Travel Needs to be Fun and Engaging

[Chrysophylax]

So about 73% of the total travel time is literally NOT DOING ANYTHING WORTHWILE.

Says it all.

Exactly. Colonia is supposed to be a remote outpost with a non-trivial travel time. Getting there is supposed to be an achievement.

I get this argument. What I don't get is when people use this to prevent changing anything about travel because it would cheapen earlier achievements. It doesn't, and in fact it would be what gives them value. The first person to summit the Everest did it with fewer and worse resources than what's available today - it's what makes it a colossal achievement and what gives us perspective.

 

[Luniticisi]

Some bright light thought it was a good idea to have a huge CG where players who usually would not go to Colonia to grind their way to Colonia for some ing contest. The 10 biggest puddles get a permanent base there in an area where there's skip all to do. Which resulted in many CMDRs loading up and follow the carrot. During which they realized long distance travel wasn't their thing. Or upon arrival they found there was little else to do but exploring and mining, and now face going to same distance back.

This is a much better idea than letting the second bubble be populated with CMDRs who would go there out of their own accord and create a distinctly different civilization than the one that exists in the bubble right now.

Ah, the old CG trick can have a strong influence on the weak minded.

 

[GreyAreaUK]

I get this argument. What I don't get is when people use this to prevent changing anything about travel because it would cheapen earlier achievements. It doesn't, and in fact it would be what gives them value. The first person to summit the Everest did it with fewer and worse resources than what's available today - it's what makes it a colossal achievement and what gives us perspective.

Trouble is, this still boils down to "I know it used to be difficult but I want it to be easier."

I personally suck at combat but I'm not asking for some sort of combat computer, or auto-trade module, or anything like that.

As I've said elsewhere, I have no problem with FDev adding other stuff to do while travelling, but I'm against any modifications that result in quicker/shorter travel.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Something I saw on Reddit this morning could also help with longer travel times:-

https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDange...y_system_overview_concept_community/?sort=new

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I get this argument. What I don't get is when people use this to prevent changing anything about travel because it would cheapen earlier achievements. It doesn't, and in fact it would be what gives them value. The first person to summit the Everest did it with fewer and worse resources than what's available today - it's what makes it a colossal achievement and what gives us perspective.

Lets run with this analogy.

I would love to go to the top of Everest just for the sights. But I don't have the stamina and don't really like cold. Result, I decided not to go to Everest. Besides, once you took some pictures and went "Oh!" and "Ah!" at the landscapes, there's not much else to do.

Contrasting with Colonia. I didn't mind the journeys to and from Colonia, because I always planned several Points of Interest along the way. And I like being remote in an underdeveloped part of the galaxy. But I can see why people wouldn't enjoy the trek to Colonia. Since there's not much to do besides Exploration and Mining, maybe not going to Colonia, but going to Maia instead would be the sensible way to go.

 

[Luniticisi]

I get this argument. What I don't get is when people use this to prevent changing anything about travel because it would cheapen earlier achievements. It doesn't, and in fact it would be what gives them value. The first person to summit the Everest did it with fewer and worse resources than what's available today - it's what makes it a colossal achievement and what gives us perspective.

FD have already added ways to make travel faster than it used to be (Engineers/neutron stars/synthesis) .. I am sure that if they added more 'things' to speed up travel further (and I am sure they will) some people will not be happy until travel is so trivial that you could get to SAG A* in 45 mins.

 

[bootsam]

I wouldnt mind paying someone to transport not just my ship but me also. I can sleep in a cabin somewhere. Now that I can sign up to. But the long distances are a consequence of an enormous galaxy. I think changing it would cheapen the whole experience. Doing the 5k was an achievement for me. Took me ages but I did it. Stuff Colonia though. That said, Ive just lightened my conda to 56ly, so who knows...

 

[Enderby]

Yes, space is big but the travelling is lame in ED. Jumping is not travelling, it's loading.

Supercruise should have had some things we could DO during it other than check the panels out for the umpteenth time. Galnet doesn't help as it's woefully dull itself.

 

[xondk]

.

Without wanting to insult. If you do not have enough free time to play Elite that doesn't mean the game should change, you could easily limit what you do.

Travelling is already fast now.

That said, you are basically asking for something that no other game I can come up with has done, so yeah, if no one else has done it, then how do you even do it? is it even possible.

An alternative approach would be add more of what you can find WHILE you travel, would be significantly better rather then "make travelling faster"

And lets be honest, the ONLY reason this is even being talked about is because of Colonia and people want to get there but it takes too long, that is it. Which it is supposed to be, it is a very remote outpost of humanity, not your next door neighbour?

