You can allegedly trade, even with just an Aurora. But the economy only works properly for a few minutes after a server reset, after which supply and demand start to even out, and the potential profits take a nosedive. I guess the BGS needs tweaking.
The Star Citizen Thread v8
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I've seen a livestream in which the streamer made tons of $$$ by simply drifting between the platforms of a space station.
AFAIK – Not much at this point, basic trading A-B and testing cargo interaction.
Yea, basically. People have been doing both.
Some people have managed to earn millions and also lost everything as their ship went boom.
There are some basic prices set up between different locations so there are different buy/sell prices.
Depends, I mean, the progress will be wiped sooner or later. I have yet to try trading myself.
Well, you apparently CAN be interdicted (got interdicted by a Cutlass Red and blew it up) but I have no idea how that part work. So most people I guess blow up the enemy and scoop up cargo.
Someone just opened their cargo and moved the ship to scoop up the cargo crates into the hold.
Afaik not implemented. But any cargo not on cargo plates are considered smuggled goods since only cargo loaded on cargo plates are SUPPOSED to go into the ship manifest.
Yea, most likely mission based at this time.
Dunno, no idea how one finds out if there is a bounty or not.
At this point I think the very basic mission system is activated and limited trading to test the system.
Yup, if their proposed mission system is working the way they say the game should be able to create missions depending on supply and demand in all types of missions but at this point we have the most basic of things.
I think that at this juncture the basic mission system with cargo interaction is more important for SQ42 and expanded mission generation and more complex things should be pushed forward unless needed for SQ42.
That’s what I would call a design document at nothing more.
They know what they WANT to do but we do now know what they are implementing. What I would like to see is the supply/demand system between areas where Elite is truly lacking of a dynamic trading system of COMMON goods where we can in some small way influence a market.
Merely making money through investigative prospecting of an asteroid and selling the data as opposed to pure mining would be nice, making Prospecting+Mining+Refining different aspects of it.
No idea, but with their ideas of setting up outposts and claiming an area of land should mean that a small industrial outpost should be a possible thing to create.
But yea, plenty of speculation but so far few games makes mining FUN and EVE and Elite for example have us shooting them. X series are nice with the possibility of making small mining stations so something similar would be nice.
I can see a lot of mini games easily done that they could combine with other professions.
Exploration + Prospecting + Mineral Sample + Geology Science = New Discovery, thus creating a chain of events instead of just “you find X and gain Y credits”.
I do not think you are far off but with the mere basics up it’s a lot of speculation.
They also have the “investigator” mission which is something I hope will be expanded on more for detective work missions and combined with bounty hunting since merely having bounty hunting as blowing up ships it would be nice to follow up leads, track a wanted man on a planet and finally apprehend them and turn them in by transporting them in a cryo pod or restraining harness.
With all the talk that CIG is breaking new ground I really want them to actually do that with mission based gameplay where they have some more engaging mechanics.
Well, at least someone managed to find a way to scoop cargo in a more efficient way than Elite.
A Caterpillar just opened the entire cargo hold to space and scooped things up like a giant maw.
*WARNING* Rude words are spoken.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooQhgkvcPAw
27.26 is when he starts getting a wee bit upset. Once again, much use of Anglo-Saxon. [smile]
Scruffpuff on the SA forums had this to say....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooQhgkvcPAw
27.26 is when he starts getting a wee bit upset. Once again, much use of Anglo-Saxon. [smile]
Scruffpuff on the SA forums had this to say....
The description for mining showcases some of the concerns that I have for gameplay within Star Citizen.
Essentially, CIG envisages that mining within Star Citizen will entail a number of roles.
A pilot will manoeuvre the ship through an asteroid field. More valuable finds will be deep in the field....but it'll also be denser there and more dangerous to fly.
Not quite "realistic" but it has certain gameplay advantages and possibly gives an advantage to smaller craft who will be able to fly deeper into the field.
You'll have a scanner who'll scan for ore
You'll need to expect combat.
