Thoughts after attempting to set up my new Warthog flight stick.

[Windscreen Smudge]

First Thought: I don't have time for all of these flashy toys. I spent a good 3 hours calibrating everything last night and I'm still not satisfied. I don't even typically have that much time to play Elite.

Second Thought: I don't know how to fly anymore. If you're using a mouse and keyboard right now and ED has become a boring, pointless grind grab a flight stick and enjoy wetting yourself every time you approach the stations again.

Third thought: I was out of the habit of hitting the wrong keys and causing catastrophes. All of the catastrophes are about to be repeated because the wrong direction on the hat switches are twice as easy to hit.
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Conclusion: I just paid an exorbitant amount of money for a device designed to complicate my gaming experience. The silver lining, however, is that after I lose my sanity I can just wield the stick like a club and beat my computer into a lump of scrap metal, and it'll still be fully functional after I'm done.

 

[MatTheCat]

First Thought: I don't have time for all of these flashy toys. I spent a good 3 hours calibrating everything last night and I'm still not satisfied. I don't even typically have that much time to play Elite.

Second Thought: I don't know how to fly anymore. If you're using a mouse and keyboard right now and ED has become a boring, pointless grind grab a flight stick and enjoy wetting yourself every time you approach the stations again.

Third thought: I was out of the habit of hitting the wrong keys and causing catastrophes. All of the catastrophes are about to be repeated because the wrong direction on the hat switches are twice as easy to hit.
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Conclusion: I just paid an exorbitant amount of money for a device designed to complicate my gaming experience. The silver lining, however, is that after I lose my sanity I can just wield the stick like a club and beat my computer into a lump of scrap metal, and it'll still be fully functional after I'm done.

I have a Saitek X52, and couldn't even imagine the game being playable without a flight stick.

Just something you need to get used to as a flight stick is by far the most superior means of controlling this game.

 

[Digizz]

You really need to stick with it (lol no pun was intended!) - the warthog and HOTAS is amazingly good once you have it set up. Sooo controllable when docking etc. you can really get fine and accurate control. Let me know if you want my configs. Mine was based on someone else's here but has evolved a bit.

 

[Historiker]

I have a feeling that the OP's comments were tongue in cheek, so to speak

I too have the Warthog, and after 20 minutes of entering the configuration that I found here:

(EDIT: I am not allow to post links, even to other pages here in the forums. Do a google search for "Elite Dangerous Warthog layout" Read the very helpful post by MikeyTT.)

piloting my mobile pinata is dirt simple.

That page also has the switch assignments as printouts as well as a T.A.R.G.E.T. profile if you want it (I did'nt bother).

I never have to take my hands off the HOTAS (that's the point right?).

I also recommend looking into "Voice Attack", a simple program that allows you to interact directly with the computer. You can tell it to enter hyperspace, retract gear, etc. And it talks to you, you can even ask questions about the Elite universe and it will explain concepts and topics to you.

 

[Kramster]

I switched from a 3D pro stick to a Warthog stick and had some real issues for a while mostly due to the loss of the twist yaw axis.
It takes time to learn new bindings and no stick is the same, and if you are used to K&M then the process is even harder.
I solved my main issue, being the lack of yaw twist axis, by mapping yaw instead of roll on the x axis and after a few days of trial and error am back in my comfort zone.
My advice is stick with it, it will come but don't expect to be fluid for several days even after you are happy with your bindings

 

[Yokai]

First Thought: I don't have time for all of these flashy toys. I spent a good 3 hours calibrating everything last night and I'm still not satisfied. I don't even typically have that much time to play Elite.

Second Thought: I don't know how to fly anymore. If you're using a mouse and keyboard right now and ED has become a boring, pointless grind grab a flight stick and enjoy wetting yourself every time you approach the stations again.

Third thought: I was out of the habit of hitting the wrong keys and causing catastrophes. All of the catastrophes are about to be repeated because the wrong direction on the hat switches are twice as easy to hit.
|
Conclusion: I just paid an exorbitant amount of money for a device designed to complicate my gaming experience. The silver lining, however, is that after I lose my sanity I can just wield the stick like a club and beat my computer into a lump of scrap metal, and it'll still be fully functional after I'm done.

It takes time to:

A) find a configuration for your stick (or HOTAS) that actually makes sense to you. For example, I've changed at least 50% of the default game config for my X52. And it took me several days to really decide what wasn't working for me, what to experiment with making different, testing, iterating...

B) Retrain your muscle memory to confidently use the new control scheme (and stick mechanics) without error or slowness. I'd say it took a solid week or more for this learning curve when I swapped from a wired XBox controller to an X52 HOTAS.

 

[Lirezh]

Your conclusion is flawed.

Did you expect to become an expert pilot by investing money into good hardware? That's your main fault.

