Imperial spec ops use those too.well well well, what do we have here? Looks like Mrs. Ryder is in bed with the NMLA terrorists after all: An Enzyme Dumbfire missiles, fired (presumably) by Eurybian Mafia ships... (honest question here: Has anyone ever seen NPC firing that sort of missile in CZs?)
Talk about stacking the deck....
- Thread starter Mrat13
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I think this is what we call a straw man....
I wouldn't care what it was, as long as it was something. Like a unique paint scheme, or unique ship kit. Something that simple, would, I think, help balance the scales.
If Frontier really wanted to ensure a particular conclusion, they'd have done what they did in the "upgrade the refineries" CGs or the "supply the funeral" CG (or more relevantly but less recently the League of Reparation war CG) and not had a competing one in the first place.
You wanted to make a choice to keep those refineries small rather than giving cargo to Big Station and causing a galaxy-wide power generator shortage ... well, tough. There wasn't a CG for that, and no practical non-CG method to make those two fail, so you couldn't. (Did anyone complain about Frontier's obvious pro-Big Station bias? Other than a couple of tinfoilers who see the Club behind every door, no.)
That's what a railroad plot looks like, not the closest margin between two sides in a war CZ for years. That says to me that Frontier have done a pretty good job of making the incentives relatively equal from the point of view of the player base as a whole - even if for particular individuals there's an obvious answer - and offering a genuine choice.
(It's not perfect - 1:1 would mean they'd nailed it - but 2:1 rather than 5:1 or 15:1 participant ratios suggests they're getting a lot better at it, and maybe next time the shiny will only be a 3A Collector Limpet Controller that's both Reinforced and Shielded and it'll be even closer)
You wanted to make a choice to keep those refineries small rather than giving cargo to Big Station and causing a galaxy-wide power generator shortage ... well, tough. There wasn't a CG for that, and no practical non-CG method to make those two fail, so you couldn't. (Did anyone complain about Frontier's obvious pro-Big Station bias? Other than a couple of tinfoilers who see the Club behind every door, no.)
That's what a railroad plot looks like, not the closest margin between two sides in a war CZ for years. That says to me that Frontier have done a pretty good job of making the incentives relatively equal from the point of view of the player base as a whole - even if for particular individuals there's an obvious answer - and offering a genuine choice.
(It's not perfect - 1:1 would mean they'd nailed it - but 2:1 rather than 5:1 or 15:1 participant ratios suggests they're getting a lot better at it, and maybe next time the shiny will only be a 3A Collector Limpet Controller that's both Reinforced and Shielded and it'll be even closer)
Read above. Specifically the part of just wanting something small for the Empire, to incentivise siding with them, the same way Liz is incentivising people to fight for her.
Do it for the Empire.
You think empire players need motivation compared to an independent anarchy? The imperial player groups are some of the biggest and most organised out there short of the communists. Alliance players (and anarchists for that matter) are arguably more motivated, but there's a lot less of them.
I'm shocked you would predict something like this...Maybe the time for stalemate between the superpowers is coming to an end, and in the coming months there will be movement to real war between them? Reading between the lines of the trial and assasination it does appear that both superpowers are about to be put into turmoil - how refreshing it would be to watch the bubble burn in a superpower war, and if the Devs are smiling on us, the Thargoids will return right in the middle of the furball
I see it as the Empire expects you to fight for them, as the ‘righteous’ party. Lizzie needs mercenaries
I don't think this is the only CG we'll be getting if the empire wins, so an empire reward would be further along that path. The empire's ship name is prelude.
However, if the mafia manages to protect Lyz, we'll probably lose the lead on the NMLA terrorists and be subjected to further attacks before the plot proceeds, instead of being on the offensive against the NMLA.
From the point of view of a true neutral (I'm projecting - because I'm not one), I suspect the thinking goes: "what do I get out of this?"
EBM offers a unique module.
Empire offers - nothing really. Plot?
Imperial gonna Imperial, Feds gonna Fed, Alliance gonna... do whatever they do, but if you incentivise only one side with "stuff" then no-one should be surprised that one side gets a lot more contributors.
Yes, it's closer than it has been before, but it'll likely snowball when some Imperials realise it's a lost cause and drift off or (gasp) try and get their own tiny missile rack.
The way to make this interesting would be to offer shiny for one side, but make the other have a smaller target or offer more credits per tier for participation perhaps?
It's easy to say with hindsight, though, but hopefully FDev are learning.
Overall, though, I'm pleased with the direction this is taking so far. Let's see what happens next with the Starship 1 "trial".
EBM offers a unique module.
Empire offers - nothing really. Plot?
Imperial gonna Imperial, Feds gonna Fed, Alliance gonna... do whatever they do, but if you incentivise only one side with "stuff" then no-one should be surprised that one side gets a lot more contributors.
Yes, it's closer than it has been before, but it'll likely snowball when some Imperials realise it's a lost cause and drift off or (gasp) try and get their own tiny missile rack.
The way to make this interesting would be to offer shiny for one side, but make the other have a smaller target or offer more credits per tier for participation perhaps?
It's easy to say with hindsight, though, but hopefully FDev are learning.
Overall, though, I'm pleased with the direction this is taking so far. Let's see what happens next with the Starship 1 "trial".
I joked in another thread about plumping for the shiny module on offer but I’ll be signing on for the Imperials. I’m not motivated by any of the Powers particularly as I see my Cmdr as a Freelancer taking on whatever works for him, however the idea of my involvement being able to make a change within the Galaxy is far more alluring and interesting than getting a module.
