEW PEW. Its a lot more than that. Its about gameplay. And getting some of the things to actually turn. instead of sitting stagnant like we are now.
If all this was working like I and MANY others say it should be. Then no one would be upset because of this thargoid stuff. Because we'd have things to do. People wouldnt be leaving or waiting for the game to get better before they buy it. They specifically want these changes. Not a week goes by that I see someone new say this stuff. Or on my stream, or in a discord. Its everywhere.
Get off these forums and go look. Ya'll talk about hiveminds? This is the biggest one. And its full of the same people every time.
Good news is. Fdev have been pulling feedback from more than just these forums now. They are in discords, they are in streams and they are on reddit.
Trust me when I tell you guys this. They hear the same thing im saying from multiple people every day. And its different people.
The only people trying to fight it. Are the same group of people here thats been fighting it for how long now?
We need the change for the game to continue to grow. A change like this is better for everyone involved. Including the Solo player, because if they arent effecting another player faction. Then literally everything stays the same. You get the credits, you get the missions and the NPC's. Personal growth for SOLO play thats it. Thats why you're there. If you were there for the multiplayer experience. People would be in open.
So back to OP here. Open needs to have meaning. Because right now, there is no reason to risk anything vs someone else. When you can accomplish the same goals elsewhere. Even objectives.
And that my friends is very very unbalanced. And is the root of all problems as to why things dont work as they intended. And trust me they want them to work. So they will do whatever it takes to make that happen. And at last resort, if that means changing the game. They will. Its the only thing holding this game back from taking off.
Who knows maybe thats their wildcard for later when competition finally arises.
FD are also the only ones who actually know how many people choose to play in what mode. They don't need to guess.
While they would indeed like to see more players in open, because they think it would be more fun (they have said that, it's not a secret), I suspect they respect that there are enough players who have no interest in it, but who are still their customers, and they want them to keep playing.
Yes, they want to encourage open play, but I really doubt that they will do it in a way that risks alienating players who don't want it. If they knew that those players were such a minority as you seem to think, I suspect you'd have seen significant changes already.
WorldsGreatestForumDad
Banned
You just need to Git Gud
Already am
I wouldnt be here without the evidence or experience.
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WorldsGreatestForumDad
Banned
Again, play in solo and dont worry about it. People have that option. However you dont have the option to opt out of a BGS attack. My main point in which is why everything is borked and not being used like Powerplay and BGS.
You dang right they know. they dont leave hotel california threads going for 5 years. And you dont create a megathread without the topic coming up over and over.
pretty much speaks for itself. Just like the community is doing everywhere. About these same topics. Dont think for 2 seconds they wont fix it. Doesn't matter what any dev has said in the past. Things change as games grow. And this feature alone is holding back multiplayer gameplay. Just wait until the guilds come out. Watch what happens.
CQC and Multipew Mk II
Is there cheesecake?
I leave for a bit and come back to the mega-thread being locked. What is this heresy?!
So is this the reincarnated S/PG/O thread? I hope so, because I had a lot of fun reading everyone's opinions on the matter while tossing mine in every now and then.
Now, excuse me while I retreat for an undetermined amount of time to read through this thread and chuckle at some of these posts.
So is this the reincarnated S/PG/O thread? I hope so, because I had a lot of fun reading everyone's opinions on the matter while tossing mine in every now and then.
Now, excuse me while I retreat for an undetermined amount of time to read through this thread and chuckle at some of these posts.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
How did you work that out? Remembering the 90 / 9 / 1 "rule" of forum registration / participation and the fact that ownership of the game is not a requirement when creating a forum / reddit account.
Balancing - an interesting term indeed.
Removing large swathes of the game from players in two of the three game modes is not balancing - it's putting that content behind a direct PvP barrier.
Whether Frontier choose to do so, in a game that has entirely optional direct PvP, remains to be seen, especially as Frontier would seem to be well aware that the majority of players do not get involved in direct PvP and also given that the design of the game consciously has every player affecting and experiencing the single shared galaxy state (i.e. indirect PvP).
