Ungulate Talk

The problem is that you dont challenge conventional wisdom you just try to enforce your view as the absolute truth
Caprines and cattle being antelope isn't really an opinion though, that's literally just how the genetic analysis shakes out. The subjective part is how you define the clades between family and genus, which is vastly more trivial.
Conventional wisdom says caprine and cattle aren't antelope when there's no realistic basis for this establishment. That's what I'm trying to challenge.
 
Truth is not subjective. Science can be though. Especially Biology because of how much data there can be. To be a biologist you have to understand statistics!
We also don't have a good grasp on what a species actually is let alone a subspecies. People say "If they reproduce they're a species." The problem is wolves, dogs and even coyotes all can in theory reproduce yet they're different species. And then, you have bacteria and other forms of life that just divide to reproduce.
 
Truth is not subjective. Science can be though. Especially Biology because of how much data there can be. To be a biologist you have to understand statistics!
We also don't have a good grasp on what a species actually is let alone a subspecies. People say "If they reproduce they're a species." The problem is wolves, dogs and even coyotes all can in theory reproduce yet they're different species. And then, you have bacteria and other forms of life that just divide to reproduce.
im not saying science or truth are subjective,, im saying that in this moment its a subject that its not consensual so imposing her ideas as absolute when as you said we dont have a "good grasp" its just wrong
 
im not saying science or truth are subjective,, im saying that in this moment its a subject that its not consensual so imposing her ideas as absolute when as you said we dont have a "good grasp" its just wrong
I'm sorry to offend anyone and I didn't say anyone's ideas were absolute. I was just talking. The only thing absolute is the truth. Also, science isn't the truth... Its just the pursuit of knowledge. Science changes as people get better data...
 
Bighorn Confirmed today! Any other New World ungulates you feel would be great additions?

For me personally it’s Musk Ox all day
Southern Pudu would be my personal choice, especally if we should get a forest pack or something, but i can see the appeal of musk ox and the fact that the mountain goat and a deer would be neat for NA zoos, just nothing id be personally excited for
 
Bighorn Confirmed today! Any other New World ungulates you feel would be great additions?

For me personally it’s Musk Ox all day
Im not really interested in any to be honest. Pudu would be neat, but for a small deer id actually prefer muntjac or tufted deer to be honest. Guanaco im not totally opposed to, but im also fine just using llama and alpaka as stand ins in mixed exhibits as real zoos do aswell.
Less subjectively speaking NA is kinda missing a more traditional deer and the musk ox is a community favorite, so those would be good additions even tho i personally dont really care about them.
 
For South America i still want a deer, marsh or brocket with pudu would do it for me, and i would gadly take an SA tapir.

For NA i would take an elk because an more traditional deer is really lacking on NA animal selection and the musk ox to close the arctic.

Aside from those, i'm not really interest in more american ungulates, i think the bulk was already finished with the moose, and the remaining option like some of the NA deers, wild camelids, mountain goat and more peccaries aren't exactly priority to me.
 
Bighorn Confirmed today! Any other New World ungulates you feel would be great additions?

For me personally it’s Musk Ox all day
There are a ton of ungulates that I would sort of like to see in Planet zoo, but not many that make me excited. I think the muntjac is the only one that is both great and would get me cheering, but it's an old world animal.

The muskox is a very solid option. I would definitely use it sometimes.

For pure selfishness, I would probably add the white-tailed deer next. I like its range of biomes and find it important for building local wildlife refuges. It is the only native ungulate where I've lived, and it is the national mammal of Honduras and Costa Rica. It can even be found in parts of South America. However, I think the WTD is kind of like the coyote in that people from other continents probably won't care about it at all, and many people who do live here will regard it as a pest, backyard, or game animal more than a zoo species. Few would cry if it didn't show up. On the other hand, there are quite a few people who would sorely miss the wapiti, which is majestic and has beautiful calls even if its range isn't quite as useful to me. The wapiti would probably go over better if we get a NA deer at all. I think the bear and a bird or two are more important than any ungulates at the moment.

For South America, I think a pudu or marsh deer could be somewhat cool as far as ungulates go. Pudus are tiny and cute, but I don't think they'd have many useful interspecies enrichment combos as the muntjac. I could be wrong about that, but I think their range is small. I like the orange coat and aquatic tendencies of the marsh deer. I could easily live without them, though. The lowland tapir seems like the most important one although I'm personally fine with substituting the Baird's. I think that's the one people would miss most. I'm fine using alpacas and llamas in place of their wild counterparts, the guanaco and vicuña, and have little to no interest in a wild camelid. Mountain tapirs seem fun and fluffy, but they are too rare in captivity and unrequested to be considered strongly. A mod would be cool, though.

In short, the wapiti, lowland tapir, and especially the musk ox are the main good/ok options left, and if support somehow goes on for ages, I wouldn't mind a South American deer and would personally like the white-tailed.
 
I was recently at a zoo with different ungulates and people were calling most of them Bambi:

  • red duiker = Bambi
  • dik-dik = Bambi
  • dama gazelle = Bambi
  • waterbuck = Bambi
  • sitatunga = Bambi

Funny the zoo doesn't have any deer.
 
The "small ungulate" in question:
1746224302610.png
 
If it's India, I'm hoping for at least the blackbuck and a deer (chital or hog deer would be best choices) but would definitely not mind more. Nilgai and gaur are also very nice.
India (and Asia in general) is a region where I wouldn't mind an ungulate heavy roster at all.
 
Back
Top Bottom