Ships The Corsair feels off in some areas that I'd like to see improved.

Let me start out by saying I love this ship, I love the design aesthetically, I can't wait for more paintjobs, I think the module layout of it is also fantastic for a multi role ship, it has everything going for it and it's a medium Gutamaya ship. While I love balance in ships, there's some striking details that make the corsair a bit annoying to use at least in combat. I've tested it in mining, trading, exploration, and combat and it does all of these well except imo combat. I don't think it should lose every weakness it has but I would like to point out the main drawbacks and hope to see changes made to balance it a little better. So below are what I've noticed about the Corsair.

1. The very slow pitch. This isn't a dealbreaker for me, but it is indeed VERY slow to turn in most cases. I can kinda get over this due to the deceleration stopping on a dime and it being an absolute joy to fly and land because of that. So maybe that's a way to balance it out and also keep other ships like it in the ring without outright disqualifying the clipper. Still worth mentioning, but not a huge deal breaker except for pvp enthusiasts maybe.

2. Size 7 thrusters capped at 600 speed. This is another one I thought was unusual but I'm also willing to give this somewhat of the benefit of the doubt. I don't know if it's intentional or not, but it seems odd this ship was advertised as a medium with such a large thruster size only for it to be capped at 600 with engineering and no matter how much mass you drop off of it. However while I could consider this a limitation in design preventing me from choosing the weight class of it, my next thought was "okay so yes I'm capped in speed but now I can add as much mass as I want in modules or cargo and still be hitting that speed thanks to the thrusters". Which makes sense given its role and potential as a pirate ship too. So ya know what, I can let this slide too maybe if it is intentional and not a bug or oversight... alright sure that's pretty neat given it's a multi-role.

3. It takes 2 boosts to reach top speed and even then only briefly. This paired with the above notes is where it starts to go a little more downhill for me. It'll make more sense with the last point after this but the duration of the boost is VERY short and you need to expend twice as much engine power just to reach top speed. This feels really icky again with the consideration of it having size 7 thrusters, I really would love to see either the acelleration go much higher in one boost or extend the duration of the boost so it can reach that top speed better. With the speed being capped, it only puts salt in the wound that I'm going to get around to 475-500ishish in speed but need to boost again just to hit my max speed. It feels like the equivalent of keeping your car in park and flooring it to me. You have all this excess energy spent just to make up where it shouldn't be lacking.

4. This is the worst offender of the above and one I definitely think should be looked at again. This thing... runs SO dang hot. The boost alone sends it about 11 degrees upwards every use, thermal weapons raise the heat like crazy, even missiles seem to generate a ton more heat than usual. It seems like the worst ship in the game when it comes to its heat capacity so far. When you couple this with the above taking 2 boosts just to reach top speed and the cap at 600.... I'm burning up just trying to reach a suboptimal level when the ship should absolutely be capable of more. It feels so unusual going into combat and heating up so easily.


Now, do I think ALL of these should be adjusted? No, I think it should retain an identity as a multi-role ship and not immediately outclass everything else or be a master in any particular area. That's the ship's identity as a whole and I don't want to compromise that so other ships stay competitive and in line with it while also letting it be that "master of none" mix n matcher ship. Personally, I want the heat to be addressed because it's just gross, it really just doesn't feel good. After that, maybe just picking 1 option of the above issues to address and it'd be a fine balance? Like, keep the 600 cap, you're able to stack mass as much as you want and go fast still.... but maybe adjust the pitch a bit so it's not so slow to turn? Or make it accelerate to top speed in one boost through boost duration or some such? Or keep the double boosts to top speed but uncap the top speed better? I can't say as again I don't want the ship to be OP, but I really think bare minimum the heat needs to be touched upon.

Thoughts?
 
I love the design aesthetically

Thoughts?

There's no accounting for taste. You love the way this ship looks? Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it must be an acquired taste.

There's nothing that makes me perk up in this game like new ships, but the Corsair? Sad to say the needle hasn't moved for me. Plenty others to fly. Enjoy the new tub mate.
 
There's no accounting for taste. You love the way this ship looks? Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it must be an acquired taste.

There's nothing that makes me perk up in this game like new ships, but the Corsair? Sad to say the needle hasn't moved for me. Plenty others to fly. Enjoy the new tub mate.
A lot of people are mixed on it, some love it, some hate it. I'm personally someone who hasn't liked most of the ships looking like bricks or flat simple polygons. I do wish we had more paint options but the ship kits make it look fantastic.
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If 99% of people hate the design, the designer has done a bad job.

