Modes These arguments are tedious.

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Well again I hate to say it, but that is only an opinion that you, I and a lot of the playerbase I knew shared because it was such a big change however, NGE was implemented in 2005 and the game continued till 2011 so to say it 'killed' Galaxies despite it running for a further 6yrs is a bit silly. What killed it was more SOE wanting Warcraft like numbers for an MMO that was never going to get them, than anything else and then lucasarts withdrawing the licence to try and shoehorn us all into playing the old republic, which was the next attempt to get warcraft like numbers.



How else am I supposed to take a post which is a response to one of my own, where you use pronouns such as 'you', and mine is the only name you mention throughout the whole post?


Yea it struggled on, more than one dead game has, as an afterthought to most of the gaming community. They had good fanbase and player #'s which vanished after NGE. Even new players never amounted to the #'s of players before. They lost a LOT of money with the stunt they pulled. Most of the servers vanished as they no longer had the populations to justify them, even on the servers that managed to remain whole towns vanished. When you can go through whole cities and not run into even a single other player... the game is a ghost town. They had to start giving incentives and "veteran" rewards to try and keep people playing it. Heck look at the EMUs now... one NGE server and it is nearly empty vs the others which are based on the original game.



I did say you, but was in reference to you the griefers not you the Goose
 
Your effort translating into nothing is normal?

If you do not want to nab Goids, you should not be concerned about people getting more space peso for their increased effort.

If you do not want to deal with RHTs in the Open, you should not be concerned about people getting more space peso for their increased effort.

If players are able to meet you with higher effort of PvP, their interest should value more than braindead haulage in Solo.

Communism has to stop.


What has to stop is people trying to use any excuse to make one mode "better" than the others, especially when it is the mode THEY play in... Especially when there is no "increased effort", "Higher effort", or what ever other inane "effort" you want to use to try and paint your gameplay in Open as better then others who don't participate in your style of gameplay.

You've made your intentions clear and no amount of "For the people" kind of talk is going to change that. It isn't for the community it is for you.


You claim Communism has to stop, but you are on the flipping Politburo.. wanting rewards more than others get because of how you play.
 
Your effort translating into nothing is normal?

If you do not want to nab Goids, you should not be concerned about people getting more space peso for their increased effort.

If you do not want to deal with RHTs in the Open, you should not be concerned about people getting more space peso for their increased effort.

If players are able to meet you with higher effort of PvP, their interest should value more than braindead haulage in Solo.

Communism has to stop.

If players want a PvP focused game - they should go find one and not try to force this game into one.

Arrogance has to stop.
 
If players want a PvP focused game - they should go find one and not try to force this game into one.

Arrogance has to stop.

PvP is a well-represented face of ED, check youtube. Why are you telling so certainly what ED should and should not contain? And who is arrogant/trolling here?
 
PvP is a well-represented face of ED, check youtube. Why are you telling so certainly what ED should and should not contain? And who is arrogant/trolling here?


It is? Funny... I didn't realize that Youtube was the face of ED and the few players out of all who play the game that post there represented all of us... but of course since they represent you and YOU feel that you are what ED should be about I can understand why you think these thoughts.


As for Arrogance and trolling.... please check your posts.
 
PvP is a well-represented face of ED, check youtube. Why are you telling so certainly what ED should and should not contain? And who is arrogant/trolling here?

Check YouTube for what?
Frontier have never said Elite: Dangerous is a PvP game and have never put out videos saying PvP is the face of ED.
So by trying to make out "face of ED" is PvP shows you are the one trolling.

Frontier have always said players have a choice if they want to PvP or not.

David Braben even said he sees the game as a Co-Op game.
 
It is? Funny... I didn't realize that Youtube was the face of ED and the few players out of all who play the game that post there represented all of us... but of course since they represent you and YOU feel that you are what ED should be about I can understand why you think these thoughts.


As for Arrogance and trolling.... please check your posts.

Youtube/streamers ARE the face of ED. Better one than reviews of anyone anywhere. Yet both cannot describe the current state of things well enough.

And what I write here can be called arrogant or trolling? I do try to understand your reasoning as best as I can.

Yet I do keep forgetting that only minority of people are in-line with their nature and understand their own reasoning and causes of their own actions. Some people are getting offended beyond measure though when you guess one of those things right and they do not want to admit even to themselves.
 
Youtube/streamers ARE the face of ED. Better one than reviews of anyone anywhere. Yet both cannot describe the current state of things well enough.

And what I write here can be called arrogant or trolling? I do try to understand your reasoning as best as I can.

Yet I do keep forgetting that only minority of people are in-line with their nature and understand their own reasoning and causes of their own actions. Some people are getting offended beyond measure though when you guess one of those things right and they do not want to admit even to themselves.

The face of ED is;

https://www.elitedangerous.com/

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd1Xmm1TFBD-lfZUWaWf7EA

And these forums.

Anything player made is subjective and skewed by their own agendas - including their YouTube videos.

You want to know Frontiers opinion on the mode system, check the link in my Sig - all their official posts and answers.
 
