Thank You Very Much, Frontier, for your effort in C&P

[KevinMillican]

The new C&P has not affected my game much.
All that's really happened is that I have to visit an interstellar factor if I accidentally hit a clean ship - not a big deal.

I have seen a few improvements:

• I can (usually) now shoot other ships based on their behaviour without waiting for a scan to confirm they are wanted.
• I have not been attacked by another player for no reason outside an anarchy system.
• Open is much more attractive to me now and I'm playing there more often - would probably be there all the time if it weren't for all the friends I've made in Mobius

I still think there's room for improvement:

• Friendly fire fines are too easy to get - I would recommend that FD change it so that you can pay off ones below 1000 credits without needing to visit an interstellar factor (effectively 3 strikes and you're out).
• Profits for trading and carrying out missions in anarchy systems need to increase dramatically to give me a reason to go there.
• Rewards for missions that inevitably lead to crimes and notoriety should also increase so that there is reward to complement the risk.

 

[Powderpanic]

OP, can confirm. New Punishment and Punishment has not reduced my ability to gank noobs at all. In fact, it has made it WAY more fun.

Thank you, FD for supporting this dynamic and exciting emergent content!

Powderpanic
The Voice of Griefing

 

[ilo]

Oh I go wandering too. When I want to. Not when the game forces me. I'm careful everywhere, never shot a ship in anger that didn't shoot in anger at me first. Truth.

Then it shouldn't affect you that much. If the outfitting was not locked, you could have just do something else while the notoriety was decaying. I went to pick up materials in the SRV, but I'm sure there is other stuff you can do in the mean time, not what you wanted to do, I agree, you didn't want to shoot an NPC, right?

The punishment is OK, the crime is not. 400cr bounty for killing an NPC, I don't accept a bounty-hunting mission that doesn't pay 2M, and my face if a wanted conda in a RES doesn't give me more than 100k says it all

 

[vindicator jones]

VJ, I respect you, I like your channel, but this triggers me in a very serious way, so here come da rant.

YOu know what the problem is? It;s exactly this, it's HOW you get notorious. It's so immersion breakingly idiotic.

LOL, I should have been a bit more detailed in what I was meaning.

Right now the sensitivity on accidental strikes is WAY too high.. I think this needs to be toned down a bit more. As someone stated before in the thread you can only get notoriety if you kill the NPC, and while this is true, sometimes all it takes is one accidental strike to kill an NPC already in combat (happened to me the other day) or if that NPC is killed by another NPC. (I think this still counts, someone correct me if I am wrong)

Personally I would like to see Notoriety only kick in after the second NPC death, or first CMDR death.. As I said in my post, I think there needs to be a bit more of gentler curve obtaining notoriety.

So yes, I understand your rant, and in most ways I agree with you, but these are balancing issues, things that can be changed in time. My comment was based around crime and punishment as a whole, rather than specific aspects of it.

However my comment does stand, I have seen many videos where commanders have extremely sloppy trigger control, and in this new system it is highly advisable to reign that in a bit.

Personally I think its a bit silly that you have gain a bounty on accidental fire, and it should be a fine that you can pay at your local station, rather having to find a broker for it, and I am hoping that will also be adjusted in time.

I still think the new Crime and Punishment system is great, but there are aspects, like you mentioned, that need to be addressed.

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

Live ammunition in an open environment you say? Seriously? You are telling me to be carefull with my guns, when the other guy likes to cruise among other people that use live ammunition for their entairtainment or profit? Seriously?

Where you point your sticks of doom is your problem. If some somehow gets in your line of fire, it's your responsibility to not shoot them.

Oh i m sorry about the skimmers. I didnt know that i could wait for a few seconds for the rain to stop. Sorry that me and others didnt adjust ourselves to that specific bug and as a result devs HAD TO fix it because of us and waste their precious time. Next time i ll try a bit more.

Indeed, that bug needed to be fixed asap, and FD took too long. No arguments there.
But as a work around to keep playing, waiting 10~ seconds is not that long of a wait. Unless you're a millennial, then it's an eternity.

EDIT: "using live ammunition in an open environment" lol. You do understand that this is a game right? right?

So is Arma 3. Same rules apply, only you can shout at the player running infront of you aswell. Lol

 

[PiLhEaD]

OP, can confirm. New Punishment and Punishment has not reduced my ability to gank noobs at all. In fact, it has made it WAY more fun...