Fundamental decisions were made before the game was even pitched, i.e. players can choose to play without other players; players can choose to play with select other players; all players experience and affect the single shared galaxy state. It remains to be seen whether Frontier will revisit any of these decisions after over five years - especially as console players (who also affect the single shared galaxy state) without premium platform access can only play in Solo.
Removing access to content from a significant proportion of the player-base would not seem, in my opinion, to be a risk free decision (and putting existing content behind a direct PvP barrier is effectively removing it from those players that eschew direct PvP in a game which has, up to now, no requirement whatsoever for direct PvP).
Adding content specifically for players that prefer direct PvP would seem to be a course of action with significantly less risk, again in my opinion. However, the last time that Frontier did that it didn't attract much in way of players (acknowledging that it had no effect on the BGS, ships and loadouts were extremely limited and it was consequence free [apart from K/D ratio, of course]).
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Actually, the same few folks kept making new threads (but wording the title a bit differently or pretending they have something new to add) and the mods got fed up with the mess it was making. So they started merging the duplicates being made into one big thread.
That is how we got the mega threads, because half a dozen PvP'ers were trying to flood the forums with threads and manufacture their own "proof" that the mode system was not popular. (bit like your Reddit comments and how you're trying to manufacture proof from one sub Reddit or your "lots of players" comment and pointing to 273 comments)
It didn't work. Our Mods are too smart to fall for basic forum tricks.
And if anyone wants to check what I've said is true - go flick through the mega threads and look for all the sub headings in them.
Note who kept making them (as in guild / clan affiliations) - or it's weird accounts that were less than 24 hours old at the time of posting (also why I think game keys should be needed to register forum accounts).
You missed a perfect Ziggy quote opportunity there
I do feel however, that you don't understand how many other people play the game. Multiplayer is fine and all, but it's not the be all and end all - especially when the experience is poor not just because you've got lulzbunnies blowing up everything for lulz, but some of those lulzbunnies are on connections so poor you almost feel sorry enough for them to buy them an ISP upgrade yourself.
Also, many players want no involvement from other players at all, interacting with AI is more interesting because it's AI.
That's why the modes work so well. They keep everybody happy, apart from those demanding everyone be in Open.
Nobody is seriously suggesting everybody plays in OPEN don't be ridiculous. The question is how to incentivize open and make it relevant? Clearly SOLO can be used to circumvent player interactions in PG's aswell as OPEN. Where game mechanics are clearly designed for PvP (i.e. PP) this a clearly exploit. Where player based factions have been created, affecting the BGS that is detrimental to that player faction, should be done in a OPEN where both sides can contest it, in terms of PvP. This is not about limiting SOLO or PG's, it is about balancing OPEN! Griefing might be a problem in the game but nothing that can't be sorted out with a good C&P system.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
The OP proposes removing content from the other two modes.
An exploit is an unintended consequence - PowerPlay was consciously implemented for all players, in all game modes. The same with player Factions - they are simply NPC factions added to the game with name, lore and location determined by a player Group.
Not all player Factions are PvP player Factions - to suggest that player Factions can only be affected in Open is to force all player groups that have a Faction in game to play in Open to affect their Faction, even if they are PvE player groups.
The fact that all players affecting the BGS, PowerPlay, Factions, etc. is considered an exploit by players that wish to oppose players using direct PvP is understandable if the game had had any requirement to engage in direct PvP - however this game does not require any players to engage in direct PvP in any gameplay feature.
The proposals for "balancing" Open involve removing content from, i.e. limiting, Solo and Private Groups.
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For the fun of it, let's assume you run a PBF and want to control a system. Your group spends hours patrolling around in Open and pulling everyone not in your group, giving them textwalls of roleplay banter before sending them on their way or blowing them up. You love your PBF, and are proud of it's achievements in the BGS that you have spent a lot of time working on, and the investment in juicy PC hardware that makes it such an enjoyable gaming experience for you.