 

[ArchEmperor]

The longer it takes to prepare the voyage through the deadly irradiated empty void of interstellar space, the better it will be. Rewards for each voyage must be high, and time it takes to prepare and setup must be increased.
It is ok if it takes the whole day to just make one jump. As long as it holds excitement, expectations and a promise of a better tomorrow. There could be plenty of things happening, or nothing.

Do I have enough water and food for the trip? Is my suit repaired and fully charged? Are my ship batteries loaded and ready? Fuel... forgot to remove the hose. Doing that now. Checking the hull for cracks, carefully caressing the surface with my hands. I can feel every tiny crater from micro meteorites. If I miss something, I will die out there. Checking my survival gear. Making sure the SRV is fully fueled and in top shape. Makings sure the cargo is secured. Station crew is very helpful.

It is time. Adrenaline rush and slightly increased heartbeat. This is going to be exciting. I will travel 12 light years through death and nothingness, through the blackness of space.

Last check again and then I enter my beautiful red tinted ship. Alone. Nobody will be able to help me out there. Well inside the small cockpit I put on my suit and make sure everything is working. I sit down in my pilot seat and look around through the canopy expecting to see traffic. Just one Adder and a docked Anaconda.

Precheck is complete. Now initiating startup sequence. Checking batteries to verify they are charging and yielding. Checking gas pressure to the thrusters and to the cabin. Calibrating the navigation computer and making sure I have the updated star charts, both in digital form and in physical form, in case of electrical failure. One last check on food and water. Is it enough? Making sure food dispenser is working. Checking medical equipment and medicinals. Everything looks ok, and the ship interior seem perfect. Doing electrical testing of connectors and cables. Everything seem to be working.

Time to go.

"Station Control, this is o7, requesting permission to launch into the black."
"... *BEEP* This is station control, o7 you are permitted to launch. You are granted exit whenever you wish."

Engines online, thrusters warming up. Error check, ok. Power seem to be distributed as it should. Fuel pump nominal. Sensors nominal. I can hear the magnetic clamps unlocking, releasing my beautiful baby.

This is going to be intense.

 

[xondk]

Yes, space is big but the travelling is lame in ED. Jumping is not travelling, it's loading.

Supercruise should have had some things we could DO during it other than check the panels out for the umpteenth time. Galnet doesn't help as it's woefully dull itself.

Jumping IS travelling, you just know it is a loading screen, maybe what you are asking for is masking the loading screen better? so that it maybe moves, maybe the stars move actively, nebular's moving in relation to you? so maybe that is what you want?

 

[Flavourless]

...a game with a 1:1 scale galaxy with no 'instant' or really fast travel system...

Thanks for the giggle [up]
We can do more than 1000 times light speed in system, and jump ranges are over 100Ly with engineering and boosts. But there is no fast travel? :S

 

[Snarfbuckle]

Lets run with this analogy.

I would love to go to the top of Everest just for the sights. But I don't have the stamina and don't really like cold. Result, I decided not to go to Everest. Besides, once you took some pictures and went "Oh!" and "Ah!" at the landscapes, there's not much else to do.

Contrasting with Colonia. I didn't mind the journeys to and from Colonia, because I always planned several Points of Interest along the way. And I like being remote in an underdeveloped part of the galaxy. But I can see why people wouldn't enjoy the trek to Colonia. Since there's not much to do besides Exploration and Mining, maybe not going to Colonia, but going to Maia instead would be the sensible way to go.

I get this part, I mean, i did calculate my free time and spent several weeks puttering over to Colonia so my beef is not the TRAVEL time, it's the LOST time not doing anything.

With 70%+ of said travel time just waiting for:

- FSD Charge
- FSD Countdown
- FSD Loading screen

just to manage:

- NOT crash into star
- Fuel Scoop
- Jump to next system

That does not include the stops I took along the way to enjoy the scenery, land on planets and scan the oddball blue planet.

But out of 8 hours 5 of those was literally not play time. If i could manage to SPEND that time ingame to DO stuff instead of merely waiting for something to load it would be a huge buff.

It's not like the DISTANCE is shortened in said travel merely the killing of time between NOT doing stuff and doing stuff.

- - - Updated - - -

Jumping IS travelling, you just know it is a loading screen, maybe what you are asking for is masking the loading screen better? so that it maybe moves, maybe the stars move actively, nebular's moving in relation to you? so maybe that is what you want?

70% of total travetime is WAIT.

- FSD charge up
- FSD Countdown
- Wichspace load screen

That's the problem with the travel, not the AMOUNT of jumps or RANGE.

- - - Updated - - -

why are people traveling to Colonia if they dislike travel in the game?

TRAVEL is not the issue but rather that 70% of said travel is waiting for automated actions to perform.

- FSD charge up
- FSD Countdown (AFTER we waited for charge up)
- Loading screen

 

[NVNM]

A jump screen where you control your ship, avoiding gravitational eddies would be cool. Slipstream from Andromeda springs to mind.

