I haven't tried PP2 yet, but in any situation I think blockading a solar system is an utterly wacky idea, which shouldn't be possible in anything remotely like a space sim.
The Open v Solo v Groups thread
- Thread starter Ozric
- Start date
Yeah because usually enemy groups stay in the same PG. Come on that's so biased you feel a little bit ashamed yourself to even say it ahahah
Forcing Open Only (or in other ways inconvenience non-open PP players) is moot. People WILL use technical tricks, both in and out of game, to avoid instancing with you. And the only way to curb this is with dedicated servers which Frontier will not do due to the involved costs (Why else make this game peer to peer and also shirk on usage of TURN relays?).
Out of morbid curiosity, how long was your blockade of George Lucas being maintained. Because out of the eleven(?) visits to George Lucas since PP 2.0 started, all of which were in Open, I was only attacked once. Granted, that one time was a successful kill, but it was at the end of very brief session, so it probably cost me all of five minutes. Furthermore, when I respawned, it was pretty obvious I was in a completely new instance.
Which was I pity, because I wanted to make a second attempt at running the blockade before I needed to log out. It was the first time I'd ever needed to leave a station under hostile fire, and I realized I'd made a few mistakes with my first attempt.
If people who want PvP, won't stay in the same PvP group as you - then the problem isn't the game.
And again: biased knowing to do so and well aware to do so.
Check what Socrates and Plato used to say about sofists. Google it. Free lesson in philosophy.
PP2 is clearly designed for Open Play. It's in the UI, the description of the activities, the game mechanics.
It will never be Open Only because FDev lacks the courage because of your kind of players.
Which, btw, I believe it's the main reason this game has always be less than half successful it should have been, btw.
Especially today. Especially in the twitch era.
Beware the day FDev hires a guy who knows their stuff about MMOs. The very next day this game will become Open about affecting the galaxy and PG/Solo for building up your character.
But don't fret man. As I said many times before: your kind already won. 10 years of constantly defending the indefensible probably not playing the game anymore or at least knowing a very small part of the game itself did the trick.
I will just pick a small victory up. Always said that Powerplay 2 would have been something very good for the game, making lots of people playing together for a purpose.
If I remember well, you and many others always said that it shouldn't have been a priority, that was beating a dead horse, that the game needed even more nice stuff for the single explorer (for example) etc etc etc.
Well considering how Powerplay 2 is faring until now... Maybe we could be right for open too.
And you lot be wrong. Again. (As usual)
I'm not against this game having a PvP feature in future, but I disagree with the statement "PP2 is clearly designed for Open play". From what I've learned of it so far, it clearly isn't. There was hype, and some people convinced themselves it was going to be, but it's turned out that they're wrong.And again: biased knowing to do so and well aware to do so.
Check what Socrates and Plato used to say about sofists. Google it. Free lesson in philosophy.
PP2 is clearly designed for Open Play. It's in the UI, the description of the activities, the game mechanics.
It will never be Open Only because FDev lacks the courage because of your kind of players.
Which, btw, I believe it's the main reason this game has always be less than half successful it should have been, btw.
Especially today. Especially in the twitch era.
Beware the day FDev hires a guy who knows their stuff about MMOs. The very next day this game will become Open about affecting the galaxy and PG/Solo for building up your character.
But don't fret man. As I said many times before: your kind already won. 10 years of constantly defending the indefensible probably not playing the game anymore or at least knowing a very small part of the game itself did the trick.
I will just pick a small victory up. Always said that Powerplay 2 would have been something very good for the game, making lots of people playing together for a purpose.
If I remember well, you and many others always said that it shouldn't have been a priority, that was beating a dead horse, that the game needed even more nice stuff for the single explorer (for example) etc etc etc.
Well considering how Powerplay 2 is faring until now... Maybe we could be right for open too.
And you lot be wrong. Again. (As usual)
Again: it's the only way to resist an acquisition where only one power is involved. And the UI itself tells you that.
Then we have the rebuy bonuses.
If it's not that proof then I don't know what we are even talking about.
That said, I do not expect to see Powerplay limited to open play. I wish at least to see a big bonus for open players , so that more people is driven to play open.
And discover by themselves that most of times even being destroyed by your enemy is not that bad.
Been destroyed yesterday by hauling. Well, more like destroyed myself against a station by trying to run away.
Had fun. Talked with the guys that killed me, nice lads. Simply we were playing for different sides.
Oh and my self-esteem was not hurt, neither I did feel abused or anything else.
Organic PvP interactions. Wonderful.
Had the game been open only, I would likely not bought it in the first place. If I had bought it as open only, I do not think that I would have lasted long and given up. And certainly not bought another account.
As an almost only solo player, I have no gripes (other than being able to identify the faction doing unto me) about someone undermining my BGS in solo. I can chose how much I want to put into the game, and if I lose, sad, but there is plenty to do.
