Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread [See new thread]

[Coccolino]

So let me get this straight ppl playing OPEN are saying the games bad because others are playing SOLO/GROUP and theres no easy targets to pick on mmmmmmmmm, also saying that doing SOLO/GROUP is easy mode ,sorry but theres no difference in any of the modes all are the same , all affect the same universe.
The game was advertised in that it would come with 3, yea thats right 3 modes of play and that you could play as you want ,again AS YOU WANT to play.

I actually like that people can play it the way they want, but if someone likes an offline gaming, well... play offline, single player, with your own universe. It's too easy to jump in Open, out of nowhere, into an Anaconda, just because you did the easy road in Solo mode. The problem is in sharing the assets.
If you want to play online, Open, I find correct that all the road should be Open. That's all. I'm not looking for easy targets, there's plenty of NPC easy targets.

 

[AJ79]

Producing stats, while informative would just be "twisted" to suit peoples POV.

Stat A - Players moving to Private Groups increasing, population in open declining.

"I told you so, way too many ADHD afflicted gankers - clean up Open"

"I told you so, SOLO is being abused as an easy mode, - remove the ability to switch"

Stat B - Players moving to Private Groups decreasing, population in open increasing.

"I told you so, nobody wants to stick around in private groups of one, stop wasting development time on the grouping mechanic, get rid of it in entirety. "

"I told you so, as people become more comfortable in the game, they gravitate to Open, if you increased the bounties and fines and restricted PvP some more the move would be even greater."


Lies, damn lies and statistics

LOL

Fair point.

 

[Uueerdo]

I actually like that people can play it the way they want, but if someone likes an offline gaming, well... play offline, single player, with your own universe. It's too easy to jump in Open, out of nowhere, into an Anaconda, just because you did the easy road in Solo mode. The problem is in sharing the assets.
If you want to play online, Open, I find correct that all the road should be Open. That's all. I'm not looking for easy targets, there's plenty of NPC easy targets.

There is no "offline, single player, with your own universe" that a player can jump into Open from because there is no "offline, single player, with your own universe" to begin with.

 

[Zenicetus]

I'm beginning to see why they consolidated this whole argument into this one thread. The zealots on both sides of the PvE vs PvP fence are wrong. Here's hoping the game achieves and maintains a happy balance as it develops

I don't think it qualifies as "zealotry" to simply point out that this is the game the developers said they were going to make, and the game the Kickstarter backers supported, where mode switching hasn't changed since Beta and the game was released this way. It's right there in Yaffle's OP, describing how the game works.

I rather think "zealot" would describe someone who couldn't accept the game design, and who wants it to be something completely different. The rest of us are just playing the game that was described to us, and having fun with it.

 

[snotface]

At this point winning the argument takes precedence over being right.

The a Moderator should just close the thread and stop it continually going around and around.

 

[Dabba]

At this point winning the argument takes precedence over being right.

Id like to point out that the argument was "won" quite some time ago. Frontier made their decision with the help of the kickstarter backers, its over and done with. This is just a handful of people explaining, again, that the argument was won, and the how and why of it to a handful of people still in denial.

 

[Flying Scorpion]

If you are trying to help an NPC faction expand, and there are solo players trolling your efforts (by going to your system, and running missions for the other faction or by sabotaging your faction) - there's no way to combat this, short of farming harder than they are. I know that solo play is fair in one sense, because if they can do it, so can I .... but this is actually pretty lame. Wouldn't Elite Dangerous be a much more interesting game, if say.... I could actually fight off the players who are trolling my efforts? Currently, if they are in solo mode or in a private group... they're untouchable... and it's basically a grindfest, where whoever spends the most time grinding wins.

That's lame man. Like super lame.

I had visions of hosting fleets and bringing my friends together to fight off players who are screwing with our factions control. But that just isn't going to happen unless our enemies actively make the choice to play in open mode. Players who are using solo or private group mode to spoil the efforts of other players are impregnable. And it's frustrating. And it seems trollish and lame to me.

