I was indeed wondering myself why should anybody gank, padblock or suicidewindern? It is surely arguable about... But there are a lot of fun and interesting things to do in ED when you don't submit to the grind. I can't stop to make assumptions from this ingame behavior to personal characterization of those players. Of course all reasonable acting PvPers are excluded from this assumptions.
To Solo Play Players: If You Could Disable PVP, Would You Play in Open Play Mode Instead?
- Thread starter AMX-008 GaZowmn
- Start date
in essence, anyone who ganks due to 'lol ship go boom' is a troll.
What i mean is that the suggested 'fix' is a nice 'no u' card for seal clubbers. Getting someone new banned from high security is additional salt in the wound to the ship destruction by police (as the seal accidentially attacked the clubber)
People keep saying that blocking the gankers solves the problem. But of course it doesn't.
Say I'm a n00b excited to be in Deciat and meeting "AN ENGINEER" for the first time. Then I get interdicted, and have no clue what that is, or if I do, I have no idea why this opponent is so hard to evade (I could evade most of the NPC ones which came before). Then, crackle crackle boom. What?
1) Do I even know that it was a real player who did this? (n00bs won't necessarily know how to tell)
2) Do I know that I can block them? (Nobody ever tells n00bs about the social screen or blocking abilities in the comms panel)
3) If I do magically know this (the "Your ship was destroyed by" screen does NOT tell a n00b that it was a real person who can be blocked) what would it achieve?
I would like to see:
Say I'm a n00b excited to be in Deciat and meeting "AN ENGINEER" for the first time. Then I get interdicted, and have no clue what that is, or if I do, I have no idea why this opponent is so hard to evade (I could evade most of the NPC ones which came before). Then, crackle crackle boom. What?
1) Do I even know that it was a real player who did this? (n00bs won't necessarily know how to tell)
2) Do I know that I can block them? (Nobody ever tells n00bs about the social screen or blocking abilities in the comms panel)
3) If I do magically know this (the "Your ship was destroyed by" screen does NOT tell a n00b that it was a real person who can be blocked) what would it achieve?
- The chances of being ganked by the same player again are pretty much zero... and blocking them has only prevented THAT ONE PERSON - not the whole loop.
- The actions of the ganker are not in any way disincentivised. He'll keep doing it to OTHER paying customers... the supply of which will eventually dwindle as word gets out.
I would like to see:
- solid disincentives to the ganking gameplay loop.
- solid protections for people of lower abilities against people who are "end game" in fit and function.
- a fairer, intelligent C&P system which doesn't penalise a throttle-nervous n00b for "Pad loitering", but DOES penalise (in some real sense) people who destroy others' enjoyment of the game.
- the PvP gaming surface levelled so that combative interactions between widely differing skill levels are much harder to achieve.
- n00bs given FAR MORE INFORMATION about what things are in this game and how to access them. Not least :
- First interdiction: should be in a training mode. If it's done by a real player, the interdiction fails on the aggressor's end, and the victim sees a training scenario about interdictions, how to interact with it, and the consequences of failing. They should also be shown how to differentiate between real and NPC aggressors.
- "Your ship was destroyed" screen: How you got there, and why. One free rebuy on first destruction. If you were burst by another player, a block button RIGHT THERE. Information about Solo mode and a "Rebuy and go solo" button RIGHT THERE ON THE SCREEN.
- Infringement info on first infringement; and far looser limits for newer players on things like pad loitering, slot blocking etc. I get a pad loitering warning on my own carrier when I'm flying above the slot behind the one I'm landing on at 99m/s!! N00bs should not get this.
- Info about your early targets before you engage with clear info about consequences of attacking THAT target.
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That is not the case actually - because of the way that instancing works, you are usually online with the same players in the same your time zone in a particular system, after a while in open you get to know them...
Gankers usually have purple hair
First thing you should do when entering a new system in open is check the history tab - there you can see the players active in the same instance with you.
The same names often return.
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Back to my point: How would a n00b know this? I assume from the lack of comment that you agree with the rest?
I do not make assumptions about their IRL characteristics, but if said player would resort to trolling activity if straigt pew pew boom is hindered, that tells me all I need to know about their ways and motivations of playing the game. They are in just to troll people. And THAT should elevate problem with dealing with those people to FDevs in game moderation. Basically warning or outright banning them to solo.
The advice to new players is invariably to use Solo when visiting Engineers.
They should have seen plenty of hollow squares in the starter systems.
This is the essence of a lot of the Open vs Open PvE arguments:-
In any MP game you are going to have people act "unfairly" and as (subjectively) jerks. The issue crosses the line when the TOS are broken - genuine harrassment, disgusting language, and rightfully players who do this should be reported and banned.
However, toasting n00b CMDRs isn't against the TOS, it's perfectly allowed by the rules of the game, no matter how some may find them distasteful.
Kills against weaker players in Deciat, hanging around the starter area waiting for kills (if anyone does that) is ganking, almost everything else is just "normal" play.
The solution isn't easy either, as 200+ pages have shown. There will ALWAYS be a proportion of players who will seek to ruin other's fun within the rules of the game - the solution is finding a way to minimise this by providing carrots and/or stick to promote other types of gameplay.
OK, but I'm afraid I do make assumptions about their IRL characteristics. The debate has been run many times before, but basically I claim that if they're not attacking for gameplay reasons (credits or suchlike), they must be attacking for RL reasons instead. That's why I think block (an RL effect) is appropriate response.
Best disincentive is PvE mode, PvP flag and desicated places for free form combat.
Are we still talking about pressing a button and seeing some pixels on the screen hitting other pixels, right?
Because I find any IRL discussion as hard-to-go when the game is PEGI 7 and I personally know at least four minors (including my daughter) playing the game.
Just to be clear: they don't care about "trolling", they just like to have fun shooting at other players.
Well, some people get upset when pixels go boom. Others get upset when they disappear on a 15-second timer. In both cases the upset is unfortunately a RL effect.
FD thinks it's "normal" play. I think it's toxic game culture.
Desiccated places? Heavens forbid, just enjoy your beer while pixel ships go boom.
Tbh it's pretty hard to think of more irrelevant things than what you think about a game you don't even play.
what youngsters think about c&p system in the game?))
I'm particularly speaking about those "get new mechanic to strengthen consequences of criminal behauviour -> will lead to this and that trolling scenario" That just tells me that if such fears are realized that certain players are just trolls wanting to degrade people's game experience. And should be dealt accordingly.
Yes killing noobs is not against TOS, probable inventing creative ways to burden really innocent party with C&P punishments either is not against LETTER of TOS. Thats the point were human decision is needed. I'm moderator in some forums. And I DO punish people who may behave in strictly speaking within letter of rules but are still disruptive and negative influence for forum community.
If you get your fun from trolling people, I say your fun is something community does not need.
Frontier went the 'efficient' way, as always. It's called blocking. It's unlikely they will commit to more moderative issues. Which is anyway quite hard, if not outright impossible, to do on the technical level because the game uses Peer to Peer and has no dedicated server that "sees" what's going on inside an instance.
They can ban people, certain boy wizard character for example was banned from open. He can play all he want. In solo.