Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread - Part the Second [Now With Added Platforms].

[TheSpaceTexan]

Like four combat ships attacking one unarmed trader?

Good thing I know you don't advocate Combat Logging, but I mean, it kinda raises the question as why there isn't a mechanic to kinda combat that, where the ship just turns to an AI of the Player and returns them to the nearest station in the system. Or if they're out say exploring, it just drops them into an area of relative safety.

Just those in general who profess to only ever play Open but then claim to know everything about Solo. Have you tried pledging to a Power and flying in enemy controlled systems?

I have, and I still haven't encountered much resistance at all. Which is why I'm relatively confused. More or less jealous if anything.

 

[DarkWalker]

That too - given that players successfully sought refunds when Offline mode was cancelled. Given that the inclusion in the stated game design of the three game modes and the ability to switch between them predates the addition of Offline to the Kickstarter pitch, I would expect that there would be even more unhappy backers.... I very much doubt that Frontier would wish to endure that again.

Predates the addition of Offline, and is even now being advertised in interviews and such. Plus, the Solo mode, and the possibility of using that same Solo commander to try the game in Open, was pointed as an olive branch to Offline players when that mode was removed. If Frontier limit mode switching in any way, or restrict Solo in any way, the consequences would likely be far worse than those of the removal of offline.

Plus, they have another elephant in the room in that, apparently due to Microsoft policy, they can't allow XBox players that don't have a Live Gold subscription to play Open at all. Any restriction on solo, or on mode switching, would cause hard-to-solve issues for the XBox version; for example, would someone that started playing on Solo due to lack of a subscription, but wanted to play in Open all along, be forced to start anew when he finally subscribes to Live? What would happen with someone that was playing on Open but let his Live subscription lapse? The XBox version shares the same galaxy as the PC version, it should be added.

 

[SteveLaw]

Because I think if they WERE faced with that ultimatum, they would ultimately admit that the benefits of open outweigh the occasional hassle of being pirated, or shot down by a crazy murderer.

So all of these hypothetical players think exactly like you then? Because even some Open players complain that the inherent benefits of Open aren't enough and they demand more reward.

 

[Cody]

If it was frequent in solo there would be complaints of NPC griefing.

Funny you should say that...

 

[Faded Glory]

Well even if they did choose to remain in Private...at least it didn't waste a players time with a cheap mechanic that feels 'cheaty'.

Good point. As I said, someone needs to ask those players who do play Open but avoid the risk of player interactions in this way why they actually play Open. I have no idea, although I will say that the suggested extra rewards for playing in Open would likely only exacerbate this issue.

And as I said in an earlier post, this really reflects much more on the PvPers who avoid interaction than the players who choose to consistently spend their time in Solo or Group play.

 

[Bomba Luigi]

Because I think if they WERE faced with that ultimatum, they would ultimately admit that the benefits of open outweigh the occasional hassle of being pirated, or shot down by a crazy murderer. It would force traders (and other players) to be more careful about where and when they enter certain systems... it would force them to learn new methods to ditching players who want to cause them harm... and it might force traders to ditch their class 6 or 7 cargo rack for a proper shield generator, so they could better escape interdictions. It would make trading more exciting (and more survivable), it would cut into trader's profits, slowing down the ship progression and bringing trading profits closer to the profits of other professions.

It's a win win.

Don't say you know better what is good and more fun for others then they do themself. Thats just silly, unless you are the mother of these People. Mothers have that right (alltough they are sometimes wrong, but still ^^ )

 

[Jockey79]

If you mean players like Holycow, yes I agree. If you mean me, I love all three modes and where in the hell are these frequent interdictions occurring? No lie, I'm a tad bit jealous.

I get it every time I try to return to my powers HQ. I get pulled over more times 200LS from home than I do anywhere else.

Because I think if they WERE faced with that ultimatum, they would ultimately admit that the benefits of open outweigh the occasional hassle of being pirated, or shot down by a crazy murderer. It would force traders (and other players) to be more careful about where and when they enter certain systems... it would force them to learn new methods to ditching players who want to cause them harm... and it might force traders to ditch their class 6 or 7 cargo rack for a proper shield generator, so they could better escape interdictions. It would make trading more exciting (and more survivable), it would cut into trader's profits, slowing down the ship progression and bringing trading profits closer to the profits of other professions.

It's a win win.

I almost spat my internal organs out reading that - I've never laughed so hard !!!