I think the best solution is to simply make it so that you cannot affect influence ratings unless you are in open mode - or, give people who play in solo or private group, their own copy of the game universe, with it's own influence ratings that don't affect the open world that the other players are on.

I think a good analogy to what I'm saying is this: Imagine you are on a beach building a sandcastle. And some kid comes over and dumps a bucket of water on it. Now in reality, there's multiple ways you can deal with this... you can rally your friends together and get that kid to shove off... you can call a parent over to deal with him.... you can stand up and throw water back in his face... but the bottom line is this - you have direct and effective options to resolve the situation. With the way the game is currently, it's like the kid's pouring water over my sandcastle...and he's invisible! So the only way for me to deal with this is to either abandon my creation, move to another part of the beach, or start trying to throw sand onto my creation and rebuild it faster than my opponent is throwing water on it. Can you honestly quote this post and write to me that this isn't lame?

 

[Cmdr Andy B]

The a Moderator should just close the thread and stop it continually going around and around.

it wouldn't help, another would appear in a day or so.

 

[DaveB]

...I had visions of hosting fleets and bringing my friends together to fight off players who are screwing with our factions control. But that just isn't going to happen unless our enemies actively make the choice to play in open mode. Players who are using solo or private group mode to spoil the efforts of other players are untouchable. And it's frustrating. And it seems trollish and lame to me.

I think the best solution is to simply make it so that you cannot affect influence ratings unless you are in open mode.

Then, without malice, I'm afraid your vision was wrong. It's been obvious for literally years - based on the ongoing discussion of the games development leading up to release - that your vision was not where the game was going. Ever. The only difference between the three modes is who you are matched with in an instance. This isn't going to change, it's too fundamental.

 

[Dabba]

If you are trying to help an NPC faction expand, and there are solo players trolling your efforts (by going to your system, and running missions for the other faction or by sabotaging your faction) - there's no way to combat this, short of farming harder than they are. I know that solo play is fair in one sense, because if they can do it, so can I .... but this is actually pretty lame. Wouldn't Elite Dangerous be a much more interesting game, if say.... I could actually fight off the players who are trolling my efforts? Currently, if they are in solo mode or in a private group... they're untouchable... and it's basically a grindfest, where whoever spends the most time grinding wins.

That's lame man. Like super lame.

I had visions of hosting fleets and bringing my friends together to fight off players who are screwing with our factions control. But that just isn't going to happen unless our enemies actively make the choice to play in open mode. Players who are using solo or private group mode to spoil the efforts of other players are untouchable. And it's frustrating. And it seems trollish and lame to me.

I think the best solution is to simply make it so that you cannot affect influence ratings unless you are in open mode - or, give people who play in solo or private group, their own copy of the in game universe that doesn't affect the open world that the other players are on.

Spies man, spies everywhere!

There are enough star systems to go around. Shouldn't be hard to find a place to play your influence games without being hindered by others, as long as you don't publicize what you're doing. The way the instancing and blocking system works even separating Solo influence wouldn't prevent people from "trolling" your influence efforts.

 

[AJ79]

If you are trying to help an NPC faction expand, and there are solo players trolling your efforts (by going to your system, and running missions for the other faction or by sabotaging your faction) - there's no way to combat this, short of farming harder than they are. I know that solo play is fair in one sense, because if they can do it, so can I .... but this is actually pretty lame. Wouldn't Elite Dangerous be a much more interesting game, if say.... I could actually fight off the players who are trolling my efforts? Currently, if they are in solo mode or in a private group... they're untouchable... and it's basically a grindfest, where whoever spends the most time grinding wins.

That's lame man. Like super lame.

I had visions of hosting fleets and bringing my friends together to fight off players who are screwing with our factions control. But that just isn't going to happen unless our enemies actively make the choice to play in open mode. Players who are using solo or private group mode to spoil the efforts of other players are untouchable. And it's frustrating. And it seems trollish and lame to me.