If 99% of people love the design, the designer has done a good job.

If half the people hate the design and another half love it, the designer has done an excellent job that is innovative and pushes the boundaries of industrial design.

🤪
 
However while I could consider this a limitation in design preventing me from choosing the weight class of it, my next thought was "okay so yes I'm capped in speed but now I can add as much mass as I want in modules or cargo and still be hitting that speed thanks to the thrusters". Which makes sense given its role and potential as a pirate ship too. So ya know what, I can let this slide too maybe if it is intentional and not a bug or oversight... alright sure that's pretty neat given it's a multi-role.
That's exactly the advantage of the class-7 thrusters. You can use the heaviest hull, engineered for "heavy duty" and "deep plating", and have a big bunch of big hull reinforcement packages (also engineered for "heavy duty" and "deep plating"), making the ship really heavy, yet still maintain that 599 m/s boost speed.
 
I completely agree about the manoeuvrability, it's one of the worst M ships for Pitch/Roll/Yaw whilst also being one of the lightest, which doesn't make much sense.

I found it quite disappointing, given that most of the new ships have been more agile than their older counterparts. At least that could be seen as a good thing, as they are not just blanketly obsoleting older ships with every new release.
 
That's exactly the advantage of the class-7 thrusters. You can use the heaviest hull, engineered for "heavy duty" and "deep plating", and have a big bunch of big hull reinforcement packages (also engineered for "heavy duty" and "deep plating"), making the ship really heavy, yet still maintain that 599 m/s boost speed.
I both love and dislike this, I think mainly because like a lot of people, I had an expectation for it to be a fast ship above the 600 cap. I can't argue though the idea of being able to be as heavy as it can for anything it's doing and still being able to go that speed but I almost feel this could be achievable with the size 6's too. In any case, I think I've mostly gotten over the feeling of that in the ship and my main gripe is just the heat when using weaponry and the boost.

I completely agree about the manoeuvrability, it's one of the worst M ships for Pitch/Roll/Yaw whilst also being one of the lightest, which doesn't make much sense.

I found it quite disappointing, given that most of the new ships have been more agile than their older counterparts. At least that could be seen as a good thing, as they are not just blanketly obsoleting older ships with every new release.
Yeah I like the idea of balancing new released ships so they're not outclassing old ones but there could be something else to adjust here. Maybe slightly improve the pitch or at least make the boost hit top speed without needing to be pressed twice lol.
 
Let me start out by saying I love this ship, I love the design aesthetically, I can't wait for more paintjobs, I think the module layout of it is also fantastic for a multi role ship, it has everything going for it and it's a medium Gutamaya ship. While I love balance in ships, there's some striking details that make the corsair a bit annoying to use at least in combat. I've tested it in mining, trading, exploration, and combat and it does all of these well except imo combat. I don't think it should lose every weakness it has but I would like to point out the main drawbacks and hope to see changes made to balance it a little better. So below are what I've noticed about the Corsair.

1. The very slow pitch. This isn't a dealbreaker for me, but it is indeed VERY slow to turn in most cases. I can kinda get over this due to the deceleration stopping on a dime and it being an absolute joy to fly and land because of that. So maybe that's a way to balance it out and also keep other ships like it in the ring without outright disqualifying the clipper. Still worth mentioning, but not a huge deal breaker except for pvp enthusiasts maybe.

2. Size 7 thrusters capped at 600 speed. This is another one I thought was unusual but I'm also willing to give this somewhat of the benefit of the doubt. I don't know if it's intentional or not, but it seems odd this ship was advertised as a medium with such a large thruster size only for it to be capped at 600 with engineering and no matter how much mass you drop off of it. However while I could consider this a limitation in design preventing me from choosing the weight class of it, my next thought was "okay so yes I'm capped in speed but now I can add as much mass as I want in modules or cargo and still be hitting that speed thanks to the thrusters". Which makes sense given its role and potential as a pirate ship too. So ya know what, I can let this slide too maybe if it is intentional and not a bug or oversight... alright sure that's pretty neat given it's a multi-role.

3. It takes 2 boosts to reach top speed and even then only briefly. This paired with the above notes is where it starts to go a little more downhill for me. It'll make more sense with the last point after this but the duration of the boost is VERY short and you need to expend twice as much engine power just to reach top speed. This feels really icky again with the consideration of it having size 7 thrusters, I really would love to see either the acelleration go much higher in one boost or extend the duration of the boost so it can reach that top speed better. With the speed being capped, it only puts salt in the wound that I'm going to get around to 475-500ishish in speed but need to boost again just to hit my max speed. It feels like the equivalent of keeping your car in park and flooring it to me. You have all this excess energy spent just to make up where it shouldn't be lacking.