This game was built on "Choice" not "Force". So do try to understand that point. Proven in posts one and three of this thread (really, go read them).
Also, if people were "forced", they'd not choose something they all ready shy away from.

You really do not see, that these very traders you moan about (who dislike being pulled over), would not make a choice to be your game content.
People play this game to relax and chill out, I throw some music on and trundle along in my T9 or mining Asp - sometimes I work with someone else.
People play this game for their enjoyment, not yours.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Because I think if they WERE faced with that ultimatum, they would ultimately admit that the benefits of open outweigh the occasional hassle of being pirated, or shot down by a crazy murderer. It would force traders (and other players) to be more careful about where and when they enter certain systems... it would force them to learn new methods to ditching players who want to cause them harm... and it might force traders to ditch their class 6 or 7 cargo rack for a proper shield generator, so they could better escape interdictions. It would make trading more exciting (and more survivable), it would cut into trader's profits, slowing down the ship progression and bringing trading profits closer to the profits of other professions.

It's a win win.

I admire your confidence - given the poll I linked to earlier, I wouldn't be so sure myself - are you willing to take the risk? Completely hypothetically, of course, in a situation where Frontier would choose to remove a core game feature from their game after it has been released for six months on PC, a couple of months, if that, on the Mac and just released to the GPP on XBox One with Open and Solo available as well as mode switching.... AND just a day or two after DBOBE gave his interview to Arstechnica at E3 and was recorded as saying something along the lines of:

There are no changes planned to separate solo and online saves, and players will continue to inhabit the same shared galaxy whether they’re in solo or multiplayer—again, continuing with Braben’s contention that there’s no ‘right’ way to play.

 

[Faded Glory]

Because I think if they WERE faced with that ultimatum, they would ultimately admit that the benefits of open outweigh the occasional hassle of being pirated, or shot down by a crazy murderer. It would force traders (and other players) to be more careful about where and when they enter certain systems... it would force them to learn new methods to ditching players who want to cause them harm... and it might force traders to ditch their class 6 or 7 cargo rack for a proper shield generator, so they could better escape interdictions. It would make trading more exciting (and more survivable), it would cut into trader's profits, slowing down the ship progression and bringing trading profits closer to the profits of other professions.

It's a win win.

Well, while those may seem like benefits to you, other players may not see any of those things as benefits, just frustrations in their attempts to play a game for a few hours in their leisure time.

 

[Roybe]

Funny you should say that...

I am hoping the Mistress of the Minions makes everyone afraid to take out their ships....regardless of the costs.

THAT'S how I remember Elite. Every trip outside a station was a slog to the next stop....constant fighting, possible wipe ever time, and then, upon arrival...more than likely blowing yourself up due to bad docking.

Who cared about PvP...the NPC's caused enough issues that it would be more pleasant to be able to try to talk your way out of something.

 

[SteveLaw]

Oh Lego Spaceman, we used to be best friends, why do you betray me so?!

 

[Faded Glory]

I am hoping the Mistress of the Minions makes everyone afraid to take out their ships....regardless of the costs.

THAT'S how I remember Elite. Every trip outside a station was a slog to the next stop....constant fighting, possible wipe ever time, and then, upon arrival...more than likely blowing yourself up due to bad docking.

Who cared about PvP...the NPC's caused enough issues that it would be more pleasant to be able to try to talk your way out of something.

I think she (SJA) is definitely headed in that direction, and the NPC improvements in 1.3 are a very encouraging start.

The difference between this game and the earlier ones (I reference Frontier rather than Elite) is that the 'cost' of destruction was very much less than it is here. You could save your Commander at any time to minimize the time cost, and there was no re-buy of a ship, you simply went back to your last save. Due to the way it is in this game, FD have to be careful not to destroy their player base on a predictable and routine basis as I fear many would simply abandon the game if they did.

 

[Jockey79]

I am hoping the Mistress of the Minions makes everyone afraid to take out their ships....regardless of the costs.

THAT'S how I remember Elite. Every trip outside a station was a slog to the next stop....constant fighting, possible wipe ever time, and then, upon arrival...more than likely blowing yourself up due to bad docking.

Who cared about PvP...the NPC's caused enough issues that it would be more pleasant to be able to try to talk your way out of something.

The only down side there is, something like that is more "hardcore" and not "casual" friendly.
For people who want to sit on the edge of their seat it will be fine, but for those who just want to chill with friends, that will push them out of the game.

