The Wasted Potential of ED

[The Lawful]

There is no full support for on-foot VR in Odyssey.

You said "but no VR support in Odyssey." which definitely is wrong. There is full VR support up to the same level as Horizons at least in Odyssey. Let me put it like this: Odyssey is no inferior alternative to Legacy in terms of VR, and should not be presented as one. Including Titans. If you say 'no VR support', that's simply wrong.

O7,

 

[Lhorndra]

3. The first-person-shooter stuff is bad compared to Halo, CoD and even Fortnite.

The space ships, space flight models and procedually generated star systems in Halo, CoD, and even Fortnite could be better.

4. A gigantic galaxy, yet only a tiny percentage is used. The travel time through the galaxy compared to the amount of activities are difficult to justify.

How is this a bad thing? That's the main reason I'm drawn to the whole Elite series in the first place. Those travel times where specifically requested by the players when ED kickstarted. Space is big.

5. There's almost no in-game story development except little excerpts that players must piece together.

A highlight of the game.

NONSTOPPE9
"There are a few ways to fix this. Some of them might sound very complex but I think they can do it with their very small team.

None of those suggestions are trivial, and none of those will be done.

While I totally get that players are frustrated or tired of some aspects of the game, I'm somewhat dumbstruck about the regular "Here is how FDev should fix the game" threads.

 

[Cosmo]

You said "but no VR support in Odyssey." which definitely is wrong.

To clarify: no proper VR support for on-foot first person gameplay in Odyssey. The stuff that Horizons and the previous iterations of ED already had are nothing new. Those are points made in the linked video.

A highlight of the game.

Nah, Starfield will have a fully voice-acted campaign on the scale of Skyrim (or bigger) and thus appeal to a broader audience and probably sell a lot more copies than ED. The ED development budget isn't big enough to hire sufficient real voice actors. So, ED could use AI voice tech and something like ChatGPT to take NPC interaction to the next level.

Such as this:

 

[Chaparral]

Whether or not this mechanic or that mechanic should be altered, subtracted or added - the FDEV PLC has a responsibility to its shareholders, and with 792 employees - one would think there would be more productivity with features in its flagship property and value for its shareholders:

This game is a great placeholder for the new space-based games opening up, so I wouldn't fret too much about what it could have been or what it could be.

The formula they employ for this game is pretty obvious:

1) Tease new game setting/feature for extended time.
2) Underdeliver on elements of the new feature.
3) Introduce "gameplay" mechanics that are about materials acquisition for crafting items that make the base game easier.
4) Nerf credit/material acquisition that is obtained from the new features of the game from 3).
5) Repeat 1-4.

Minimum viable product.

 

[Jmanis]

Dirty secret about engineering - you don't need G5. G4 is like 80-90% of the way there and it's pretty easy to get. G3 pretty much falls in your lap. Unless you PvP you don't need those last %.

If you grind because you want G5 (nau!), that's on you.

This right here.

The people who seem to complain about the grind are generally the ones who've bought the lie that you can't do anything until you get G5 engineering.

You can. It's easy. Just get on with doing what you enjoy and mats will follow. Unless the idea of doing anything that isn't completely minmaxed to the Nth degree is a waste of time.

Here's another dirty secret: the activities don't magically change once you get G5 engineering.

If you're not enjoying them now, G5 engineering isn't going to revolutionise the experience. You'll get to the end of uppercutting yourself relog grinding, put that last little touch on your ship, go wallop some NPC and go:

"Oh. Is that it?"

Because there's truth in the OP, but it's got nothing to do with the points listed.

Players don't need 3rd party tools to find good trades. You just need to learn how the game's market works.

The FPS is bad compared to (list of hit FPS games). Of course it is, because ED isn't an FPS. How's the spaceflight mechanics going in those games btw? Bet it's terrible compared to ED.

Yes a small portion of the galaxy is being used, because FD seem to refuse to lean harder into their procedural mechanics. That's how you populate a 400b system game... not with content targeting individual players and activities at the on-foot level. But here we are, demanding more ships! Ship interiors! None of these will fix this.

Ingame story development? Still not going to fix 400b empty systems. Content needs to be procedural and dynamically generated, not hand-crafted.

The things we need are already in the game, they just need to be used and orchestrated better.

Great effects and mechanics, left at back of the cupboard

I recently sent my alt-account out to explore in-anger. They're primarily scoping out all the different types of anomalies and their effects. And some of them have great effects: (This video not mine) Along the way, I've also come to recently experience Lagrange Storm clouds: My big...

forums.frontier.co.uk

Could core mining mechanics be used to create salvage gameplay

Just something I thought last night. Like, instead of planting charges to fissures to crack asteroids, we'd have derelict spacecrafts (megaships/carriers/etc) and abandoned outposts to scan and locate weak spots on the hull, bulkheads and so on. Then blow those up to gain access to whatever...

forums.frontier.co.uk

We are starting to see FD use some of these things in anger a bit more through the Thargoid war stuff.

But it's too much on the bleeding- edge of "endgame" content. A bit more effort could make the in between so much better.

 

[MUTILADOR]

To clarify: no proper VR support for on-foot first person gameplay in Odyssey. The stuff that Horizons and the previous iterations of ED already had are nothing new. Those are points made in the linked video.



Nah, Starfield will have a fully voice-acted campaign on the scale of Skyrim (or bigger) and thus appeal to a broader audience and probably sell a lot more copies than ED. The ED development budget isn't big enough to hire sufficient real voice actors. So, ED could use AI voice tech and something like ChatGPT to take NPC interaction to the next level.

Such as this:

This is why Frontier should let modders make new content for E.D, it's free, high quality, and can lead to making E.D into something much better.
Currently the AI mod is also implemented in WOW. and it's incredible.