4. This is the worst offender of the above and one I definitely think should be looked at again. This thing... runs SO dang hot. The boost alone sends it about 11 degrees upwards every use, thermal weapons raise the heat like crazy, even missiles seem to generate a ton more heat than usual. It seems like the worst ship in the game when it comes to its heat capacity so far. When you couple this with the above taking 2 boosts just to reach top speed and the cap at 600.... I'm burning up just trying to reach a suboptimal level when the ship should absolutely be capable of more. It feels so unusual going into combat and heating up so easily.


Now, do I think ALL of these should be adjusted? No, I think it should retain an identity as a multi-role ship and not immediately outclass everything else or be a master in any particular area. That's the ship's identity as a whole and I don't want to compromise that so other ships stay competitive and in line with it while also letting it be that "master of none" mix n matcher ship. Personally, I want the heat to be addressed because it's just gross, it really just doesn't feel good. After that, maybe just picking 1 option of the above issues to address and it'd be a fine balance? Like, keep the 600 cap, you're able to stack mass as much as you want and go fast still.... but maybe adjust the pitch a bit so it's not so slow to turn? Or make it accelerate to top speed in one boost through boost duration or some such? Or keep the double boosts to top speed but uncap the top speed better? I can't say as again I don't want the ship to be OP, but I really think bare minimum the heat needs to be touched upon.

Thoughts?
Actually this is a beta version for testers. After a few months it will be rolled out, fix all the bugs in it and release (mass production) for credits.
 
Firstly, the OP hasn't qualified the engineering on their Corsair.

Secondly, most haven't worked out its design criteria. For example a hard cap is an artifice(both in top speed and manoeuvrability). You can see this in EDSY where you can use the experimental option to put in higher than normal items.
The ship is designed by FDEV as a 'slugger'. A heavily armoured ship with 'low gearing'.
The meta of lowering weight does not work.
It also uses the new meta of Heavy Duty/ Deep Plate to give a maximum of 12 - 14k Armour (Thats a lot more like a Corvette). It has pants shields as that is not its strength. Better to think of it as a fast Federal Gunship.

I would suggest loading it up with a mixture of the above reinforcements with a biweave shield and not be too worried when the shields drop.
From testing I have seen some very interesting effects, but I will leave that to you to work out for yourselves.
As a final thought the Barbary Corsairs from the 18th Century were known as shallow water, heavily armoured ships with 2 banks of cannon and were known as beaked ships. Someone in fdev is looking at world ship history 😉.
 
The boost cap is honestly a joke, as well as the MLF.

There's no other ship with such limitation and with such clearly mistaken mass lock factor.

Then what else? Limit to 40ly the Anaconda jump distance???

...

Come on... some one should wash the face before writing code for this game.
 
The boost cap is honestly a joke, as well as the MLF.

There's no other ship with such limitation and with such clearly mistaken mass lock factor.
Agree with the MLF. But all ships have a hard (boost) speed cap. It's just very few ships can equip thrusters that have minimum mass high enough for any sensible loadout to ever allow the ship to hit that cap.

Phantom, Dolphin, Mandalay: 591 m/s
Orca, Clipper, Mamba: 642 m/s
Python II: 583 m/s

Corsair is the second fastest medium ship after Mamba, and can actually hit that cap under all circumstances, so not bad. A combat fit Mamba (heavy duty reactive armor, prismatic shields, A-rated heavy duty shield boosters) can actually be slightly slower than Corsair.
 
Agree with the MLF. But all ships have a hard (boost) speed cap. It's just very few ships can equip thrusters that have minimum mass high enough for any sensible loadout to ever allow the ship to hit that cap.

Phantom, Dolphin, Mandalay: 591 m/s
Orca, Clipper, Mamba: 642 m/s
Python II: 583 m/s

Corsair is the second fastest medium ship after Mamba, and can actually hit that cap under all circumstances, so not bad. A combat fit Mamba (heavy duty reactive armor, prismatic shields, A-rated heavy duty shield boosters) can actually be slightly slower than Corsair.
It is possible with all ships that use 3A or 2A Thrusters to hit the hard cap by using the equivalent Enhanced Thrusters from Palin or Felicity. The Corsair is a very good ship. With the on rails capabilities it could possibly be slightly OP as as a raider.
 