I think the best solution is to simply make it so that you cannot affect influence ratings unless you are in open mode - or, give people who play in solo or private group, their own copy of the in game universe that doesn't affect the open world that the other players are on.

NPC factions cannot change without FD saying so (there is a thread on it) plus if there are 100 of you wanting it to change and 200 not wanting it to change.... how are you going to stop them?
Each instance is about 30 players for a start and for each one of you not doing stuff to help your faction, there is 2 doing missions for theirs - it is a pure numbers game despite your best efforts, those with the larger numbers wins (kind of like voting works)

 

[Phosphora]

Let's keep the ability to switch. People may have different moods at different times, and want to mix PvP and PvE over time. Frontier have done a good job in recognising that. Personally I'd never play in open as I loathe PvP, but I recognise that people may want to have a change at times.

Cheers, Phos.

 

[Joe Spivey]

If you are trying to help an NPC faction expand, and there are solo players trolling your efforts (by going to your system, and running missions for the other faction or by sabotaging your faction) - there's no way to combat this, short of farming harder than they are. I know that solo play is fair in one sense, because if they can do it, so can I .... but this is actually pretty lame. Wouldn't Elite Dangerous be a much more interesting game, if say.... I could actually fight off the players who are trolling my efforts? Currently, if they are in solo mode or in a private group... they're untouchable... and it's basically a grindfest, where whoever spends the most time grinding wins.

That's lame man. Like super lame.

I had visions of hosting fleets and bringing my friends together to fight off players who are screwing with our factions control. But that just isn't going to happen unless our enemies actively make the choice to play in open mode. Players who are using solo or private group mode to spoil the efforts of other players are impregnable. And it's frustrating. And it seems trollish and lame to me.

I think the best solution is to simply make it so that you cannot affect influence ratings unless you are in open mode - or, give people who play in solo or private group, their own copy of the game universe, with it's own influence ratings that don't affect the open world that the other players are on.

The complaint is that players in Solo can affect the background simulation (ie supporting a rival faction) without any consequences because they are not in Open, yes? But what would the consequences be if they were in open? Killing them won't do anything because, well, what happens if you kill someone? they come back 2 mins later. So what are these consequences? The only way this whole supporting opposite factions works is by sheer numbers. It doesn't matter if the supporters are in Solo, Group or Open. The thing to remember is that EVERYBODY is playing against the background simulation, not against each other. To win you need to have an effect on the NPCs running the show. Players killing players is never going to have any effect.

 

[snotface]

it wouldn't help, another would appear in a day or so.

yep maybe so, but as the Mod who merged their thread to mind stated very clearly, name calling of any type will result in instant infraction (7 day ban) and that's been going on since it started.

If they close the thread, then add threads to this closed thread people will get the hint in time, If there is anybody left on the forum.

It would be interesting if anybody would actually answer my questions on page 38 and page 39.

 

[Cmdr Andy B]

It would be interesting if anybody would actually answer my questions on page 38 and page 39.

that might be a little tricky as i'm only seeing 31 pages in this thread right now...

 

[BigBadB]

If you are trying to help an NPC faction expand, and there are solo players trolling your efforts (by going to your system, and running missions for the other faction or by sabotaging your faction) - there's no way to combat this, short of farming harder than they are. I know that solo play is fair in one sense, because if they can do it, so can I .... but this is actually pretty lame. Wouldn't Elite Dangerous be a much more interesting game, if say.... I could actually fight off the players who are trolling my efforts? Currently, if they are in solo mode or in a private group... they're untouchable... and it's basically a grindfest, where whoever spends the most time grinding wins.

That's lame man. Like super lame.

If two groups of players are competing for Influence, it's always going to be a grind fest, whether there's direct PvP conflict or not. The group that spends more game hours per day on the task will win.