 

[MickyG1982]

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

Well, yes, that video is what happens when normal people meet frontier developments.

Noone here is here because they think frontier developments is "normal". You have to move on for that, or leave. Because its not like they're ever going to be normal.

 

[Old Duck]

Players don't need 3rd party tools to find good trades. You just need to learn how the game's market works.

I had to source some Performance Enhancers today for a mission. In less time than it would have taken to open a 3rd party app, I was able to find these on the Galaxy Map using the appropriate filters. Once at the station, the commodity market showed me who else in the area was selling these, along with the systems buying these. I could have saved a few credits by going to a nearby system, but I was more interested in finishing the mission rather than saving just a few credits, so I bought and delivered these and still managed a really good payout thanks to the mission rewards.

 

[xzanfr]

I don't agree with everything that Nyxson says, but he has some valid criticism.

Nyxson:
Plus points
1. Beautiful experience and graphics (wallpaper engine),
2. Virtual reality is amazing, but no VR support for on-foot gameplay in Odyssey.

Minus points
1. Insane grind for (engineer) upgrades, even for people who like to grind.
2. Necessary information about prices in other star systems is unavailable in-game. Players need third party tools to see the best and most lucrative buy/sell prices and round-trips.
3. The first-person-shooter stuff is bad compared to Halo, CoD and even Fortnite.
4. A gigantic galaxy, yet only a tiny percentage is used. The travel time through the galaxy compared to the amount of activities are difficult to justify.
5. There's almost no in-game story development except little excerpts that players must piece together.

Suggestions in the comments:

NONSTOPPE9
"There are a few ways to fix this. Some of them might sound very complex but I think they can do it with their very small team.
-Introducing an AI voice system for all the characters to make it feel lively
-live companions, you can get companions in the game but there is no content, liveliness, or anything beneficial other than controlling some guns for you. Better Faction Wars for example in the Oddessey DLC they could add on-planet fights and create warzones within the game.
-Adding a better mission system, with better pay, which can make it an alternative to grinding the combat or mining in the game
-New types of missions for example exploration missions, maybe where they will pay you to explore more or to reach a final system, so you can get the cartographic money + the mission rewards
-Rank Up missions and Permit missions that give you the following as rewards
-Lighten the Grind by creating a more robust mission system and increasing the rewards as you rank up for example being an elite could give you a better reward than the Novice
-And finally optimizing the game"

mojeiglu​

"players: we want new ships. FD: no, you don't want to
players: we want ship interiors. FD: no, you don't want to
players: we want to actually build bases. FD: no you don't want to
players: we want to explore new things in space... FD: no you don't want to
FD: you want to fight on bases. players: no, we don't want to..."

Elite dangerous is ruined and Frontier aren't capable of or interested in fixing it.
Gaming time is supposed to be fun time so move on and find something else - there's loads out there

 

[Nikephorus Phocas]

Does this mean ED is over and dead now?

 

[Jack Winter]

Yippee doom!

I've printed out new bingo cards, this is shaping up to be a hot round!

 

[Martind Forlon]

Following course of this thread is given right from the start. People which want to have from ED someting else should imo look for something else, i.e. new game made by someone else, because ED is created as FDev see it fit. This is very simple logic to follow, but it seems many have problem accept it

 

[Old Duck]

Following course of this thread is given right from the start. People which want to have from ED someting else should imo look for something else, i.e. new game made by someone else, because ED is created as FDev see it fit. This is very simple logic to follow, but it seems many have problem accept it

But every time I suggest that game, I get yelled at.

 

[Jack Winter]

Possibly some people like one game, and others like other games...

Too bad we don't have space games that satisfies everyone.

 

[Sera Scratch]

Possibly some people like one game, and others like other games...

Too bad we don't have space games that satisfies everyone.

I like Elite, it's the best of the 3-4 games in the genre. But despite that other games do somethings WAY better. So basically best of a bad situation. Well, so far, no idea what Starfield will be like.

 

[Old Duck]

Players don't need 3rd party tools to find good trades. You just need to learn how the game's market works.

I've shared and defended this position for a long time, but I do need to recant my claim that Elite doesn't need any third-party tool. There is one tool sorely lacking that we all, including myself, rely on third parties to provide.

DOCUMENTATION

I just went through the Pilot's Handbook and Codex, just to see if these answer any of the questions I've had about various gameplay loops, and both are woefully lacking. Sure, the handbook gives the most basic introduction to the game, but that's it. Nothing that I've been doing lately is covered in any amount of detail. I rely on smart folk like yourself to help me understand things like mission rewards, influence, engineering, the BGS, etc. I can't imagine trying to play this game as a new CMDR with only the Pilot's Handbook. I guess I'd be able to do the surface stuff, like trade, but I'd be totally lost when it comes to the more in-depth gameplay.

Now thankfully I do have that knowledge after years worth of forum college, so I can play the game without 3rd-party tools. Just call me Doctor Elite, PhD!

 

[Jack Winter]

I like Elite, it's the best of the 3-4 games in the genre. But despite that other games do somethings WAY better. So basically best of a bad situation. Well, so far, no idea what Starfield will be like.

I'm looking forwards to Starfield, we'll see how many hours it will manage to catch from me.

 

[TheRoninX]

I'm looking forwards to Starfield, we'll see how many hours it will manage to catch from me.

Keeping hopes in serious check on that one. Loved most Elder Scrolls games so hoping the extra time Starfield has been in the oven equals a good launch experience and enjoyable gameplay. Because if it does I will be dumping 1000s of hours into that one.

 

[Jack Winter]

Lol, Bethesda releasing something bug free and polished..

Still, adult xeno mods might take the world by storm. And what wouldn't my commander give for a night with Aisling!