I'm genuinely interested to hear how the c&p changes have improved your experience, can you explain?

 

[ALGOMATIC]

I'm genuinely interested to hear how the c&p changes have improved your experience, can you explain?

I have a 150 mil bounty because of seal clubbing in Eravate, just jumped into the CG and continued ganking there. Nothing changed except I cannot refill/repair at the CG station, just land on a planet ans refill there since its controlled by a different faction.
I have notoriety of 10 but for some reason the ATR only show up when killling small cheap ships (winders in Eravate), they are useless in this case because I need literaly 2 sec to kill a winder and they show up after 20 sec. For expensive ships (T9, Python) they never showed up at all, still unsure why.

I am trying to see how big of a bounty I can get. 150mil and counting.

 

[Quester91]

One thing is sure, I've spent a few hours doing the cg in open surrounded by dozens of other players both in sc and in station and I haven't been attacked by griefers once. I'm actually quite impressed.

 

[ilo]

I have a 150 mil bounty because of seal clubbing in Eravate, just jumped into the CG and continued ganking there. Nothing changed except I cannot refill/repair at the CG station, just land on a planet ans refill there since its controlled by a different faction.
I have notoriety of 10 but for some reason the ATR only show up when killling small cheap ships (winders in Eravate), they are useless in this case because I need literaly 2 sec to kill a winder and they show up after 20 sec. For expensive ships (T9, Python) they never showed up at all, still unsure why.

I am trying to see how big of a bounty I can get. 150mil and counting.

Despite this might sound weird, I'd actually like you to continue doing so. Lets see how much the bounty grows and how this really affects pvp clubbing with a real case, instead of FD imagination.

 

[ALGOMATIC]

Despite this might sound weird, I'd actually like you to continue doing so. Lets see how much the bounty grows and how this really affects pvp clubbing with a real case, instead of FD imagination.

Each winder gives around 5mil bounty. Expensive ships around 100k or so. I killed an FDL (pvp) and got 5k so I dont understand their logic.

 

[jasonbarron]

LOL, I should have been a bit more detailed in what I was meaning.

Right now the sensitivity on accidental strikes is WAY too high.. I think this needs to be toned down a bit more. As someone stated before in the thread you can only get notoriety if you kill the NPC, and while this is true, sometimes all it takes is one accidental strike to kill an NPC already in combat (happened to me the other day) or if that NPC is killed by another NPC. (I think this still counts, someone correct me if I am wrong)

Personally I would like to see Notoriety only kick in after the second NPC death, or first CMDR death.. As I said in my post, I think there needs to be a bit more of gentler curve obtaining notoriety.

So yes, I understand your rant, and in most ways I agree with you, but these are balancing issues, things that can be changed in time. My comment was based around crime and punishment as a whole, rather than specific aspects of it.

However my comment does stand, I have seen many videos where commanders have extremely sloppy trigger control, and in this new system it is highly advisable to reign that in a bit.

Personally I think its a bit silly that you have gain a bounty on accidental fire, and it should be a fine that you can pay at your local station, rather having to find a broker for it, and I am hoping that will also be adjusted in time.

I still think the new Crime and Punishment system is great, but there are aspects, like you mentioned, that need to be addressed.

I think gaining a bounty for "friendly fire accidents" and similar infractions is arguably one of the best things that's happened to this game since I started playing. Being given a reason to carry a KWS and harvest bounty receipts galaxy wide is just plain fun and probably the closest Fdev has ever come to implementing meaningful PvP elements into the game. As far as I'm concerned, it's sort of like the government imposing a tax on things like liquor & tobacco.

 

[Powderpanic]

I'm genuinely interested to hear how the c&p changes have improved your experience, can you explain?

Well, its IMPOSSIBLE to die in ED if you are good.

You would have to fall asleep at the stick or be drunk, not to escape everything with ease.

ATR on the other hand, being cheating godships. ACTUALLY, add an element, (all be it small) of risk.

Risk is fun. Once you have mastered everything else this game has to offer, PVP is all that is left.

Now I need to complete the gank as fast as possible and wake out before ATR and their station weapons O doom show up.

Powderpanic
The Voice of Griefing

 

[ShimEnki]

I totally agree.

By the year 3003 one would have to assume that weapons will be completely removed from civilization right?

