Those would be True Scotsmen, I mean, Pirates right? When players have no idea who is a True Pirate and who is a Tool then it's an academic distinction.
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Those would be True Scotsmen, I mean, Pirates right? When players have no idea who is a True Pirate and who is a Tool then it's an academic distinction.
Oh but there are A LOT of reasons. Let's see:
- for fun ?
- becuse it's cool to blow people up ?
- just because I can ?
- because tears
- "I like shooting mah lazors"
- etc. etc.
That argument is just pants (or lack thereof)!!!
Pirates are defined as those with the ability to successfully steal cargo from other ships (NPC and Players) and sell it. A pilot who destroys ship after ship in the claim that he is a pirate is... a. Not very skilled at what he chooses to be
b. Ruining the (virtual) lives of Traders
c. Killing the cow/Burning the field for other Pirates
d. Probably not a Pirate
e. Some combination of or all of the above!
It is true that it is very difficult to make a ship drop it's cargo. However, the status of the hull is very clearly displayed for all to see. A 50% hull degradation for some ships is probably going to cost most of the profit of his trade. "Yarrr... see you next time you lily livered cow, and I might take you down to 40% next time..." Leave him with something to think about. Next time he may well stop, but he's there running systems and you don't have an increasingly large bounty. Kill him and he could never appear again and your bounty and fine come out of your pay packet, with nothing to show for the encounter. Everyone loses.
Actually, the FSD cooldown thing on submission to interdiction was never intended to be used as a quick getaway. It was put in because of System Authority Interdictions. They scanned you and then you had to wait a minute while your FSD cooled down. It was never intended that Players would submit to Pirates and then run. So guess what, FDev has cottoned on to that and they're going to change it. How is yet to be decided, but something like leaving the Interdictor running for 40 seconds after dropping out of SC. You can choose to turn it off, but whilst on, the Mark's FSD is in lockdown mode.
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Case in point #2. He's the reason people leave for Solo/Groups... (Really must get my terminology straight.)
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You forgot to mention boarding... another proposed Elite expansion.
Won't submit? Shut down the engines and while the pilot's outside doing repairs, pull alongside him, board and transport all the juicy cargo off... or leave him one tonne of rabbits!!! (Or Toxic Waste... if he really was an obnoxious crow.)
Won't submit? Shut down the engines and while the pilot's outside doing repairs, pull alongside him, board and transport all the juicy cargo off... or leave him one tonne of rabbits!!! (Or Toxic Waste... if he really was an obnoxious crow.)
That argument is just pants (or lack thereof)!!!
a. Not very skilled at what he chooses to be
b. Ruining the (virtual) lives of Traders
c. Killing the cow/Burning the field for other Pirates
d. Probably not a Pirate
e. Some combination of or all of the above!
I think you're applying a very romantic hollywood interpretation of what piracy entails to this. It can and does entail relatively bloodless theft, but it essentially is defined as 'theft or illegal violence at sea'. Certain Pirates were and still are renowned for killing people. They may not be considered the norm but they still come under the bracket of 'pirate', and yet also fall under the bracket 'murderer'.
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There's actually a suggestion by the Lead deisgner that in game cargo scamming might become a thing. The caveat was that to achieve it the scammer would have had to have jumped through some reasonably meaningful hoops. If this is the case the more underhanded traders out there might carry a small set of mislabelled cargo to fob pirates off with. Of course, they can expect a harder time the next time they meet said pirate.
Ah... I was labouring under the misconception then of what FDev defined Piracy to be about. They left out the 'Illegal Violence' bit in their definition. Perhaps someone should tell them, because the punishment for murder is about to get much tougher.
Concerning Piracy and Reputation with Pirate Groups: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=6279&p=117967&viewfull=1#post117967
A pirate's piracy reputation in the game is supposed to be knocked by PKing without warning!!! I have no idea about what it means to "Declare Piracy"... maybe the decals have something to do with it.
