Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread - Part the Second [Now With Added Platforms].

[Robert Maynard]

Which is why I dislike Shield Cells especially because it makes other modules useless and ruins the fun of PVP and PVE.

From the point of view of a player intent to avoid combat, I would expect that Shield Cells are a blessing....

If every PvP encounter ends in one ship being destroyed then it's not going to be much fun for traders in larger dedicated trading ships.

 

[TheSpaceTexan]

From the point of view of a player intent to avoid combat, I would expect that Shield Cells are a blessing....

If every PvP encounter ends in one ship being destroyed then it's not going to be much fun for traders in larger dedicated trading ships.

It's an awful blessing and an awful curse. As of right now friend, Shield Cells help certain ships TOO much, and makes the game overall feel too easy. But this is why we buy expensive shields that's what they are intended for! That's what Armour is for! It kinda is defeating the purpose of buying expensive armor, shields and hull reinforcements.

If they really wanted to keep them around, make them just a temporary boost and have it degrade quickly, not a permanent stature.

Edit: Or better yet, help them recharge your shields when they're down. THAT would be the best compromise to the whole shield cell problem. Only allow them to help bring back your shields up.

 

[SteveLaw]

... is why certain modes right now, unfortunately, are better than others.

...for different things.

This represents the biggest reason that this goes round and round - by and large those calling for change speak in absolutes, vague claims and generalisations to the point where their arguments make no sense or actually make them look paranoid.

 

[TheSpaceTexan]

...for different things.

This represents the biggest reason that this goes round and round is that generally speaking those calling for change speak in absolutes, vague claims and generalisations to the point where their arguments make no sense actually make them look paranoid.

It's just a work in progress Steve, wouldn't you want AIs to interdict you more and try to interact with you? It feels like some things are genuinely lacking and some of the things I've said, could greatly make me play more of Private and solo. (I want more NPC interaction basically.) But I want occupied Space to feel fluent and lively. Not empty and not full of danger.

Aside from Power Play, Background Simulator and shield cells, every single one of those updates is like a god sent gift from above.

 

[SteveLaw]

It's just a work in progress Steve, wouldn't you want AIs to interdict you more and try to interact with you? It feels like some things are genuinely lacking and some of the things I've said, could greatly make me play more of Private and solo. (I want more NPC interaction basically.)
Aside from Power Play, Background Simulator and shield cells, every single one of those updates is like a god sent gift from above.

None of those things have anything to do with this thread though. They are the same in all modes. Shield cells are more noticeable in open only because certain players (PvP orientated players for the most part) abuse them to death. I don't use them at all. They have nothing specifically to do with the game modes. The problem there, as with most of the problems raised here, is with other players, not the game itself. But the game is expected to jump through hoops because of how a fraction of the player base have decided to play, rightly or wrongly. It would just be nice for more players to acknowledge this instead of blaming the game or developer. The problems that need to be fixed are mostly caused by other players.

 

[Jordan Cobalt]

From the point of view of a player intent to avoid combat, I would expect that Shield Cells are a blessing....

If every PvP encounter ends in one ship being destroyed then it's not going to be much fun for traders in larger dedicated trading ships.

I have yet to encounter a trade ship with shield cells, hell a lot don't even carry shields. Cells effect pirates and bounty hunters infinitely more than pirates and traders.

 

[TheSpaceTexan]

None of those things have anything to do with this thread though. They are the same in all modes. Shield cells are more noticeable in open only because certain players (PvP orientated players for the most part) abuse them to death. I don't use them at all. They have nothing specifically to do with the game modes. The problem there, as with most of the problems raised here, is with other players, not the game itself. But the game is expected to jump through hoops because of how a fraction of the player base have decided to play, rightly or wrongly. It would just be nice for more players to acknowledge this instead of blaming the game or developer. The problems that need to be fixed are mostly caused by other players.