I had visions of hosting fleets and bringing my friends together to fight off players who are screwing with our factions control. But that just isn't going to happen unless our enemies actively make the choice to play in open mode. Players who are using solo or private group mode to spoil the efforts of other players are impregnable. And it's frustrating. And it seems trollish and lame to me.

I think the best solution is to simply make it so that you cannot affect influence ratings unless you are in open mode - or, give people who play in solo or private group, their own copy of the game universe, with it's own influence ratings that don't affect the open world that the other players are on.

Even if this were to happen, you still wouldn't necessarily see all the players from the other group because of the peer to peer networking and 32 players per instance.

 

[Dabba]

yep maybe so, but as the Mod who merged their thread to mind stated very clearly, name calling of any type will result in instant infraction (7 day ban) and that's been going on since it started.

If they close the thread, then add threads to this closed thread people will get the hint in time, If there is anybody left on the forum.

It would be interesting if anybody would actually answer my questions on page 38 and page 39.

If it makes you feel any better I know for sure of at least 2 people that have been tagged with the 7 day ban for their comments in here, so its happening. Some of us are just really good at walking the line.

 

[Zenicetus]

I had visions of hosting fleets and bringing my friends together to fight off players who are screwing with our factions control.

That was never an option with this network design and 3D Galaxy map. One more time, for those who are still coming to grips with the design and the network model:

There are no choke points between star systems that allow territorial control; it's a 3D Galaxy and players can simply use another route past "your" star system. The P2P instancing network limits the number of players you can ever interact with. If you fill your small 32-player instance with a "fleet," you'll never see another human player. The other players will get their own copies of that star system and copies of the local stations.

You could try to partially fill an instance with some friends, allowing room to see (and fight) other players, but the load-in for any other players be random and unpredictable, based on how solid the P2P connections are. You'll never know the true strength of any opposing groups, even if every single player was in that area in Open mode. We're all in scattered instances, never all in one shared space, no matter what mode we're in.

So it doesn't really matter if some of the contesting players are in Solo or Private Groups. The game is designed in such a way that the only "control" you can exert over a system is by collective effort tilting the local factions, as a result of what many players do in many separated instances.

 

[snotface]

If it makes you feel any better I know for sure of at least 2 people that have been tagged with the 7 day ban for their comments in here, so its happening. Some of us are just really good at walking the line.

I know that the game and the way it works does not effect my game play. I am very happy to play in either Solo or Open. What I do not understand is how me playing in Solo has a direct effect on somebody else's game play. Are they upset because I have taken away their right to attack me in open play, or have I taken away their game play? It is a little bit confusing as When I created this post a day or so ago (and it got merged at the same time to the mods post thats why my post is third) I pointed out that players in Open play already get higher money value kills and extra benefits Solo players do not get.

Then because everybody started complaining about stuff that has Zero importance in this game I asked simple questions (page 38 and 39) but still they do not answer.

I can only conclude that the argument is pointless because to have an argument where one party is in pain and upset caused by the other party there has to be a point where somebody was actually hurt or caused harm. So far nobody has stated how Solo play harms them personally.

 

[DarkWalker]

I actually like that people can play it the way they want, but if someone likes an offline gaming, well... play offline, single player, with your own universe. It's too easy to jump in Open, out of nowhere, into an Anaconda, just because you did the easy road in Solo mode. The problem is in sharing the assets.
If you want to play online, Open, I find correct that all the road should be Open. That's all. I'm not looking for easy targets, there's plenty of NPC easy targets.

Believe me, if I could just go play offline, with my own universe that other players couldn't influence, I would. It's what I thought I was getting when I paid for the game.

If it makes you feel any better I know for sure of at least 2 people that have been tagged with the 7 day ban for their comments in here, so its happening. Some of us are just really good at walking the line.

Noticed that too. One from each camp, BTW. The rep button disappears from their posts.