The Warthog is by far the best stick out there, it is 1:1 designed after a real stick with same haptik feedback. It can be used by pilots blindly in a perfect way, they do not accidentially hit a wrong button.
Every single button has a distinct feel, pressing them is also different.
Another Joystick would have been more difficult for you then, those are designed way worse. I have seen the 200$ Saitek one and in comperison it's a cheap toy (no offense guys, I know many use and love it).

If you do not have time for the game, go back to mouse.
If you want a good experience invest those hours required to learn how to fly using HOTAS.


I am playing with the Warthog and the default settings from Elite are quite good already.

This is what I did, I only changed a few buttons:
I added Galaxy map navigation, shield cells and changed targetting.
I put yaw on the digital pov-like button on your left thumb and it works like a charm there. (I used 2 directions for yaw-left and 2 directions for yaw-right so I always hit the right one no matter if throttle is pushed down or up)

 

[Historiker]

I switched from a 3D pro stick to a Warthog stick and had some real issues for a while mostly due to the loss of the twist yaw axis.
It takes time to learn new bindings and no stick is the same, and if you are used to K&M then the process is even harder.
I solved my main issue, being the lack of yaw twist axis, by mapping yaw instead of roll on the x axis and after a few days of trial and error am back in my comfort zone.
My advice is stick with it, it will come but don't expect to be fluid for several days even after you are happy with your bindings

Kramster, have you considered a set of rudder pedals?

The Warthog, and most other high end HOTAS controllers, drop the twist stick as at this level they expect that you will have a set of pedals to complete your virtual cockpit. Something to look into.

It took me a while to get used to using a stick that didn't have twist, mostly because I had gotten used to not twisting the stick while flying as I have used rudder pedals since I put my own 3D Pro on the shelf (loved that controller by the way).

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

Didn't buy the HOTAS, just the stick. The HOTAS, in my opinion, doesn't do justice to the FA-Off mechanics, so I'll be building something of my own. If I'm lucky I'll be starting on that this weekend. Until then my left hand stays on the keyboard. I do have a set of pedals though and they're nice but using them and the stick is a bit disorienting in the beginning. It feels a bit like driving, but driving tends to happen in two dimensions with very little roll.
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All of the hate for M/KB. Don't be fooled, I can already tell you I won't be able to do any better with a flight stick than a M/KB setup. If anyone is reading this and thinking that a flight stick will make them a better pilot you can scratch that, you just need to try some new bindings until you find what works for you. I bought the stick for the immersion factor, with an Oculus to come later if they fix it for people with corrective lenses.

 

[Digizz]

Pedals are great - I'm both a fixed wing and rotary private pilot so pedals are second nature anyway

one thing I found that helped tremendously with the warthog stick is to do the spring mod - basically take out the big stiff spring for a significantly lighter feel. I used to get bad sore wrists before but that's gone now.

 

[Attis]

Funny read

I went through the same experience when I got CH products HOTAS + peddels + head tracking + voice attack for Elite ... now I can't play the game without them. It all becomes natural once muscle memory starts to kick in.

 

[Zenicetus]

Pedals are great - I'm both a fixed wing and rotary private pilot so pedals are second nature anyway

Yep, I'm not a pilot in real life, although I spent a lot of time in helicopters as a commercial aerial photographer back in the day (luuuve those Jet Rangers with the door off). I fly flight sims, and had the whole HOTAS, pedals, TrackIR thing going before buying ED. My first landing was a piece of cake; very intuitive yawing with pedals.

one thing I found that helped tremendously with the warthog stick is to do the spring mod - basically take out the big stiff spring for a significantly lighter feel. I used to get bad sore wrists before but that's gone now.

Ditto, I recommend trying this to all Warthog users. Here's a YouTube link on how to do it (and you don't need to remove the baseplate like this guy does):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBMBR8M0z2E

It's easy to do, and easily reversible if you don't like it. The stick just "floats" with very slight centering tendency, so long dogfights are less tiring in ED. I prefer the stiff tension in air combat games, to build muscle memory on where the stall point is in a tight turn. But for "twitchier" games like ED, I think looser is better.

 

[Zenicetus]

All of the hate for M/KB. Don't be fooled, I can already tell you I won't be able to do any better with a flight stick than a M/KB setup. If anyone is reading this and thinking that a flight stick will make them a better pilot you can scratch that, you just need to try some new bindings until you find what works for you.

I wouldn't go as far as saying that a flight stick/HOTAS is the best setup for everyone, or that it will even automatically make you a better pilot. I know there are some very skilled mouse and keyboard Commanders out there.

However, there is one big benefit in getting comfortable with HOTAS (and pedals) if this isn't the only game you plan on playing that supports them. Once you're used to it, it's very easy to transfer the skills to other space games and air combat sims.