Agree with the MLF. But all ships have a hard (boost) speed cap. It's just very few ships can equip thrusters that have minimum mass high enough for any sensible loadout to ever allow the ship to hit that cap.

Phantom, Dolphin, Mandalay: 591 m/s
Orca, Clipper, Mamba: 642 m/s
Python II: 583 m/s

Corsair is the second fastest medium ship after Mamba, and can actually hit that cap under all circumstances, so not bad. A combat fit Mamba (heavy duty reactive armor, prismatic shields, A-rated heavy duty shield boosters) can actually be slightly slower than Corsair.

Yep but all the ships above do have to cope with some compromises to hit the cap, i.e. I have a Mamba boosting 640+ but has paper hull and 1k shields... my piracy Clipper in full load boosts at 615+, etc... I've the feeling that the Corsair cap is too low and doesn't offer much angle for compromises. I mean that's better overall for most players as one can fit heaviest modules without being worried about +/-5ms but i.e. one willing to rely on speed (best defence for pirate builds) doesn't have the chance to reach the 615-625 "safety zone".
 
but i.e. one willing to rely on speed (best defence for pirate builds) doesn't have the chance to reach the 615-625 "safety zone".
But it still can outrun almost all medium ships. If it could boost to >630 m/s it would be completely OP, safe from all combat-fit medium and large ships. Right now it sits in this spot of being able to evade common PvP ships like Krait, FDL and PII, but needing to watch out for madmen in lightly built Mambas, Clippers and Cobras. And Corsair being able to hit the cap with pretty much any loadout IMO is a stand-out feature, so it can sport heavy defenses against faster lightweight ships while still being able to outrun everything else.
 
But it still can outrun almost all medium ships. If it could boost to >630 m/s it would be completely OP, safe from all combat-fit medium and large ships. Right now it sits in this spot of being able to evade common PvP ships like Krait, FDL and PII, but needing to watch out for madmen in lightly built Mambas, Clippers and Cobras. And Corsair being able to hit the cap with pretty much any loadout IMO is a stand-out feature, so it can sport heavy defenses against faster lightweight ships while still being able to outrun everything else.
Boost isn't super great anyway... is very similar to the Clipper (needs 2 boosts to reach max speed forward in most situations) and it does also have a big speed drop between subsequent boosts (a slower boosting Phantom can easily cope with it). But I mostly argument about how different Corsair builds behave ones vs the other, as pirate builds are always sub optimal vs PvP versions and speed is what makes the difference. I mean, a 600sh max speed is ok for a PvP full load, but with lower mass i.e. bi-weave instead of prismo, lw alloy instead of other bulkheads etc they'd have allowed some additional m/s beyond that.

The low cap just flatten the different builds... i.e. less variety as everyone will just stick on prismo and boosters as the variants don't offer any advantage.
 
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The low cap just flatten the different builds... i.e. less variety as everyone will just stick on prismo and boosters as the variants don't offer any advantage.
Prismatics are not very effective as this ship has a very low shield multiplier. Best to up armour like a Fed Gunship. So wrong premise; it is very different.
 
The low cap just flatten the different builds... i.e. less variety as everyone will just stick on prismo and boosters as the variants don't offer any advantage.
A valid point of view, absolutely🙂 Although it has more to do with the low hull mass and class 7 thrusters, not speed cap per se. If the cap was increased, every Corsair build would just be faster. Still no variety between light vs. heavy builds. The only ways to do away with this indifference to mass is to restrict the ship to class 6 thrusters, or by increasing the hull mass/size of sensors and life support module so it doesn't get to the thruster minimum mass so easily.
 
Prismatics are not very effective as this ship has a very low shield multiplier. Best to up armour like a Fed Gunship. So wrong premise; it is very different.
Interesting... I've been running this Shield focused build in CZs and not seen it drop below 75%

Hull tank would definitely suit a cold running pirate build better though :)
 
Interesting... I've been running this Shield focused build in CZs and not seen it drop below 75%

Hull tank would definitely suit a cold running pirate build better though :)
Very interesting build, however armour is far more effective. I took the liberty to take your build and change it https://edsy.org/s/v4TvUfX . For what its worth your build is very vulnerable if shields go down as NPC's will spam missiles! Another item is that your build would last too long against PA's as its thermal resistance is poor. If you are keeping your Corsair safe, then you are an excellent pilot. There are several other things that could be looked at. If it works for you then its good, a few changes may make it easier. I do like alternative build options and I will take it away in terms of using low power shields as an alternative option.
 
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