The face of ED is;

https://www.elitedangerous.com/

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd1Xmm1TFBD-lfZUWaWf7EA

And these forums.

Anything player made is subjective and skewed by their own agendas - including their YouTube videos.

You want to know Frontiers opinion on the mode system, check the link in my Sig - all their official posts and answers.

Oh rly? Agendas now?:D

Somehow I went through that "wall" and saw nothing but phrases teared off context. So, unlike streamers who want to reflect fun stuff in ED and get something out of that, you DO have an agenda.
 
Youtube/streamers ARE the face of ED. Better one than reviews of anyone anywhere. Yet both cannot describe the current state of things well enough.

And what I write here can be called arrogant or trolling? I do try to understand your reasoning as best as I can.

Yet I do keep forgetting that only minority of people are in-line with their nature and understand their own reasoning and causes of their own actions. Some people are getting offended beyond measure though when you guess one of those things right and they do not want to admit even to themselves.


I am sorry no, you may think they are but they are not.

And all you have to do is look at your thread about casual vs hardcore, look at all the red text and claims you've made here. You have built this whole thing around YOUR game style and what YOU like and how ED is such a bloody failure because it does not cater to YOU.... pretty arrogant, especially again when you admitted you wanted EVE in a cockpit so you decided to go on your ranting arguments to try and accomplish that and all of the rest of the community who actually bought the game because it was the game it is can go jump in the loo as PVP and your desires are what is important.

Also that you think that only a minority of people are in-line with their nature and understand their own reasoning and causes of their own actions is rather arrogant. You are pretty much claiming that only you and a "few others", sounds like 90's type talking, are inline with your nature and yada yada yada... while the rest of us poor ignorant sods are just attacking what we don't understand and are unaware of why we do what we do... seriously???
 
Interesting point, but then I have to admit I'm a bit biased here as it's what I'm doing the last couple of weeks. Anyway, I'm surprised I didn't came up with this idea myself. According to the current tenor where effort and risk should be rewarded I'm really curious how the supporter of this idea would also include special rewards for ironman play (easy to check, just take the insurance entry in the game stats). Maybe with even higher rewards for those doing it in Open. Should be way easier to track than any other proposals floating around. Or FA Off only, both ideally with hard coded switches, means non switchable once set and as long as such a commander would exist. Not that I realistically expect such modes would be coming, but certainly not less realistic than any rewards for just playing in Open.

Some people here should at least appreciate that not every PvE player is necessarily a coward or generally avoiding risk. The risk is a lot higher for someone losing a 2 month old ironman ship than someone losing his ship in a PvP event but otherwise normal game conditions. Also FA Off only is for most players a disadvantage as it's common sense that a mix of both flight assist modes being considered the most successful method.

Some final note addressed to those fighting hard for a general game change. You should realize that for any realistically chance for such a change you would need to make both PvPer and PvEer to act in concert. Unless such a miracle would happen (would require tremendous skills in diplomacy) Frontier would be more than daft to cave in for the PvPer alone. I think this should be crystal clear and understood by everyone, doesn't it? :)

My first thought:
"Why do you think that FA OFF only players should get more reward for their quirks???? This game was build to have both FA and FA OFF modes. Why do you think you have to get something for it?"

Bingo. So it is exactly some form of delayed jealousy. For this "unthinkable" event where increased effort some people do not want to take would result in something. And they would feel inferior for some reason.

This line of thought is shameful. And I am in for that as well.
 
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Oh rly? Agendas now?:D

Somehow I went through that "wall" and saw nothing but phrases teared off context. So, unlike streamers who want to reflect fun stuff in ED and get something out of that, you DO have an agenda.

All of the wall in in context and you can click the quotes to go back to the threads and see the context.

Streamers only stream what they find fun and what they think gets them views - so yes, they have an agenda.

Time and time again, Frontier have defended the mode system and us all having equal access to the game through it.
 
Oh rly? Agendas now?:D

Somehow I went through that "wall" and saw nothing but phrases teared off context. So, unlike streamers who want to reflect fun stuff in ED and get something out of that, you DO have an agenda.


You stated your agenda plainly... changing ED into Eve in a cockpit... and I love it how when faced with FDev's own words it is automatically out of context... yet it wasn't snippets posted that can be attempted to be twisted... but what is actually said by the developers of THIS game.


So yes you do have an agenda, don't play dumb and think people will be baffled by your feigned ignorance.
 
You stated your agenda plainly... changing ED into Eve in a cockpit... and I love it how when faced with FDev's own words it is automatically out of context... yet it wasn't snippets posted that can be attempted to be twisted... but what is actually said by the developers of THIS game.


So yes you do have an agenda, don't play dumb and think people will be baffled by your feigned ignorance.

Check my post just above.

And my other posts here. What I want and what I suggest are a bit different things. I am searching for a compromise.
 
Read again. I've said FA Off only
Do you really know what we're talking about there?
Maybe you should consult some of the top ace PvPer for some education on this topic.

?

I totally understand what you are talking about. And do practice to fly that way, with little but some success. And I agree that this can produce additional reward.