No, Shield Cells are noticeable across all the fields. It makes certain builds the one to topple them all. Why ever use chaff, heatsinks, etc. when you can use boosters and shield cells instead? Going back to what this thread stands for, I'm sure you can agree that this shouldn't be the case. I personally believe, that it gives the player too much leniency, when it really shouldn't.

The problem I'm actually beginning to see is again, that its not really about the three modes, its about how the three modes do certain things. Like I'm telling you, if NPCs had more interactions (Better and for worse) during System wars, Conflict zones, Community Goals, the latter, then this game would be amazing and no one would really have to complain about anything. Yes it is jumping through hoops right now, and it currently isn't doing so well at it. Like you, I'm a bit torn as to where this game wants to go. It wants to bring out wings, but I can't pay NPCs to help escort me or fight other NPC wings. It wants to bring Power Play (That is I should remind you and this thread) orientated to being a competition among its own members and other Powers, instead of believing for a cause and working together to make sound decisions to further your Power's Influence. I fear, its a little bit of both the player's faults and the game's mechanics.

 

[SteveLaw]

No, Shield Cells are noticeable across all the fields.

Are you sure? How do you know what builds everyone else is using in Solo or Private Groups? And what does it matter to you?

I don't care how other players play the game, as long as I have the option to avoid them, why do you?

NPCs are being improved all the time, we've seen this. Sarah Jane can only add so much behaviour at a time, this is delicate stuff, you can't just make sweeping changes to the AI in one go without gradual, extensive testing. Every improvement she's made has been universally praised as far as I've seen. That's just a matter of time and patience.

 

[TheSpaceTexan]

Are you sure? How do you know what builds everyone else is using in Solo or Private Groups? And what does it matter to you?

I don't care how other players play the game, as long as I have the option to avoid them, why do you?

NPCs are being improved all the time, we've seen this. Sarah Jane can only add so much behaviour at a time, this is delicate stuff, you can't just make sweeping changes to the AI in one go without gradual, extensive testing. Every improvement she's made has been universally praised as far as I've seen. That's just a matter of time and patience.

Let me just start off by saying, that I am not looking at this as a Open Player kind of thing. I know you solely play in Solo Mode and I'm respecting that. I'm looking at all scenarios like a Developer would and I'm throwing down suggestions to what I think would suit the vision that Frontier is attempting to Pursue in a Ship or Combat style in general. The game as of now gives a very vague answer of what each module does, be it weapons be it armor, be it utilities. We don't have 'real stats' and early on, I realized that I actually had to look up and discover what tailored to me being able to play.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=140240
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=138536
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=137188

With the thanks of these thread popping up, a newer player can say "Huh, I don't necessarily need this and that, since most of these aren't entirely tied into the Situation". It also tells newer players "Huh, I really don't need chaff, because it doesn't provide much use to this and that, when I can just simply use boosters and shield cell banks to get me back up to speed". It makes certain modules not worth buying anymore. It's pretty damn bad.

It makes the game entirely too easy for players and makes certain ships undesirable compared to others.


Edit: Now on to the bit that we all care about, Sarah Jane has proven to us and the community in general that it is entirely possible to make us care about the NPCs and how they interact with us. To this date, I don't think I've seen any other game do that well as she has been doing so far. That is why I am so optimistic of the future, because we'll have a living, breathing and thriving galaxy. She is making it come to life. She has proven that she can basically balance the game by doing simply that. As such, I want that, NO I NEED THAT IN MY LIIIIIFEEEE.

 

[Robert Maynard]

It's an awful blessing and an awful curse. As of right now friend, Shield Cells help certain ships TOO much, and makes the game overall feel too easy. But this is why we buy expensive shields that's what they are intended for! That's what Armour is for! It kinda is defeating the purpose of buying expensive armor, shields and hull reinforcements.

If they really wanted to keep them around, make them just a temporary boost and have it degrade quickly, not a permanent stature.

Edit: Or better yet, help them recharge your shields when they're down. THAT would be the best compromise to the whole shield cell problem. Only allow them to help bring back your shields up.

