Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread - Mk III

Do you want a Open PvE

  • Yes, I want a Open PvE

    Votes: 54 51.4%
  • No, I don't want a Open PvE

    Votes: 49 46.7%
  • I want only Open PvE and PvP only in groups

    Votes: 2 1.9%

  • Total voters
    105
  • Poll closed .
Status
Thread Closed: Not open for further replies.

Yaffle

Volunteer Moderator
Hello all

Reading this is getting painful. Any more personal remarks or sniping will result in infractions, not a friendly PM.

Also, while I am here, please avoid 'carebear'' and 'psycho', as well as 'easy mode' and similar. It's all pejorative and baiting.

Now, continue, but both sides please play nice.
 
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I have no one idea what your vision of PvP is about. Despite playing many different games including the dreaded Eve recently PvP has been the best part of the game.

Elite could enjoy the same benefits - competitive and PvP players cooperating or opposing each other directly for goals.

There is a large market like me ready for a directly competitive space game.

ED would do well to accommodate us.

Given how about every game not named EVE that tried to appease to that open PvP crowd either burned or crashed or settled as a niche title, I somehow doubt the potential public is as large as you say.

I will grant you one thing, though: PvP players know how to make their presence felt.

For my part, I keep to my previous opinion: if, in a game, anyone can force me into a PvP situation against my wishes, I'm simply not playing that game, regardless of how good it otherwise is. I will never be the content to the kind of player that apparently is only able to get enjoyment from a game if he is destroying it for others. And I backed ED exactly because I was promised a game where I would be able to do everything in the game while only meeting players I choose to meet, thus I will never settle for any proposal that would give players that completely eschew PvP any kind of handicap or disadvantage.




But that still wouldn't satisfy the PVP campaigners because - background SIM.

They've made it clear they want something separate but it's equally clear that FD are having enough trouble as it is with one background SIM - 2 or more would be unworkable.

You'd end up with branching story lines which would require different newsletters, additions, background tweaking etc. etc.

When you look at it from that pov it's obvious why FD have said nothing is changing..

Yep. From the moment Frontier decided to manually influence in how the Galaxy develops and, more important, use out of game resources to make the in-game Galaxy feel more alive, they mostly sealed the game's future as one with a single galaxy simulation.

Kinda like the issues with instancing; they chose a networking model that is very bad at preventing players from blocking each other, so now they would be hard-pressed to make instances unavoidable even if they wanted to try.
 
Yep. From the moment Frontier decided to manually influence in how the Galaxy develops and, more important, use out of game resources to make the in-game Galaxy feel more alive, they mostly sealed the game's future as one with a single galaxy simulation.

Kinda like the issues with instancing; they chose a networking model that is very bad at preventing players from blocking each other, so now they would be hard-pressed to make instances unavoidable even if they wanted to try.

Suspicious minds might almost come to the conclusion that they intend for things to be the way they are. ;)
 
They did listen, they gave you CQC, now you want more? It is like the old saying about giving an inch and they will demand a mile.


yes.
history has taught us about appeasing the bully in the area.

chamberlain-and-halifax.jpg
 
yes.
history has taught us about appeasing the bully in the area.

View attachment 55600
I'm a little disappointed, for a second i thought this thread would succumb to godwins law. It's close, but no cigar.

Edit: My knowledge of history is almost as bad as my research skills, do this qualify as Godwins law if it's only implied? I need a more knowledgeable man than I to answer.
 
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I'm a little disappointed, for a second i thought this thread would succumb to godwins law. It's close, but no cigar.

Edit: My knowledge of history is almost as bad as my research skills, do this qualify as Godwins law if it's only implied? I need a more knowledgeable man than I to answer.

i think that if anyone made a serious attempt at invoking godwins law here they would be banned and the post(s) would be removed.

and even if those two things didn't happen this thread may have enough momentum that it wouldn't work.
but it is tempting to try.
 
I'm a little disappointed, for a second i thought this thread would succumb to godwins law. It's close, but no cigar.

Edit: My knowledge of history is almost as bad as my research skills, do this qualify as Godwins law if it's only implied? I need a more knowledgeable man than I to answer.

i think that if anyone made a serious attempt at invoking godwins law here they would be banned and the post(s) would be removed.

and even if those two things didn't happen this thread may have enough momentum that it wouldn't work.
but it is tempting to try.

I've been waiting for the enactment of Godwin's Law since the first mega thread.
I was quite shocked when it didn't happen. By the time we got to this incarnation of the mega, I'd forgotten all about it.

Only 2 real possibilities exist as far as I see it;

1) We've created the exception to the rule
2) The Mod Team have ninja'd any and all references before anyone had a chance to read them (or any comments leading that way)

I'm 90% leaning towards number 2 myself.
 