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Interesting, I wonder if such a system is in place yet. I can't imagine it is. That makes a lot of sense but my point still stands. The guy who shoots first might still be a pirate, but he won't be popular among his own kind for the heat he brings to the rest of them. If this system comes into play it'll be a great boon to gameplay.
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If it is not then this at least shows the direction of travel in terms of FDev's thinking on the matter.
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Yes, even the NPC pirates come back with a few shots on the hull and "What about the good stuff?"
I think I'm generally on board with where they plan to go. It favours freedom with consequences overall. The real acid test is whether it works in enough cases when some players will always seek to outdo the system in place.
The original idea was that a pirate could declare piracy by sending a canned message over comms, at which point the target could either choose a submit option (at which point his ship powers down to dump goods) or ignore it and flee or fight back. Any kill that didn't include a declaration of piracy, or DID include a submission would be punished as murder rather than piracy and do the pirate's rep down, potentially losing access to local black markets.
It was a great idea that gave gameplay with consequences while fitting the game's setting. Shame it didn't make it in at release.
This would be awesome if you could personalise your canned message somehow, maybe having it as a field you can adjust in settings. Any blatantly offensive or deliberately obnoxious messages would get reported and the end result would be a more RPed player piracy scenario. People are already doing this via Voice attack macros, to do it as part of this mechanic would be great.
Can always follow up the canned message:
Canned Message: "This is a Pirate hold up. Shut down your engines and prepare for terms."
Followed by message: "You really should consider doing this as I have a really big stick and very short temper... plus I have these rabbits..."
Canned Message: "This is a Pirate hold up. Shut down your engines and prepare for terms."
Followed by message: "You really should consider doing this as I have a really big stick and very short temper... plus I have these rabbits..."
Perhaps they could make it that if the ship surrenders then this powers down any weapons/non essential systems which gives enough of a boost to the shields/FSD so that the trader at least stands some chance of getaway if the pirate decides to try and destroy the ship.
Also, would it makes sense that if a player attacks a clean ship with no declaration of piracy - i.e. just a murderer - that the escape pod records the events which are uploaded to Galnet which then identifies the ship in game as a named, wanted killer?
You could even go so far as to say that the killer's ship would show up in a different colour on player's huds so they could steer clear of out and out killers...
That way a killer gets one bite of the cherry before it becomes open season on them.
I would like to see Murder a tougher deal than Piracy, but not so much as to drive it completely out of the game. In my mind these should be the two toughest roles to take on in the Galaxy. At the moment, it's tougher to be a Trader in Open than a PKer, because one can literally wipe the other out in one or two goes.
If FDev bring at least some of what they promised in the last week or so I think that would go a long way to bringing people back to Open.
If FDev bring at least some of what they promised in the last week or so I think that would go a long way to bringing people back to Open.
So what would you propose ? That a hauling ship should fight on equal terms with a dedicated fighter ship or what ?
I wonder what word I'm looking for... Gosh, it's on the tip of my tongue... I can taste it...
i.e. Pick on someone your own size.
No but seriously. What would you propose ? Do you really expect a 'trader vs PKer' to be a fair fight or something ?
then dont be suprised people wont use the open play anymore because hey newsflash, people dont like to be on the wrong end of a unfair fight.
Latest news from the lead designer. I posted it earlier. Is that bounties are going to become persistent and carry with you after you die. So you will have to pay regardless. They will also make the background sim more aggressive against players with bounties.
That is the confirmed next step of the PvP murdering solution to protect clean players.
That is the confirmed next step of the PvP murdering solution to protect clean players.
A Trader vs Pker will never be a fair fight in any sense. The Trader has little to no chance yet can lose upwards of 30M in a single loss. The benefit, in game, of killing the clean trader, absolutely none, not even in your ratings. The consequence of PKing this trader is, by comparison, a tiny fine and a bounty, which any experienced fighter just shrugs off.
Good thing is though that that's going to change shortly.
So what's the challenge? Where is the danger? It's utterly meaningless.
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This ^^^
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