The fact that shield cells are considered to help some ships too much is simply the result of a combination of available internal slots and available power - all ships can benefit to a certain degree, depending on outfit. To expect to "balance" all ships and all equipment permutations so that no one ship would have a possible "beats them all" equipment load out would, I expect, be a fruitless search / impossible task.

 

[TheSpaceTexan]

The fact that shield cells are considered to help some ships too much is simply the result of a combination of available internal slots and available power - all ships can benefit to a certain degree, depending on outfit. To expect to "balance" all ships and all equipment permutations so that no one ship would have a possible "beats them all" equipment load out would, I expect, be a fruitless search / impossible task.

I agree, some ships should benefit, but not as they are now. Excuse me while I copy-paste-steal my own post. I think its relevant here. Again it destroys buying certain modules and makes it a simple case of "How long can you outlast the other player". There needs to be a reason to buy Chaff, to buy heatsinks, to buy hull armor, etc. Shield Cells and boosters right now, aren't allowing for that. Shield Cell Banks and Shield Boosters, don't allow that and just simply say it's better to invest in shields and hope they stay up long to either take out your opponents' shields or haul ass.

I believe scaling this according to ALL ships across the board is the best and sound solution. They need to struggle to run SCBs and Shield Boosters as to allow diverse and new options to flourish.

Also from what I've noticed, boosters make shields recharge slower yeah? If that is set in stone, (meaning you can't turn off the boosters) then we literally have a solution right there in our faces. It would make things a whole lot better. Especially when it doesn't necessarily recharge ALL of your shields little recharging little thingamabob. Just a small, but noticeable percentage. Keep the same spin-up and heat as the current SCBs too.

That'll liven up everything and make things a whole lot better. It'll make buying modules like Hull-Reinforcements and Armor worth it.

Trying out new builds and diversifying your ship, should in turn, help you win.

 

[Robert Maynard]

It makes the game entirely too easy for players and makes certain ships undesirable compared to others.

Removing them would simply change which ships would be best and which best avoided for combat.

Anyway, this thread is about Solo vs Open vs Groups - not "The Merits (or not) of Shield Cells", it would be best to remain on-topic for this thread and restrict discussions on equipment to more appropriate thread(s).

 

[SteveLaw]

Technically the only difference is Other Players (tm), that's all the modes are, a filter on who you play with, but these other players effect different parts of the game in different ways.

 

[Asp Explorer]

Technically the only difference is Other Players (tm), that's all the modes are, a filter on who you play with, but these other players effect different parts of the game in different ways.

You would not believe how many people completely, and utterly, fail to comprehend this.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Please remember to keep to the topic at hand, referring to the OP for a reminder, if necessary.

 

[fademist]

Please remember to keep to the topic at hand, referring to the OP for a reminder, if necessary.

we had some cuts i guess lol;p

 

[TheSpaceTexan]

The Game Mechanics are being forced to compromise to the three gamemodes, which isn't entirely bad, but it isn't being done well. Which is why we have discussions about why One side is unhappy about the other side.

 

[SteveLaw]

The Game Mechanics are being forced to compromise to the three mechanics, which isn't entirely bad, but it isn't being done well. Which is why we have discussions about why One side is unhappy about the other side.

The game's mechanics don't change between modes. The debate is about whether they should or not. It's the players who feel they are having to compromise.

 

[TheSpaceTexan]

The game's mechanics don't change between modes. The debate is about whether they should or not. It's the players who feel they are having to compromise.

Welcome back to the literal start of this!
It isn't being done well, which is the problem.

 

[W0OCQCK]

The Game Mechanics are being forced to compromise to the three mechanics, which isn't entirely bad, but it isn't being done well. Which is why we have discussions about why One side is unhappy about the other side.

Your entitled to your opinion. But all I'm getting is just simply one small part of the player base is unhappy, and because of this you are doing everything possible to ruin player's like myself playing experience.
I think it's being done brilliantly. I understand you are of a difference of opinion.