You have the miner himself, who uses the mining equipment. He'll have to select the appropriate tool, and watch the feedback. He'll need to watch for quakes, for has pockets, and other dangers swapping tools or taking other preventative steps.
You have the collector....he who collects the ore.
You have the refiner who processes the ore ...
It was an interesting document CIG provided.
BUT.......the gameplay they talked about got less and less detailed the more roles they talked about. And they didn't provide answers to "what is everyone else doing"?
Namely....they described gameplay enough for one player and are trying to stretch it out to justify their multi crewed ships by dividing
the task into several distinct roles, of which only two or three have the potential for in depth gameplay.
Elites own design documentation promises pretty much the same, and even included the use of claim beacons and auto miners, not to mention the possibility of catastrophic events. Put simply, what we do now in ED is effectively surface mining....blowing chunks off the surface of an asteroid and collecting them.
But like SC, EDs own mining ideas were far more in depth....different weapons for different situations, avoiding catastrophic events, different types of mining gameplay, the availability and use of specialised equipment and more.
The big difference, in many ways, is that ED doesn't try to pretend that there is gameplay here for more than one player at a time. You might be able to get 2 or 3 players involved by overlapping duties and roles but CIG is giving us ships with (supposedly) up to 80 players on board.
And mining is one of the few ideas they've provided any degree of fleshing out over.
Mining is supposedly coming by...June IIRC....but I can't see it being more than a stripped down system of what was promised. CIG are having enough problems getting the game running properly.
I suppose the addition of surface mining might be an idea...drill the easily accessible ores located on an asteroid surface, collect them and then engage an automated refinery to process them into ore. That would allow CIG to add mining gameplay and test out the base systems before expanding it into different areas of gameplay
Tbh, his other response-rant is probably the more relevant and the more damning: the observation that the increasingly broken (non-)progress doesn't actually matter; that, even if they could reverse course and make the game more stable and improve performance, they still face an infinitely bigger hurdle in that there's just no game there. It's why he ends up with the conclusion that there's nothing on the other side of the wall.
CIG has been so focused on overproducing the most bland art since the invention of the photo-copied blank page — because it somehow brings in the cash — that they've completely overlooked the main point of the entire endeavour. We're now entering year 7 of development, and what fantastic gameplay have they designed so far? Go to place, push button. Go to place, pick up item (i.e. push button). Go to place, shoot guy. If they go really wild and crazy, it's go to place, press button and then shoot guy, but even then, none of it serves any actual purpose because the underlying “user story” is nowhere to be seen. It's slightly less engaging and creative than what you'd see in MyFirstTriggerTestMap.unr.
So even if the poor guy in the video had encountered no bugs in playing the game, he would then be faced with the biggest problem of them all: the fact that there is no game to play. Like VR and mods and player servers and the myriad of other things you really need to figure out first, that part is just one of those things that CIG has decided to try to squeeze in at some indeterminate later stage, far beyond when it's a good time to do so and when it's far too late to have any real chance of doing it well.
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Year 7 already? Half way to Duke Nukem Forever territory.
"It seem like they just pushed this out just to get the money"
DING DING DING!!!! We have a winner!
In trying to evaluate Star Citizens approach on this I was thinking about how other games allow the player to pick a profession and use it to fill out his hours or return some entertainment.
The first thing that came to mind is that professions have different SKILLS setting them apart. If you want to be a soldier you can fight but handling precious cargo or discussing trade routes might be a little outside your forte. Usually games offer you a selection of classes that provide different skills to fulfill a role be it trader, farmer, pilot, alien etc. This approach fixes players into a specific role they cannot break out of except when they create a new character picking a different class. Following games over the years have broken up this formula by going with a "free" approach meaning the character is an empty leaf of paper upon creation but can pick up skills on the go while playing deciding during gameplay what hes going to be. Again, distinction between players is of course what they do in the game but usually skills support their chosen gamestyle by enhancing or providing additional bonuses making them more efficient at their tasks. I know I would feel pretty frustrated if I picked a pilot and my trader buddy sitting on his all day long turning a profit decides one day to give piloting a try then completely destroys me in a dogfight because in terms of gameplay nothing sets us apart and he is able to buy and control a superior ship due to his profit mongering.