Another PBF has never heard of you and your faction, and just so happens to have an interest in the system that you love so dearly. They play PVE exclusively because that is what is more fun for them, but they play in Open for the opportunity to meet new players. They spend their time purely helping their faction, not bothering with players as they read up a bit on how the BGS works, making their efforts far more efficient than yours. Over time, their actions far outweigh yours and your PBF gets mushed into oblivion.
Oh, and they exclusively play PS4 so you never, ever get to see them for direct pew-pew.
Now, another group of PC players who, for whatever reason have taken a dislike to your group, decide to pummel you even more by buying Xbox versions of the game, whilst boxing their PC accounts and cluttering up stations, blocking pads in open
Another PBF has never heard of you and your faction, and just so happens to have an interest in the system that you love so dearly. They play PVE exclusively because that is what is more fun for them, but they play in Open for the opportunity to meet new players. They spend their time purely helping their faction, not bothering with players as they read up a bit on how the BGS works, making their efforts far more efficient than yours. Over time, their actions far outweigh yours and your PBF gets mushed into oblivion.
Oh, and they exclusively play PS4 so you never, ever get to see them for direct pew-pew.
Now, another group of PC players who, for whatever reason have taken a dislike to your group, decide to pummel you even more by buying Xbox versions of the game, whilst boxing their PC accounts and cluttering up stations, blocking pads in open
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I would like a chocolate cheesecake with raspberry, please and thank you!
The OP suggested having certain OPEN only if you were attacking other PBF via the BGS. You may well feel that is bit harsh but acknowledge the problem it is trying to fix. Personally I wouldn't want to have an outright ban on SOLO, PG's affecting the BGS, but why not look for compromise solution? How about balancing the influence a mission has so it would take more missions to achieve the same outcome in SOLO etc. No content removed everybody happy! Why not talk constructively along those lines.
Round we go again. Power play was consciously implemented for consensual PvP, in OPEN presumably. This has been established beyond a shadow of a doubt. PBF is slighty more tricky I agree, but they is a balance to be struck.
This is a valid argument to a certain degree but as is the counter argument of just hoping into SOLO to affect the BGS adversely on a player group. If players are only interested in PvE what is the point in being a member of a player group. Surely playing in SOLO this illogical? PG their is more of an arguement but it doesn't trump the fact it is an exploit if you adversely effect another PBF from the safety of a PG or SOLO. At least consider the above point, that the system influence rewards could be weighted accordingly to mode.
No untrue, not even in the OP. Just make it impossible to attack other BFG through the BGS. It is hardly denying content!
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Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
The problem it is trying to fix is that direct PvP is optional in this game - which is a problem for players that prefer direct PvP and a feature for those that eschew direct PvP.
To seek a compromise implies that all parties agree that there is a problem - and a compromise implies that all parties make concessions - I doubt that those that prefer direct PvP would accept limitations on Open gameplay in that regard. To require that players that choose not to engage in direct PvP should play in a mode where they are likely to be engaged in direct PvP to be able participate in content that has always been available in all modes is not a compromise.
Consensual - as in optional - as in not required. Optional in the first instance in that players need not pledge to a Power and in the second instance in that direct PvP is impossible in Solo and optional in Private Groups - in this way, PowerPlay does indeed offer consensual PvP.
Player groups engage in BGS play - whether Factional or PowerPlay - they need not engage in direct PvP to do so, by design.
Wishing to affect the galaxy, playing in any mode, is simply to embrace Frontier's game design.
Affecting the BGS (of which all Factions are a part) from any game mode is not an exploit - it is the design of the game - and Frontier are well aware that not all players agree with their stance.
The OP states:
That is to remove content (affecting any Factions in any system where a player Faction is present) from Solo and Private Group - even if it is a player Group's own Faction.
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