Of course, it is about freedom of choice.
And it is a bad game design when you have CHOICE to directly sacrifice your game expirience for performance per time unit

Easy equation:

1 profit - dealing with red hollow triangles = 1 profit.


Is this equation valid? Is not CHOICE here as clear as it can be?

This game has set of goals built-in. Getting worse game experience in ED equals to getting to them faster.
I know that good game experience is a vague parameter. Some people do not like extremal sports, I know it.
But dealing with Open also means spending WAY more time and effort for the same result, as well as risking the loss of your progress. Dodging systems where RHTs might be STILL results in more time spent and less return, so there is nothing to argue about. It is a plain fact. If you want to say that you can get same result per time unit with some activity in Open as well as Solo, you need KNOWLEDGE how to do it first. You do not need it in Solo.

It is not even entierly about the topic, it concerns all other activities related to acquiring bigger ships and engineering them.
Game declines to account the quality of your effort at all. As long as you keep working this conveyor belt, you will get the same reward per time unit.




This is the main flaw in ED. And efforts yielding the same result in Open and other game modes are of the same sort as well.

You resist to acknowledge this because most of you PvE players here are casual PvE players.
You do not want to get better in this game, and you are totally fine with the current state of things where it is completely unnecessary.


I do not blame you. It is a computer game, and we are grown-up people. But this situation is HIGHLY unfair to those who want to improve, yet receives no feedback for doing so.

Even if it is not the case, you still decline to recognize effort of people who do their stuff in the Open mode.

Yet I do keep forgetting that only minority of people are in-line with their nature and understand their own reasoning and causes of their own actions. Some people are getting offended beyond measure though when you guess one of those things right and they do not want to admit even to themselves.


Maybe you had missed those.
 
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Interesting point, but then I have to admit I'm a bit biased here as it's what I'm doing the last couple of weeks. Anyway, I'm surprised I didn't came up with this idea myself. According to the current tenor where effort and risk should be rewarded I'm really curious how the supporter of this idea would also include special rewards for ironman play (easy to check, just take the insurance entry in the game stats). Maybe with even higher rewards for those doing it in Open. Should be way easier to track than any other proposals floating around. Or FA Off only, both ideally with hard coded switches, means non switchable once set and as long as such a commander would exist. Not that I realistically expect such modes would be coming, but certainly not less realistic than any rewards for just playing in Open.

Some people here should at least appreciate that not every PvE player is necessarily a coward or generally avoiding risk. The risk is a lot higher for someone losing a 2 month old ironman ship than someone losing his ship in a PvP event but otherwise normal game conditions. Also FA Off only is for most players a disadvantage as it's common sense that a mix of both flight assist modes being considered the most successful method.

Some final note addressed to those fighting hard for a general game change. You should realize that for any realistically chance for such a change you would need to make both PvPer and PvEer to act in concert. Unless such a miracle would happen (would require tremendous skills in diplomacy) Frontier would be more than daft to cave in for the PvPer alone. I think this should be crystal clear and understood by everyone, doesn't it? :)


That is one of the things I would love for Fdev to implement. If not an Ironman Mode... then a "check box" so to speak that you can turn on in any mode, and if you are killed for any reason there is no re-buy screen. You are back to square one across the board. Only thing you keep is your commander name.
 
Check my post just above.

And my other posts here. What I want and what I suggest are a bit different things. I am searching for a compromise.


I would love to compromise... but it is funny cause what you just posted to PiCommander isn't a compromise and comes down VERY heavily on blaming PVErs on the "state of the game" all because of what you want. It is as much a compromise as 90's PVErs need to affect the BGS barely at all or not at all unless they are in Open and PVPers don't have to give up anything. Compromises are not one sided..
 
I would love to compromise... but it is funny cause what you just posted to PiCommander isn't a compromise and comes down VERY heavily on blaming PVErs on the "state of the game" all because of what you want. It is as much a compromise as 90's PVErs need to affect the BGS barely at all or not at all unless they are in Open and PVPers don't have to give up anything. Compromises are not one sided..

I was describing my first thoughts. And relating to you folks.
It seems like PIcomander misunderstood my post as well.

"Open fortification" I had described looks like this.
Some commanders have to be in Open, in SC not too distant from any object there.
They would be visible after scanning nav beacon wherever they are.
As long as they are not leaving SC (for more than 50 seconds), up to four of them would increase influence change resistance by 75%.
This can be tied to Masslock factor as well.

If they would just AFK their ships, you can come and kill them with no effort.
 
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The last one, right before my answer (post #882). And please don't try to "translate" your post by yourself. It's good possible that I'm just too thick. I honestly don't want to make fun of your spelling but that's just too much for me to understand anything.

Sorry, but I'll try.

For Mouse, I was describing how would I fix desparity between Open and Solo BGS/PP players. You can check post which I had answered, as well as OP, to understand what exactly I am talking about.

About your Hardcore and/or Open only and/or FA off unswitchable, I agree that this mode can have it's place, and having some returns for it as well. Also, I was describing line of thought of people who would oppose it.
 
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