 

[CMDR Zadian Lichtfrost]

Forcing players into Open will reduce the amount of players in open. Some of those who switch between Open mode and Solo/Group mode will stop playing Open Mode. Those who chose to play open will probably search for places where they can safely trade. PvP players will have less targets. Pirates will have to search for their prey. So instead of having players who occasionally fly dangerous routes for the fun of it and doing safety trading in Solo. Most traders will avoid populated areas as they can't afford it.
Forced Open Mode will have an extreme impact on piracy. From reading about it it already doesn't make that much money, with forced Open it will make no money. Which pirate wants to search for a target one or two hours.

IF only Open Mode exists the game will lose a lot of players - all that only play Solo or group mode. FD won't have enough customers for expansions and ship skins.

An additional mode would be interesting. Pure Open Mode - an additional CMDR that only can be used in that mode. No mode switching. It would probably a very empty mode, but if that's what some want …

 

[Mouse]

Well even if they did choose to remain in Private...at least it didn't waste a players time with a cheap mechanic that feels 'cheaty'.

Wait wait wait... "at least it didn't waste a player's time with a cheap mechanic that feels 'cheaty'.. what you mean like the time wasted by being interdicted by a player with no risk to that player, but you could loose everything?

I guess it is only 'cheaty' to the one who's victimizing others and was unable to?

 

[fademist]

The only down side there is, something like that is more "hardcore" and not "casual" friendly.
For people who want to sit on the edge of their seat it will be fine, but for those who just want to chill with friends, that will push them out of the game.

to tell the truth thats was elite though but u r right cause now we r a litle older for some weird reason

 

[Roybe]

The only down side there is, something like that is more "hardcore" and not "casual" friendly.
For people who want to sit on the edge of their seat it will be fine, but for those who just want to chill with friends, that will push them out of the game.

This game has always been advertised as 'niche'. At least that's what everyone says anyway. SJA is going to make her little devils more hateful. She will also make them behave differently between the various elite levels. I'm hopeful they will be equally annoying to everyone. Regardless of commitment or time in game.

This might not be a game for some folks. But it will always be the game the devs want to play...right?

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Wait wait wait... "at least it didn't waste a player's time with a cheap mechanic that feels 'cheaty'.. what you mean like the time wasted by being interdicted by a player with no risk to that player, but you could loose everything?

I guess it is only 'cheaty' to the one who's victimizing others and was unable to?

Pre-planning avoidance of hot sectors by leaving to Private modes is smart gameplay...or 'cheaty' depending who you are. Sorry you disagree! I can see both sides, and accept it. Why can't you?

 

[Mouse]

Because I think if they WERE faced with that ultimatum, they would ultimately admit that the benefits of open outweigh the occasional hassle of being pirated, or shot down by a crazy murderer. It would force traders (and other players) to be more careful about where and when they enter certain systems... it would force them to learn new methods to ditching players who want to cause them harm... and it might force traders to ditch their class 6 or 7 cargo rack for a proper shield generator, so they could better escape interdictions. It would make trading more exciting (and more survivable), it would cut into trader's profits, slowing down the ship progression and bringing trading profits closer to the profits of other professions.

It's a win win.

Why do people always assume everyone else wants to play the game their way? DO YOU seriously think people playing the game are all going to support this? some Magical Rainbow will drift down and everyone will suddenly want to live in the forced utopia that is your desire?

And again if forced open/solo you will find yourself in a fairly empty univers, and if forced open you will find yourself in a fairly empty game.

 

[Spook]

Pre-planning avoidance of hot sectors by leaving to Private modes is smart gameplay...or 'cheaty' depending who you are. Sorry you disagree! I can see both sides, and accept it. Why can't you?

Perhaps because in your original quote, you didn't refer to smart gameplay, you just refered to cheaty. Easy one to misunderstand.

Original post.

Well even if they did choose to remain in Private...at least it didn't waste a players time with a cheap mechanic that feels 'cheaty'.

 

[Mouse]

This game has always been advertised as 'niche'. At least that's what everyone says anyway. SJA is going to make her little devils more hateful. She will also make them behave differently between the various elite levels. I'm hopeful they will be equally annoying to everyone. Regardless of commitment or time in game.

This might not be a game for some folks. But it will always be the game the devs want to play...right?

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Pre-planning avoidance of hot sectors by leaving to Private modes is smart gameplay...or 'cheaty' depending who you are. Sorry you disagree! I can see both sides, and accept it. Why can't you?

there is a huge difference in seeing both side and agreeing with both. I object to the complaint that someone is wasting a pirate's time when they are the one wasting other's time in the first place.