I've been waiting for the enactment of Godwin's Law since the first mega thread.
I was quite shocked when it didn't happen. By the time we got to this incarnation of the mega, I'd forgotten all about it.

Only 2 real possibilities exist as far as I see it;

1) We've created the exception to the rule
2) The Mod Team have ninja'd any and all references before anyone had a chance to read them (or any comments leading that way)

I'm 90% leaning towards number 2 myself.

Meh...there is no reason to invoke Godwins law in this thread. Why? Because there was no private mode available at that time....since it was all Open PvP. Believe me that if there was a way to Private mode every government would take the opportunity to use it and make their life easier and safer! ;P
 
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Well certain people got what they want .. to shut down the thread topic request for an Open PVE mode, but they can't shutdown the valid reasoning for one or the momentum of those requesting.
 
Well certain people got what they want .. to shut down the thread topic request for an Open PVE mode, but they can't shutdown the valid reasoning for one or the momentum of those requesting.

That's an advantage the PVPers have: if a game has not enough PVP for them, they can raid the forums and start some "Forum-PVP"

May I humbly ask for / suggest a coop-/PVE-mode for the forums? :D
 
That's an advantage the PVPers have: if a game has not enough PVP for them, they can raid the forums and start some "Forum-PVP"

May I humbly ask for / suggest a coop-/PVE-mode for the forums? :D


I'm not going to blanket blame PVPers though. Some have no issue with it, some are all for it... as long as it is a separate server and BGS. Some hate the idea and think it will cause more to leave open, and some think it is a good idea
 
I am not truly one for MMO games; specifically, because life is truly its own version of PvP as in many tople over others to feel dominant, get what they want, or simply to get ahead. Life in your career is trully a grind. However, my reality is that my career involves dealing with people when they are at their very worst condition... people who are disputing with others, family, friends, or just simply business partners, and when transactions have gone really bad. I am a litigator by day, and gamer by night, thus life during the day is always PvP. Why gaming? It is a safe outlet for an old man like me with a wife and two kids. So my outlet for stress day to day is limited to exercising during my lunch hour and gaming when I come home. Gaming keeps my mind busy to wind down from work because it requires focus to engage, and gives me something to do with my kids before they go to bed, which is about the time I get home each night from the office. Bottom line, the last experience I want is the stress of being "ganked", harassed, cheated by certain players, or just simply become the target of another player with no other intention but impunity.

ED is an incredible game, an open world game like nothing else before, and I direly wanted to try it out and enjoy the experience it had to offer when I first looked into purchasing the game; however, honestly, I would not even have given it a try if it weren't for its Solo mode. It is what opened up my opportunity to play the game without worry or stress of that experience being sullied by unwanted engagement. However, I just don't understand why there are these factions over the issue of Solo and Open World. Life is way to short, and way to serious to form an opinion, negative or disconcerting over another's play choice being that on his/her own or that amongst others. Also, why can I not engage and partake in the world as a whole, and also contribute to the world as a whole simply because I am not contributing in Open amongst others, whether it is PP or just in game play time? Why must I, or any other person who wants to play Solo, be marked as a lessor person simply because I, or others who share my position, do not want to lose what precious time to play by being the target of that one player from time to time that may very well appear in my radar whose only intention is to make my gameplay time miserable. I wholly respect what others want, and that includes those players who want to partake in the Open and chase down other players for their sense of glory, or even superiority in combat, or to role play their "pirate" in them. However, why do I have to conform to that desire to be a potential victim of their desired gameplay and be wrong, or less of a person, for my own desire of not participating in that world? Why shouldn't people who want to play apart from Open also have the opportunity to contribute to the world as a whole, even in Power Play? When you get down to the "brass tax", all PP points are by majority acrued through destroying NPC ships, not other player ships, whether by interdicting or by PP CZ's, and most PP cargo haulers are Interdicting more often by NPCs than player. The ratio of NPC to Player interaction in PP is clearly in favor of the NPC ships that people generally amass the bulk of their points in Power Play?

I do spend the bulk of my time in Solo, and simply so I can avoid what may only the potential for those unpleasant experiences, but what is enough for me to not want to experience a game altogether if alternatives are not offered to preserve my preference of gameplay. And I don't see why my contribution through Solo should be nullified or reduced in the game as a whole simply for that choice. For lack of a PvE mode in game, and to experience the game with other players risk free from otherwise a potential poor experience, I joined Mobius so I can play in a safe world where I have the option to meet and engage another commander and play along side of him or her as a wing for a joint purpose or just for in game companionship. And in that group, I have the choice to engage in PvP by restrictions of that group to certain areas of gameplay. However, what I feel ED misses, which others have touched upon and I reiterated in the aforemtioned sentence, is an Open PvE, whereas players can play with others without the concern of non-concensual PvP.

