The game industry cant go on like this.

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@MTBFritz
Very well said. Couldn't agree more. Its repulsive to see people making fun of other people in general.

About pricing though, games today are cheap. Very cheap. At least compared to the huge investment. I would gladly pay more if that means that workers gets better contract agreements. However, also during the 90s, I remember reading that Japanese developers towards the end of the dead line often had to sleep at the office for weeks or months before launch. So working conditions has always been lousy in the game industry...
Back in the 90s, games could cost well above 40 euros, and N64 games could cost as much as 100 euros. Now, a new PS4 game cost 50-60 euros while rents and gasoline has almost tripled since the 90s.
 
There are probably people all around the world putting their own lives into perspective after reading that. Despite living in unimaginable conditions due to war, genocide, disaster and famine they must be giving thanks that they don't have to suffer the deplorable conditions forced upon game developers in the west. They don't know how lucky they are!

I despair sometimes.
 
There are probably people all around the world putting their own lives into perspective after reading that. Despite living in unimaginable conditions due to war, genocide, disaster and famine they must be giving thanks that they don't have to suffer the deplorable conditions forced upon game developers in the west. They don't know how lucky they are!

I despair sometimes.
Amen
 
There are probably people all around the world putting their own lives into perspective after reading that. Despite living in unimaginable conditions due to war, genocide, disaster and famine they must be giving thanks that they don't have to suffer the deplorable conditions forced upon game developers in the west. They don't know how lucky they are!

I despair sometimes.
My thoughts exactly.
I mean, not to belittle game devs, but dude, if it's really that bad for your mental health, there is always some farm, a mine or a roofing company that's hiring...
 
Ahahahaha. Kotaku.

The company that makes hit peices on content creators simply because they fear thier kind of "journalisim" is endangered by real people doing real reviews.

Excuse me whilst I scoff.
 
A lot of problems today would become obsolete or petty when you compare them to real tragedies around the world. But thats not how societies work. People suffering half a world away are a construct and not at the forefront of your mind when you become agitated because your frontyard roses dont grow as you expect. It doesnt mean that these problems are not real...only that certain geographic and demographic populations have the luxury of not considering such things with any action they take because they are sheltered.

And ignorance of real problems doesnt protect you from problems of your own. Roses not growing accordingly are not worse or equal to children dying of hunger. They just affect you more in your daily life.

Humanity would be "better humans" if we all constantly thought about the people who have less then we do and if we asked ourselves all the time how we could help. But regardless Mander...I m pretty sure you dont do that either so maybe we shouldnt judge from a high horse when we have the means to spend our freetime with chatting each other up on the internet while people in other parts of the world spend most of their waking hours to gather enough food and water to get by eh?
 
But regardless Mander...I m pretty sure you dont do that either so maybe we shouldnt judge from a high horse

1. I'm not that fussed on horses
2. That's a pretty big assumption to make
3. I wont argue the semantics as you obviously have a pretty good grasp of, well... everything. Happy days.
 
Do they need a back rub and a blankie? Or maybe an attorney?
We shouldn't be suprised, I guess. Nowadays people get PTSD from somebody being mean to them on Twitter. :rolleyes:
Where were these people brought up during their maturity? A bubble made of bubble wrap lined with bubble wrap and My Little Pony?
More drivel from a population of sheep that never had any actual hardships or conflict in their lives.
Dear gods it's like the bloody Daily Mail in here.
 
I'm worried that the video game's industry can go on as it has been without a major crash, which is what it desperately needs. If EA, Valve, Ubisoft, and Activision Blizzard are all still here in ten years, it will be a disaster, but not a surprise.

People seem content to hand over ever more money for ever worse gaming experiences, and publishers are of course milking them for all they are worth.

About pricing though, games today are cheap. Very cheap. At least compared to the huge investment. I would gladly pay more if that means that workers gets better contract agreements

In many cases publisher's could easily help their bottom lines by charging less.

I'll have to find the source again, but Valve has stated in the recent past that the optimum revenue point (which is the same as optimum profit, because they aren't selling tangibles here) for games to target is in the ballpark of ~15 USD per license, as this is where diminishing returns are hit in number of units sold multiplied by the price per unit.
 
Dear gods it's like the bloody Daily Mail in here.
Well my specific objection was to the PTSD claim.

A lot of people have tough jobs that cause them life damaging stress and those people have a right to get whatever treatment they need or to demand what ever changes in working conditions they need.

If game company employees start complaining that violence in games is affecting them, they are going to end up with a bunch of friends i dont think they really want and pawns of an agenda set on eliminating their jobs and art.

With recent events in the US there are political forces again seeking to scapegoat video games as causes of violence, so i would advise those in the article claiming PTSD to get in touch with their local fundamentalist minister or republican representative. They want to hear from you :)
 
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Well my specific objection was to the PTSD claim.