Some games only allow you a certain number of skill picks to balance out gameplay others dont have this restriction but include other parameters to control the flow and balance. EVE for example includes time. Other control mechanisms might be currency spent or maybe specific tasks fulfilled to allow learning of specific skills.
The real world doesnt work like this. The difference is complexity. Why do I not simply stop whatever I m currently doing and pick up surgery? Because it takes a little more then simply slashing open another human. I need to have anatomical knowledge, know biological functions inside out, have a background in all kinds of related topics and outside being a genius of some kind I need to learn all this before I am even allowed to pick up a scalpel or perform surgery. I can do it but it ll take time.....a looooong time thus mastering different professions in the real world is possible but so complex and time-consuming that most people settle for one main profession and a bunch of hobbies instead. 75 years on average are simply not enough to collect em all. In addition becoming older automatically negates certain activities due to the bodies limitations. Writing this I remember that CRoberts announced that the players avatar will grow old or become sick and if killed continue via an heir.....does anybody can recognize this future scenario in the current game?
But it shows that there are different ways to offer profession value. Because if I just started flying then pick up trading whenever I chose to then hop into any other activity without limitation the title itself would be hollow and meaningless. Title value comes from unique skills or requirements checked be it skills that only a certain profession can use (think any class-based game) or being able to perform actions due to 20 years of advance learning (think medical study).
The saying "training makes a master" holds true of course but for this condition to exist there needs to be a level of complexity that is usually absent in games. Interwoven dependencies, knowledge of protocol, terminology, advance knowledge of results and consequences, knowledge about existing law etc etc. Everybody can decide to start a business but without prior knowledge they have to put on their adult-pants and go through a serious time of learning and failing. Many fail and the ones who manage to continue suddenly face enormous competition forcing them to completely commit in order to survive or prosper. No more time for hikes and shopping tours, no more freetime to do whatever you want. A chosen profession demands attention either in time or focus and it usually limits what else we can accomplish in life.
As far as I know Star Citizen currently doesnt have nor does it plan to have skills but rather take the "you can do anything" approach. A legit choice but for that to have any meaning or entertaining value there needs to be a multi-layer of requirements, dependencies, functionality and interconnection to other areas either in knowledge or ability. SC isnt complete by any means (as if we could forget lol) so defenders might say "they WILL have this kind of complexity once they are done" but seeing 3.0 which was supposed to be a "milestone" for the game and how CiG struggles with finding a fun formula, solutions for year-old issues or even a PLAN for the future I d say that possibility is on the level with miracles and I mean this in a serious sense. IMO offering this kind of gameplay is impossible for SC to achieve. It would take another 40-50 years of continuous development if we take the current progress rate as the base. There are already games releasing which rival SC in looks and complexity. CiG counters by loading up additional scenarios and promises and evolving the dream more and more but fact is that they already have a laundry list of things they need to fulfill and currently showing no signs of being able to.
As Star Citizen for now will be a system where your profession is decided by your actions (usually your profession decides what you do) I can imagine CRoberts pulling another SM trick eventually by saying "but people ALREADY can kill each other so bounty hunting was in for years - I wish people would stop pestering me with professions already - they are in, we are done". And CiGs most loyal drones do exactly that.....
make-belief
Only in SCs case its not the game making you belief you are profession X but people who imprint their belief on a game that is unable to support or transport the feeling/decision itself.
3.0 has simply failed to introduce professions and any attempts to support such a concept is incredibly raw and basic/shallow. Trading requires more then buying/selling stuff or carrying it to your ship piecemeal. At least if you want to make a real profession out of it. I would agree with Snarfbuckle that 3.0 is at best a design document or better, a tech demo for professions and as such its in line with the rest of the game. Strange how thats still the case after 6 years and 175 million dollars.