Had the game been open only I probably wouldn't have bought it originally either, but had it been BGS/PP open only it probably wouldn't have been a buying decision at all because while the BGS became my main motivation to keep playing, supporting a faction wasn't something I considered before buying.
I rarely meet other Cmdrs while playing unless I go to a hotspot. I'm not greatly motivated towards being a team player, I just do my own thing & still do, probably much like you Steve.
But in faction support or powerplay I have found there to be a significant motivation to find out who my opposition is, and for them to be able to 'discover' that I am opposing them & why. Not because of any notion that I am some great combat pilot that can intimidate or scare them away (ime that tends to lead to protracted hostility & resentment) but because it's a lot harder to stomp all over a territory when you know it's current residents aren't evil incarnate, they are just other Cmdrs that work hard too.
Meeting face to face is a great starter to diplomatic relations. Some people are just jerks but playing in the same space is a good way to find those that aren't too, if you don't mind taking a chance on that initially confrontational meeting. It's a part of the game I enjoy.
Oh I am not talking about the game as a whole to be open only, don't get me wrong. Even if I am radical about it for myself I understand that you can't force that.
But we have now the possibility to differentiate between two modes. By BGS (for all the modes) and Powerplay (for open).
But again. I don't count on that. But at least let's not defend what cannot be defended using semantics. It's almost 10 years some people repeat the same old 4 phrases. Powerplay will never be open only. At least should be "open weighted".
I think it would be unreasonable for FDev to take a part of the game that (rightly or wrongly) has been available to all modes & restrict it to Open only. I do firmly believe there could & should be a part of the game that provides some incentive that rewards combat skills directly against opposing players and that were it not for the legacy of being previously available to all, PowerPlay would have been a good fit for that. I'd encourage anyone taking part to do so in Open but I don't think those that don't want to to be forced to do so or miss out on something they had before.
I certainly do agree that PP looks to have been designed with the potential for PvP in mind, but FDev are sending mixed messages here & there will always be some that will take advantage of any discrepancy between the letter of the rules & the spirit intended.
There is no such thing as the spirit of the rules though, only the letter & some will take every advantage whether that be to 'hide' in PG/Solo or to use the excuse that because a player is in open they are a fair game for hostilities.
Also, rewarding PvP (or rewarding being in open) is open to abuse (eg organised fixed PvP fights that affect the scores in a cynical way, or use of blocklists & Router IP filters to avoid instancing matches).
I play in open because I am incentivised to. I want to meet other players to make friends, team up with strangers, find out why certain things are happening in my territory without going outside the immersive game environment. Not because of some financial or tactical advantage. I explore in Open too, not because I want to shoot any other explorers I meet but because I can see where my fellow open playing friends are on the galaxy map & maybe team up with them. I also have the option to evade any 'baddies' I have on my friendlist too, just as I'm sure you do with the other PP players you meet.
Agree, but the only way to incentivize it is a big buff with merits. +50%? Double?
But it needs to be done. Map filters btw are a great way to spot easily where you can find action, yes you need to learn how to use it but I think it's a game skill as any other nobody can say it's too difficult to do. (Even if it's slightly bugged to be honest, but again, it's just the third cycle and there's some much more relevant bugs, like the infamous infinite power data issue which has not been shamefully solved yet).
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
That would depend on how much Frontier would like to insult those who don't choose to engage in PvP in a game where other players, and therefore PvP, are an optional extra.
50% bonus to merits for open would be an optional extra as well.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Functionally equivalent to a penalty for not playing in Open.
It would be a disaster.
The most benign possibility would be people flying in Solo and relogging to Open to hand in. The only bad effect there would be the bugs FD would introduce trying to stop it. Imagine the salt from real Open players whose merits got reduced because the game wrongly flagged them as having been in Solo. Or even the salt from people who imagine this has happened to them.
If FD did manage to fix that kind of workaround, it would provide an incentive to play in Open while doing the opposite of everything the "Port Forwarding Thread" says, or play in Open while blocking every hollow square. Our P2P instancing in Open would get much worse than it is now, to put it mildly.
Open play needs to remain something you do because you enjoy it and you want to.
Last edited:
You see that as a penalty, other people might see it as a reward for deciding to play in a strategically more problematic way. Higher danger = higher rewards. Right now Open Players are punished by being necessarily less effective. It's all about a matter of perspective.
Most of the activities are rewarded in real time. Commodities could be tagged until player relog in something outside open. Might be easy to do. We don't know really.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Indeed - noting that we all bought a game where in-the-same-instance PvP is optional, even if some can't really accept that and want those who don't engage in it to be penalised for choosing not to let others engage them in it.
Put differently, some of the players who share the galaxy want others who share it to have their contributions towards changes to the shared environment to count less just because they prefer an optional play-style.