the Bounties/Fines management in Odyssey is just .. worth nothing

[Lynfeyh Wighnut]

After a longer pause from Elite I came back, just to give "onfoot" a try.
But after 10 times "handing me in" ...
my opinion on the punishment system in Odyssey. It's just plain big crap.
An example:
I accidentally shoot a courier dropping off some bad guys who want to kill me - 200cr bounty.
200cr bounty not a fine - which can't even be paid like that on a station? no! - I have to "hand myself in" - finding myself back in a penal institution and then have to jump over 50ly only to then be able to continue.
This is not gameplay THIS IS BULLS...!
The whole game is more or less based on anarchy, and you suddenly come up with something like that?
Also a way of expelling players.
Just switch the system, lets say up to 50.000cr its a fine, and on more it becomes a bounty. That's fair.
I'ts hard enough to find stations of related factions to pay the fines.

I look forward to other people's opinions.

 

[metatheurgist]

Fines can still be paid. There used to be some weirdness where Ody fines couldn't be seen in ship and vice versa, dunno if that's still a thing. IF's still work.

 

[Kaocraft]

Fines can still be paid. There used to be some weirdness where Ody fines couldn't be seen in ship and vice versa, dunno if that's still a thing. IF's still work.

yeah it's still a thing. Not sure what's going on under the hood but depending on whether you're in a ship or on foot you may see totally different things relating to your fines/bounties. And paying them/interstallar-factors-ing them might not actually change their status. Sometimes logging out/in resolves the discrepancy, sometimes not.

 

[Lynfeyh Wighnut]

Also: you get a covert mission where you are not allowed to kill any NPC. But there ist no way to knock someone down or stun them without killing them. And then you get a bounty when you get uncovered or have to kill someone, to not get killed yourself?
Stupid kind of logic. It looks like a brain fart ripped through an overtrained cerebral cluster of cells.
Sorry for being rude.
But ELITE has been Game that fascinated me and made me come back so often.
Just read the CODEX - Crime and punishment - what?! - I don't want to be taught how to behave in a game where you only have weapons to kill.
This is just frustrating. It was so easy in the early days ...

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

Also: you get a covert mission where you are not allowed to kill any NPC. But there ist no way to knock someone down or stun them without killing them.

This is a concession to the PEGI 16 rating. Being able to stun NPCs opens the door to "violence against defenceless characters", which means PEGI 18. This is also the reason why all NPCs are armed and actually fight you, even the technicians. Unless the NPCs bug out you don't need to disable them. The non-violent missions can be done just fine with a little patience.

And then you get a bounty when you get uncovered or have to kill someone, to not get killed yourself?
Stupid kind of logic. It looks like a brain fart ripped through an overtrained cerebral cluster of cells.

From the settlement's perspective, you are the aggressor, and you killed one of the occupants. Of yourse the owning faction will put out a bounty on you.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

From the settlement's perspective, you are the aggressor, and you killed one of the occupants. Of yourse the owning faction will put out a bounty on you.

As with many things, it's because the ship gameplay has trained us into accepting utterly bizarre legal systems and consequences, and then when Odyssey gives NPCs even minor capacity for disliking being shot at the clash of expectations is huge.

A particularly bizarre thing:
- you're in jurisdiction A, and you open fire on and destroy a ship belonging to faction B
- if the ship has no bounty with faction A, your reputation with faction B falls significantly even if the ship had a bounty with faction B (assuming you didn't KWS to detect that bounty)
- if the ship has a bounty with faction A, your reputation with faction B is entirely unaffected, even if the ship has no bounty with faction B
...and this applies even if factions A and B are at war, or if faction B is an anarchy faction which (allegedly) doesn't recognise anyone else's legal system as legitimate, etc. (whereas, conversely, if faction A is an anarchy faction, faction B will never complain about you shooting at them in A's space)

So having spent all this time training players into "Wanted = free fire / Clean = wait for them to shoot first, then return fire" when Odyssey has a more self-preserving approach to "heavily-armed stranger on the base" it feels completely absurd that the NPCs are allowed to shoot at you but it's you who gets the bounty from their employer.

 

[Lynfeyh Wighnut]

So having spent all this time training players into "Wanted = free fire / Clean = wait for them to shoot first, then return fire" when Odyssey has a more self-preserving approach to "heavily-armed stranger on the base" it feels completely absurd that the NPCs are allowed to shoot at you but it's you who gets the bounty from their employer.

you are so right ...

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

You can scan NPCs, and if they have a bounty, the settlement does not care. They don't even care if you scan their buddies. The scanned NPCs care in that a) they will tell you to get on with it and b) they will attack you if you discover their bounty. You can kill NPCs with bounties anytime you like and you will not get a bounty from the settlement.

I get that some things are confusing, but I get by with a simple ruleset: ship clean / NPC not scanned: I will get a bounty. Ship wanted / I scanned the NPC and it's got a bounty on them - there you go . I am not sure, it might still raise the alarms though.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

And bounties are only a small inconvenience anyway. I usually park on the landing pad, and if a covert / non-violence mission goes completely south, I take them all out, loot the place, steal their power regulator, board my ship and hand myself in. For as little as 10k and two jumps from the jail ship I get some loot and a power regulator. That's a bargain.

 

[Dillon Fallon]

There's a solution here. Find yourself a station with a shipyard that's owned by an anarchy faction. Congratulations, fines and bounties no longer matter to you- go forth and murder whatever you want at lawful settlements.

 

[Dillon Fallon]

The non-violent missions can be done just fine with a little patience.

Try finding one against a hostile faction for added fun.

 

[Lynfeyh Wighnut]

Another thing here. You get a mission to kill someone. When the selltement is not anarchy, why do you get a bounty when you escape uncovered?
Again you need to .. relog at first .. and then hand yourself in, fly back from the detention station, before you can hand in a successful mission ... ?! ... anyone ?!

Total waste of time... to put it nicely

 

[Screemonster]

Another thing here. You get a mission to kill someone. When the selltement is not anarchy, why do you get a bounty when you escape uncovered?
Again you need to .. relog at first .. and then hand yourself in, fly back from the detention station, before you can hand in a successful mission ... ?! ... anyone ?!

Total waste of time... to put it nicely

Because, as @Ian Doncaster pointed out above, the legal system on foot is based on the legal system in ships, and ship gameplay has some utterly absurd legal situations that weren't much of an issue until odyssey launched, but now there's an actual incentive to do crimes odyssey has brought them front and centre.