Maybe the odd city that is running amuck with anarchy will allow it but nowhere else!

Keep the path FD, and your dream of a completely weapon fire free universe will arrive!

 

[Ian Doncaster]

If, as some say, the only players disadvantaged under the new C&P are the PvE, then something needs to be done. I would like to think that the entire aim of the new system is to combat griefers and gankers, to finally instil some actualy punishment into the game.

Every time an important station gets put into Lockdown, there are complaints raised on these forums about the "griefers" who did it.
Every time an important station gets UA-bombed, there are complaints raised on these forums about the "griefers" who did it.

In both cases, these "griefers" are committing PvE crimes only. (murder and smuggling respectively)

So, if the new C&P system is disadvantaging PvE criminals? Exactly what the forums demanded!

 

[Maro-Val]

Where you point your sticks of doom is your problem. If some somehow gets in your line of fire, it's your responsibility to not shoot them.


Indeed, that bug needed to be fixed asap, and FD took too long. No arguments there.
But as a work around to keep playing, waiting 10~ seconds is not that long of a wait. Unless you're a millennial, then it's an eternity.


So is Arma 3. Same rules apply, only you can shout at the player running infront of you aswell. Lol

If someone somehow gets in my line of fire, its my responsibility to not shoot him? So you re telling me that you can play this game and do combat and dont shoot someone accidentally? This specific game?

And this is not Arma dude and no.. the same rules doesnt apply just because you say so.

I guess people like you will again say: oh its ok that if you have notoriety you cannot access outfitting even in anarchy systems. People like you justify stupid stuff like that and we have this mess.

 

[Marra Morgan]

If someone somehow gets in my line of fire, its my responsibility to not shoot him? So you re telling me that you can play this game and do combat and dont shoot someone accidentally? This specific game?

"Yes," thrice.

 

[jasonbarron]

If someone somehow gets in my line of fire, its my responsibility to not shoot him? So you re telling me that you can play this game and do combat and dont shoot someone accidentally? This specific game?

And this is not Arma dude and no.. the same rules doesnt apply just because you say so.

A little accidental fire now and again is inevitable if you spend all day every day in a CZ or a RES, but with that said it should be very rare, and it is indeed the pilot's very own responsibility to ensure proper fire safety. It's the definition of your responsibility, actually. I've managed to play for thousands of hours and since the first hundred can count accidental fire episodes on one hand.

 

[Maro-Val]

A little accidental fire now and again is inevitable if you spend all day every day in a CZ or a RES, but with that said it should be very rare, and it is indeed the pilot's very own responsibility to ensure proper fire safety. It's the definition of your responsibility, actually. I've managed to play for thousands of hours and since the first hundred can count accidental fire episodes on one hand.

Yes i m talking about some accidental fire every now and then and i dont spend my day in a CZ or a RES. I can very well manage my finger and my incidents are extremely limited and was never a problem to me personally, but that doesnt mean that this works ok or that everybody can manage to do it.

For example, i can remember that me and friends were bounty hunting together and if one of us got accidentally wanted if by accident he hit someone clean, everyone was agro on our wing and we had to go to super cruise and he had to wait for some minutes and then jump to another system and then jump back and then super cruise his way back to the RES. The point here is that accidental fires will always happen. ITS A GAME. Not everyone can control his finger like all of you vets around here. Its no fun to get punished because someone got a dent.

I more than anyone wanted a C&P system, but this mess needs serious balancing. Oh and lets not forget the "no outfitting even on anarchy systems".

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

If someone somehow gets in my line of fire, its my responsibility to not shoot him?

Exactly.

So you re telling me that you can play this game and do combat and dont shoot someone accidentally? This specific game?

Never said that. But I can spend hours at a time in a CZ or Res without a friendly fire incident.
That doesn't include stray missiles or SLF crew shenanigans, which you can't do anything about until it happens.

And this is not Arma dude and no.. the same rules doesnt apply just because you say so.

It does sort of apply. You don't shoot your team mates on a friendly fire enabled server without punishment.
It's still your responsibility to not shoot the muppet that stands up infront of your scope.

I guess people like you will again say: oh its ok that if you have notoriety you cannot access outfitting even in anarchy systems. People like you justify stupid stuff like that and we have this mess.

I don't recall saying that.
So people like me, infact, do not say that kind of thing!