Yea, that sounds interesting.
I think the optimal solution would be some form of automated flight that is generally slower and less efficient than flying the same distance "by hand". (Essentially like in EvE)

 

[Flimsey]

Says it all.



I get this argument. What I don't get is when people use this to prevent changing anything about travel because it would cheapen earlier achievements. It doesn't, and in fact it would be what gives them value. The first person to summit the Everest did it with fewer and worse resources than what's available today - it's what makes it a colossal achievement and what gives us perspective.

Lets run with this analogy.

I would love to go to the top of Everest just for the sights. But I don't have the stamina and don't really like cold. Result, I decided not to go to Everest. Besides, once you took some pictures and went "Oh!" and "Ah!" at the landscapes, there's not much else to do.

Contrasting with Colonia. I didn't mind the journeys to and from Colonia, because I always planned several Points of Interest along the way. And I like being remote in an underdeveloped part of the galaxy. But I can see why people wouldn't enjoy the trek to Colonia. Since there's not much to do besides Exploration and Mining, maybe not going to Colonia, but going to Maia instead would be the sensible way to go.

why a alpinist (can't remember his name right now) would climb a specific mountain was "-because it is there". At that time it was a big effort to climb Everest, it is still a big effort but today you have teams of sherpas that carry everything upp the mountain an put up static rope for u to follow. So now if you have enough money you can probably be carried to the top.

In the alpinist community (I'm a free climber) ppl who climb Everest today have money or sponsors and want to check that of a bucket list or they are adventurer that live on seminars. Problem is that its hard to get sponsors for other peaks then Everest because everyone knows that top.
What has this to do with ED... It's the same, take away the effort you take away the fun. Climber don't want to repeat what done before the want to do new lines.

When exploring the only time I am idle is waiting for ship to cool off after scoping and in witch space rest of the time is scoping/honking and charging fsd/checking system map for planets to scan, if you do seweral thing at the same time its more fun. Try to shave of the seconds on your travel time.

Trading is pretty boring (and that is what I have used over 50% of my time for). Take away the time in flying and landing and just jump between two screens and press buy on one and sell on the other. You get money fast but no room to getting better, and that is not a fun its a boring work!


A simplified game will get players board faster!

 

[xondk]

TRAVEL is not the issue but rather that 70% of said travel is waiting for automated actions to perform.

- FSD charge up
- FSD Countdown (AFTER we waited for charge up)
- Loading screen

Ok, let me try to address then one at the time.

FSD Charge up - Instant or near jumping into load screen would disrupt gameplay elements, such as piracy and interdiction and e.t.c.
DSD countdown - same thing as above. Game play.
Loading screen - my loading screens are rather short depending on server 4-10 seconds, but mostly 4-6 seconds per jump, so it doesn't really bother me, I hear some people that have 30 seconds plus, and yeah, maybe the problem isn't the game there?

 

[Xender]

I do not know if wormholes are acceptable for Frontier but just imagine how cool using it will be. It will allow unpredictable one-way journeys. You may land in totally random place of the galaxy, filled with aggressive aliens and you need to make you way back!

Deep Space locations also will be very interesting. Deep space bases. More, more more, content!

 

[Luniticisi]

When exploring the only time I am idle is waiting for ship to cool off after scoping and in witch space rest of the time is scoping/honking and charging fsd/checking system map for planets to scan, if you do seweral thing at the same time its more fun. Try to shave of the seconds on your travel time.

Just in case you don't know .. Pro tip: after fuel scooping, once your Fuel scoop disengages (not stops taking on fuel but actually disengages/drops off the HUD) you're good to jump regardless of your ship temp.

 

[xondk]

I do not know if wormholes are acceptable for Frontier but just imagine how cool using it will be. It will allow unpredictable one-way journeys. You may land in totally random place of the galaxy, filled with aggressive aliens and you need to make you way back!

Deep Space locations also will be very interesting. Deep space bases. More, more more, content!

There has been talk of this nature including one way slingshot moves, though I guess sling shot is basically white dwarves and neutron stars now, which is all fine. In general one way travel doesn't bother me 'as' much, however it shouldn't really be predictable and in no way safe, basically space needs to get a little more dangerous before i think it is fitting, more events that can happen in space outside of npc's.

- - - Updated - - -

Just in case you don't know .. Pro tip: after fuel scooping, once your Fuel scoop disengages (not stops taking on fuel but actually disengages/drops off the HUD) you're good to jump regardless of your ship temp.

Just FYI, this can depend on build.

 

[CMDR Dumbfries]

I'll add three more to the list.
-jump gates
-worm holes
-allow my ship to make one large jump based on the max range of the available fuel in my tank