A lot of people have tough jobs that cause them life damaging stress and those people have a right to get whatever treatment they need or to demand what ever changes in working conditions they need.

If game company employees start complaining that violence in games is affecting them, they are going to end up with a bunch of friends i dont think they really want and pawns of an agenda set on eliminating their jobs and art.

With recent events in the US there are political forces again seeking to scapegoat video games as causes of violence, so i would advise those in the article claiming PTSD to get in touch with their local fundamentalist minister or republican representative. They want to hear from you :)
I've read through this a couple of times trying to extract the main points from it.

So you acknowledge that some people have difficult jobs, stressful jobs, and that they should have the treatment they need or be able to get changes in working conditions to keep them healthy. That all sounds great.

But you 'object' to the PTSD claim, so what's the objection? That they are experiencing these symptoms at all? You'll be aware of the DSM-V diagnostic criteria for PTSD which, if the assertions made in the article about the Mortal Kombat devs are true, could quite easily be met in their case. It's a common misconception that PTSD can only be experienced by combat veterans (hence it's one of very few mental health conditions the said Daily Mail comments types consider it acceptable for men to suffer from) but it can affect anyone who's exposed to death or violence - including sexual violence - even indirectly. If, as the article claims, Mortal Kombat devs are being exposed to repeated imagery of violence and death then yes, it's absolutely possible for them to be developing PTSD. Long-term exposure to distressing imagery can absolutely cause this. Police officers working on child sexual abuse cases can sit in nice warm offices with tea on tap, plenty of breaks and no shift work - and still develop PTSD from the material they're having to deal with even indirectly.

So, then. "Friends I don't think they really want" and "pawns of an agenda set on eliminating their jobs and art" I take to refer to those arguing that violence in media causes people to become violent. PTSD sufferers rarely become violent in the sense that we usually mean when we say that. They can, it's true, become defensively aggressive if they trigger, but generally they don't arm up and go out looking for a fight. By the way, 'triggering' is something that happens to people with PTSD - even former soldiers: it's where their minds force them to relive the traumatic event due to a similarity of some sort. Hence those much-derided 'trigger warnings' before content of the kind likely to be at the root of a PTSD case. Murder; ; gunfire; explosions; suicide; etc - all recognised PTSD triggers. But no, the acknowledgement of PTSD symptoms occurring in game developers isn't going to provide evidence to have violent games banned. If what's claimed to be happening with the Mortal Kombat case is actually happening then the problem is not "this game is violent". The problem is, "These devs are being made to watch actual scenes of real-life violence when it's not necessary."

Because it's not necessary. We can all imagine violence. We don't need to draw it from real-life examples.

That doesn't make the 'violent games cause violence' argument go away, of course - all I'm saying is that acknowledging the MK situation specifically doesn't go any way towards proving that argument.

As for the US, well firstly it's not the centre of the universe; and more importantly, the focus on games is kind of being overshadowed by the focus on gun control at the moment.

In the end, though, this comes down to two basic questions. Do you believe the devs who are reporting the issues? And, acknowledging that they may be telling the truth, is the game they're making worth sacrificing their wellbeing? Because a lot of publishers, and a terrifying number of gamers, seem to be quite happy for other people to pay that price for their entertainment.

No, I'm not opposed to violent games. Make your violent games. Play your violent games, by all means. But don't force people through crunch conditions; don't make people work in an environment of fear; and don't expose your staff to images of real-life violence and death for the sake of an unnecessary degree of 'realism'.
 
But you 'object' to the PTSD claim, so what's the objection?
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Because given the history of the game industry and the debate around violence in video games it seems to me calculated to get a certain kind of sympathy and attention. Read the news today.
If they are actually having symptoms, they need to either get different jobs, treatment and leave or both.
 
If they are actually having symptoms, they need to either get different jobs, treatment and leave or both.

Or simply move to a different company. It's not like there is some kind of shortage of software developer jobs nowadays, the average developer gets like 5 interview offers on linkedin per week without lifting a finger. In fact it may be one of the few professions where companies need to hound for workers, and not the other way around.
 
If they are actually having symptoms, they need to either get different jobs, treatment and leave or both.
Well, yeah - they could certainly do those things, assuming they're not working in a highly competitive industry and need their job for money to buy food and stuff. Or - and here's another possible solution - NetherRealm (or whoever) could not make their devs research real-life murders and hangings in the name of unnecessary research.

Because that isn't normal. It's not a normal working situation.
 
Because given the history of the game industry and the debate around violence in video games it seems to me calculated to get a certain kind of sympathy and attention.

Is that what you’d say to a war veteran, given the history of shell shock/battle fatigue/PTSD or whatever name they’ve been giving it since WWI?
 
Because that isn't normal. It's not a normal working situation.
It certainly doesnt sound anything like normal to me.
OTOH i would hate to see some kind of precedent set. Games are arguably art and in art the one with the vision should get to dictate the process, maybe especially if its a little outre.
 
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