The final problem with PvP, obviously excepting the unfair competition of hacking by cheating players which is beyond reproach and already has the eyes of Frontier first and foremost, is the imbalance of ship builds to survive PvP engagements making even those arbitrary PvP encounters almost a sure death to any PvE commander. I know how to handle my ship, I have been predominantly playing this game for the purpose of combat and bounty hunting PvE pirates, but ship builds in PvE are completely separate and apart from ship builds in PvP, which afford a PvP player a significant build advantage over the PvE build pirate. Essentially, to engage in PvP your ship must be kitted in a manner more prevelent and supportive of PvP, and PvE different for PvE, and of course as we all know, pure trading ships are easy targets regardless of their bulid.

The point of my post isn't to bash or otherwise categorize PvP players as sharing a joint purpose of malcontent. Obviously, that couldn't be further from the truth. It is just that select few in respect to the whole whose sole intention is to ruin another player's experience for me is best avoided by not partaking and Solo offers that solution. Problem is that with every MMO, those select few are many in numbers when you consider the count of the entire gamer base, and even many more when you consider those who may hack or cheat the system for advantage. For that reason, I primarily stay in Solo, and I do not believe that this discretion on my part should be contemplated anything more than simply as my choice of play in the eyes of others. Most importantly, if it weren't for that option, I would have never purchased Elite Dangerous, and my 9 year old son would not be allowed to play Elite Dangerous with me. So the point of this long winded, verbose post is to express to everyone else on behalf of myself, and any other person who primarily spends their time in Solo, is we are just gaming for a different experience, an experience we enjoy. Our choice not to participate in a world subjecting us to an aspect of gameplay we wish not to experience does not mean that we don't deserve that same experience as those who choose to engage in PvP by discounting, restricting or limiting the scope and contribution of Solo.

Thank you for taking the time to read my contribution.
 
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The point of my post isn't to bash or otherwise categorize PvP players as sharing a joint purpose of malcontent. Obviously, that couldn't be further from the truth. It is just that select few in respect to the whole whose sole intention is to ruin another player's experience for me is best avoided by not partaking and Solo offers that solution. Problem is that with every MMO, those select few are many in numbers when you consider the count of the entire gamer base, and even many more when you consider those who may hack or cheat the system for advantage. For that reason, I primarily stay in Solo, and I do not believe that this discretion on my part should be contemplated anything more than simply as my choice of play in the eyes of others. Most importantly, if it weren't for that option, I would have never purchased Elite Dangerous, and my 9 year old son would not be allowed to play Elite Dangerous with me. So the point of this long winded, verbose post is to express to everyone else on behalf of myself, and any other person who primarily spends their time in Solo, is we are just gaming for a different experience, an experience we enjoy. Our choice not to participate in a world subjecting us to an aspect of gameplay we wish not to experience does not mean that we don't deserve that same experience as those who choose to engage in PvP by discounting, restricting or limiting the scope and contribution of Solo.

Thank you for taking the time to read my contribution.


You are part of the reason groups like Mobius exist and why some of us are trying to push for a PVE mode
 
I'm not going to blanket blame PVPers though. Some have no issue with it, some are all for it... as long as it is a separate server and BGS. Some hate the idea and think it will cause more to leave open, and some think it is a good idea

I don't think an Open-PVE-mode would cause more players to leave open - and I think such a mode would be a good idea.

And I don't understand the wish for a separate BGS. When I was trading I was running a trade route between rich high pop stations. I could trade all day with my 80 ton cargo ASP without the prices changing at all - with supply and demand staying in the high 10s of thousands. The influence of a single player on such stations is minuscule. And doing missions for the minor powers to get some rank with the feds and the empire did not change that minor power's influence in the systems as well.
I did not participate in PP - don't know how large a single player's influence is there.

At the moment I am out in the uninhabited space to do some exploring. On some occasions I spent literally hours making little changes to the position of my ship and playing around with the debug camera until I had the right perspective and lighting for a good looking screenshot (have done this occasionally while trading as well) - so flying in coop with me would imply being very patient. :D
This is one of the reasons I purely play solo.
 
...Some hate the idea and think it will cause more to leave open, ...

I think some will leave open as well.
Mainly those who wanted PvE and didn't know about the Mobius Group.

I'd actually settle for an information screen on the main menu explaining about PvE groups and letting people know their choices, not just a list of modes people blindly click on and hope for the best. Seen way too many threads from people going Solo Mode when there is no need for it.
I'd still prefer a true Open PvE mode, but I could settle for the above.
 
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