You can even keep some of the control mappings consistent, which helps the learning curve with a new game. The controls I have mapped for roll, yaw, pitch, landing gear, enemy targeting, secondary weapon fire, weapon select, chaff, and a few other things, are the same in ED as they are in other air combat and space games I've been playing over the last few years. It keeps me from getting confused in my old age.

 

[CATPAIN KIRK]

Pedals are great - I'm both a fixed wing and rotary private pilot so pedals are second nature anyway

one thing I found that helped tremendously with the warthog stick is to do the spring mod - basically take out the big stiff spring for a significantly lighter feel. I used to get bad sore wrists before but that's gone now.

I've never gotten sore wrists and like my stick being stiff. What I disliked was the stiction, so I used to grease mine.

Had to replace my stick after three years of abuse in December and actually, they seem to have changed the lube - no significant stiction on the new one.

 

[TYK]

I have a Saitek X52, and couldn't even imagine the game being playable without a flight stick.

Just something you need to get used to as a flight stick is by far the most superior means of controlling this game.

Kind of a leap from "You should get a HOTAS" to "You should get a $450 HOTAS that's a replica of an actual air force flight system" tho.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

I've never gotten sore wrists and like my stick being stiff. What I disliked was the stiction, so I used to grease mine.

Had to replace my stick after three years of abuse in December and actually, they seem to have changed the lube - no significant stiction on the new one.

Since I haven't noticed any "stiction" I'm going to assume mine is one of the newer models (bought used, so I can't say for sure), and the stiffness of the spring is just right for me. I won't need to mod a thing on my stick.
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I've decided I'm gonna bring my Asp back to civilization, park it, and jump back in a sidey and start the game from scratch. Seems like the most logical thing to do is to learn the game all over again just like I did the first time.

 

[Zenicetus]

Kind of a leap from "You should get a HOTAS" to "You should get a $450 HOTAS that's a replica of an actual air force flight system" tho.

The difference in the Warthog stick isn't just that it's a replica, it's the build quality. Especially the switches. Nobody needs that level of build quality to play a computer game, but it's available if you want it, and can afford it.

Aside from build quality, the danged thing is so big and heavy that it adds to the feel that I'm flying something real and substantial, not a lightweight plastic controller driving a computer game. It's all about the "immersion," you know.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

The difference in the Warthog stick isn't just that it's a replica, it's the build quality.

Completely true. I work with steel and aluminum daily, and I promise that the build quality of this stick isn't just tougher materials. Everything is machined and fitted well, the materials aren't just the cheapest type that they could use to serve the purpose, this stick is a solid piece of craftsmanship and I personally feel if I had spent my money on any other stick I would have felt cheated. Buying this, I kind of feel like I cheated the person I bought it from and I might just paypal him another 50 bucks.
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Honestly, the baseplate of this thing is 1/8th of an inch of cold rolled steel the size of a large mouse pad. Completely unnecessary.

 

[Kramster]

Kramster, have you considered a set of rudder pedals?

The Warthog, and most other high end HOTAS controllers, drop the twist stick as at this level they expect that you will have a set of pedals to complete your virtual cockpit. Something to look into.

It took me a while to get used to using a stick that didn't have twist, mostly because I had gotten used to not twisting the stick while flying as I have used rudder pedals since I put my own 3D Pro on the shelf (loved that controller by the way).

looked at them but not really keen having more under my desk than I currently have not to mention the ammo it would give the wife to ridicule me further To be honest since remapping yaw to z axis and roll to my Tartarus I am doing great again, I don't miss the 3d Pro at all now and getting the stick for less that £150 I am a happy space bunny

 

[Lirezh]

I was not aware you get the Warthog without Thrust control, that's an important part ..

I am quite sure that you will never be able to match a good pilot with HOTAS with your mouse/keyboard control.
On the other hand I think that a Mouse keyboard control is easier to learn and noob-proof while a Joystick will be on a longer learning curve.

The reward is better control over your vehicle and imersion.

The Throttle control is not wasted money, you have dedicated hold-buttons as well as a bunch of buttons around your fingers (every single one very nice to reach without looking).
With the complete HOTAS you can control the ship and game completely without the need to ever touch your keyboard or mouse at any situation.

With just a Joystick you miss all the nice extras and you will still need the keyboard/mouse for various controls.


I suggest you just go back to Mouse/Keyboard control, as you said you don't have time to play the game so play it in a way which is easiest for you.



P.S.
You do not need pedals for Elite Dangerous, you don't need them in general except for highly realistic flight simulations but in ED you do not get anything from Pedals.
All you need is yaw, I had the option to put Yaw on an analog stick on the thrust control and tried it, yaw in ED is best on a digital switch (I use a pov-like-head on the left thumb).
I strongly doubt that the sticks with Twist are that nice, you lose fine control of pitch/roll if you have to twist the stick.