What is it with you guys, dont you read? Development started end of 2014 at best, probably early 2015 which means its only 2 years, cant count 2018 its only a few days old and 2 years and some change is pretty good for what they produces so far.......
...heathen
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What is it with you guys, dont you read? Development started end of 2014 at best, probably early 2015 which means its only 2 years, cant count 2018 its only a few days old and 2 years and some change is pretty good for what they produces so far.......
...heathen
Hah.
I just strip away 2013-2014 from any progress since im pretty sure that all that stuff they hired contractors for during that period to make SQ42 was basically scrapped and then from 2015 they decided to do everything in-house and started the move away from CryEngine.
Perhaps they salvaged core items and a lot of code but I think they started from scratch in 2015 due to the influx of money in order to increase fidelity.
And considering how many issues they had with communication problems between themselves and their contractors i think that solution was better.
But it would be nice if they fessed up about the mistakes they make.
What is it with you guys, dont you read? Development started end of 2014 at best, probably early 2015 which means its only 2 years, cant count 2018 its only a few days old and 2 years and some change is pretty good for what they produces so far.......
...heathen
Also, I prefer "heretic," thankyouverymuch.I`m sorry.I'm not so good with numbers.
Also, I prefer "heretic," thankyouverymuch.
I was thinking about it but I perceive heretic as offensive while heathen is funny (for me....) but sure, use whatever works for you ^^
And when you look at our topics, I think it is fair to say we should have delivered more as well after 50.000 posts or whatever.
Oh my sweet summer child...
Looks like SC threads v1-v7 total 97280 posts ... so once you add the 2100+ in this thread, we're getting pretty close to 100k!
Hopefully we'll have lots more interesting text to read sooner rather than later, assuming the lawsuit gets as far as discovery.
IMO whether you're a supporter of the project or a skeptical onlooker, it should be interesting to see what comes out with some actual transparency - not the kind that CIG get to carefully direct and polish before it goes out.
As for professions... We can only hope to see more in future 3.x releases to be honest, it really feels like they're being very cautious when it comes to adding stuff. Giving the benefit of the doubt would be to say that's so they can get more focused feedback on what is there; the cynic in me says it's because they don't have anything else in something resembling a releasable state yet.
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Oh my sweet summer child...
Looks like SC threads v1-v7 total 97202 posts ... so once you add the 2100+ in this thread, we're getting pretty close to 100k!
Hopefully we'll have lots more interesting text to read sooner rather than later, assuming the lawsuit gets as far as discovery.
IMO whether you're a supporter of the project or a skeptical onlooker, it should be interesting to see what comes out with some actual transparency - not the kind that CIG get to carefully direct and polish before it goes out.
As for professions... We can only hope to see more in future 3.x releases to be honest, it really feels like they're being very cautious when it comes to adding stuff. Giving the benefit of the doubt would be to say that's so they can get more focused feedback on what is there; the cynic in me says it's because they don't have anything else in something resembling a releasable state yet.
Refusing to believe that CiGs development team is incompetent I remember reports years back stating that development of Star Citizen is extremely difficult because of missing documentation and not knowing what will break whenever you add simple or basic stuff. This seems to be a more realistic explanation for CiGs timid behavior in adding new content. If the existing system is so unknown or confusing that you dont know beforehand what will happen if you do easy stuff adding complex mechanics or features becomes a nightmare and reverse engineering the existing code on the fly while development continues in parallel.....nightmare only starts to describe this.
I'm pretty sure it's the latter, and all the professions that are going to come out will no more complicated than Elite's, which isn't really a high bar, to be honest (perhaps that will change with Q4 update, but I'm not counting on it).
If it was missing CryEngine documentation it would make sense. Perhaps they havemore comprehensive documentation with Lumberyard.
Ooh! Are we allowed to say rude things, as long as it's in Latin? I didn't realise.
Next weekend, I'm going to force myself to have another go with 3.0. I really wanted to land on planets before 3.0 came out, and I'm surprised how underwhelmed I was first time I did it. Deserves another try, I think.
you made me look up the translation....I think I m missing something. How is that rude?
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