I also can’t help but see the current rewards, or bribes if you prefer (I think it stands, just not a bribe from FDev but Liz Ryder and the Mafia,) as a perfectly viable notion. The Imperial empire expecting, no demanding, its followers do their duty whilst a ragtag bunch of, take your pick from the following; scoundrels, opportunists, terrorists and/or falsely accused offer anything they can to garner support for their cause. I wouldn’t have an issue had they paid for mercenaries to join their cause. Of course mercenaries are, historically, known for switching sides the moment it’s suits them.
It’s still very early in the CG but I’d suggest 2:1 is very well balanced and, currently, suggests Imperial loyalty is firm amongst its Cmdrs and that those, like me, with no allegiance aren’t so easily swayed by a shiny trinket. A trinket that, it has already been pointed out in a number of places, doesn’t actually stack up as particularly impressive. As such I don’t think it’s quite as clear a choice as it first seems for those that aren’t immediately drawn to one side or another for reasons of loyalty or belief.
Seeing some narrative, seeing a way for it to move forward by the actions of players and ensuring consequences is, for me, a far more engaging prospect. Whether FDev can continue this in the longer term I don’t know, just hope.
I also can’t help but see the current rewards, or bribes if you prefer (I think it stands, just not a bribe from FDev but Liz Ryder and the Mafia,) as a perfectly viable notion. The Imperial empire expecting, no demanding, its followers do their duty whilst a ragtag bunch of, take your pick from the following; scoundrels, opportunists, terrorists and/or falsely accused offer anything they can to garner support for their cause. I wouldn’t have an issue had they paid for mercenaries to join their cause. Of course mercenaries are, historically, known for switching sides the moment it’s suits them.
It’s still very early in the CG but I’d suggest 2:1 is very well balanced and, currently, suggests Imperial loyalty is firm amongst its Cmdrs and that those, like me, with no allegiance aren’t so easily swayed by a shiny trinket. A trinket that, it has already been pointed out in a number of places, doesn’t actually stack up as particularly impressive. As such I don’t think it’s quite as clear a choice as it first seems for those that aren’t immediately drawn to one side or another for reasons of loyalty or belief.
Seeing some narrative, seeing a way for it to move forward by the actions of players and ensuring consequences is, for me, a far more engaging prospect. Whether FDev can continue this in the longer term I don’t know, just hope.
In the runup to the Great Legs Wars, goodies will be offered as well. Personally, I'm shocked that a goodie would be handed out in a CG.
In the runup to the Great Legs Wars, goodies will be offered as well. Personally, I'm shocked that a goodie would be handed out in a CG.
The Hundred Legs War?
My thought is that if they really wanted this to be one sided, we'd have high capacity overcharged multicannons being offered (doesn't fit with the engineer, I know but that's not the point). Seekers are relatively niche weapons and having high cap ones already means I'd probably pass. However it's an interesting little toy that might be fun to play around with on small ship builds. It's not going to be game changing.
I'd agree that something like this needs to be offered as the status quo seems to be the outcome of previous CGs. I imagine FDev have contingencies for both outcomes, but it's interesting that this is still probably close enough that if the big Imperial player groups get going, this could still be turned around.
Anyway, only mercenaries need to be bribed and that probably puts you on the side of the anarchists anyway.
I'd agree that something like this needs to be offered as the status quo seems to be the outcome of previous CGs. I imagine FDev have contingencies for both outcomes, but it's interesting that this is still probably close enough that if the big Imperial player groups get going, this could still be turned around.
Anyway, only mercenaries need to be bribed and that probably puts you on the side of the anarchists anyway.
Has it been established in game that Liz Ryder actually has supplied weapons to terrorists who have murdered innocent people? Because if that were the case, I'd side with the empire in a heartbeat, irrespective of a trinket with questionable value.
If there's still a possibility that she's being made an 'enemy of the people' by shady black op types, that's a different story. Where's ED's John Pilger when you need him?
If there's still a possibility that she's being made an 'enemy of the people' by shady black op types, that's a different story. Where's ED's John Pilger when you need him?
I would love to have that missile rack. But to me it's not worth more than loyalty.
Everything at the moment is 'suspected of'. This conflict is because the anarchy faction won't play ball with the Empire. Of course that doesn't necessarily mean it's anything to do with her. Petra Olmanova knows a thing or two about missiles and we all know how easy shifting modules about is if you have the credits, say from selling thousands upon thousands of tons of proginator cells.
who's offering small seismic charges, ill fight for them?
i think it's really a bit silly.
None-Lore:
Pro-Empire
- You get empire rank by finishing CZ missions for empire alligned factions like during this CG.
- You get ships by empire rank.
- for those not having the rank for it as of now, and are combat oriented, doing this CG might bring them into a cutter.
- It's easier to fight on the empire side for Capital Ship support and the NPC ships being a bit better (more shields, luckily no feds double hitpoint sponges)
Pro-Ryders
- those already allied or getting allied get a bit better payout (anarchy factions pay a tiny bit better)
- those not yet allied might get access to ryders base
- those get two seekers missile racks with an experimental almost nobody uses on seekers. one is lightweight (no really crazy engineering at grade 5), one is ammo increased. for those already having access to ryder that basically means: a tiny bit of more credits.
and you REALLY think people are fighting for ryder because of the "shiny"?
and you totally disregard that any previous similar CG ended 1:5 for the empire? that was pure walk-over - now it's something like 2:1.
...
and instead of rallying your troups and trying to push the imperialist politics of the oh-so-trustfull-super-rich-warmongering patreus you do what, forum politics with silly out of the context claims?
can't follow you there. i think people like the underdog, they don't want the same to happen to ryder what the feds did on palin, and the empires cause looks very weak. beside - the Marlinist look like Cicero lives between them, before Caesar killed the roman republic.
my bubble commander won't get anything he has not already from this CG, and still will fight for freedom.