Velocity Vector

Scoobe87

Scoobe87
I am relatively new to these forums so this may have been suggested in the past.

I was a Navy pilot and my HUD had a velocity vector. Basically it depicted the true direction of travel relative to the attitude of the of the jet. So when we were slow and dirty with everything hanging out, the nose would be pointing above the horizon but the velocity vector (in level flight) would be on the horizon. It provided critical information for knowing where the jet was actually traveling vs. where the nose was pointing.

Ever since I started playing this game, I was puzzled that it didn't have a similar HUD indicator since the attitude of the ship can be pointing in a different direction than you are traveling (especially decoupled). I get a little disoriented when going into a bat turn and I cant tell if my ship is tracking in the turn or if I am bleeding off.

Side story, the velocity vector was pretty useful during carrier landings. We learned to track the VV along a certain path on the carrier deck to help hold on centerline when landing. In the typical colorful way the military explains things, the VV was described that "if you put the VV on a particular point on the ground, you'll impact that precise spot on the ground." So on the carrier deck, the ship is moving, so the VV had to move along a path on the deck and then right before getting into the wires, it should be pretty close to the gap between the 2 and 3 wire.

Maybe I just miss having one :)
 

Sysmon

Sysmon
We sorta have one in the dust that streaks past when we flit about in space. The travel direction of the dust is parallel (if opposite of) an imaginary velocity vector.

EDIT: A simple way of checking this is to boost and hit flight-assist off. Turn the boat and turn FA on again. Watch the dust slowly turn to eventually come from the direction you actually are trying to travel.

:D S
 
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Scoobe87

Scoobe87
Sysmon said:
We sorta have one in the dust that streaks past when we flit about in space. The travel direction of the dust is parallel (if opposite of) an imaginary velocity vector.

:D S
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lol yeah I have tried to watch the dust. Usually its after my brain goes "what, I am slowing down" then I look to the side and see the dust going up that I realize a little too late that I had too much.

I am being a little selfish too because I am wondering, if we had a VV, where is the optimal position to max turn with a speed circle. The blue maneuvering range on the throttle indicator is ok, just isn't precise and in a maneuverable engineered ship you can still depart your velocity from your attitude.
 

Decksmeck

D
I would also prefer the game to be more technical and precise. The VV would help us be better at piloting.

Many instruments sort of lack numerical information. Without precise information, it is kind of like flying in the early 20th century. See the ground, land, Wright brother style.

I admit though, I would have a real simulator, though a future where 1 person could actually operate a space craft. Therefore, it wouldn't look like the space shuttle, but the instrumentation would be intended to prevent any collisions. Designed with vehicle safety in mind. This game, the cockpit knows it lives in a game.

Edt: A simulation like that might have a less broad appeal though. Not sure. I would make a game highly focused on the ships. Elite Dangerous is not just about the ships. It seems more about the avatar. That is super important but the ships are the reason to have an avatar.

For example. I would spend resources to make realistic turbulence when landing on a planet. I would see the various atmospheres as an opportunity to create diverse weather systems that affect flight. Still, there needs to be a reason to land at all, but the fun is the imaginary space flying, ship modding, and ship design. That is what I would expand on for all professions.
 
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popuptoaster

P
Way back in the design discussion days there were quite a lot of us that didn't like it and wanted the dust removed but it was deliberately left in for the function you are describing, i believe it was felt that for less experienced players looking out of the window and seeing your direction of travel was more intuitive than looking at an instrument panel, especially in combat and for those of us who are FAO pilots we mostly have a feel for where we are and what we are doing.

I see no harm in having an instrument as well but (no offence) an ex navy pilot is a bit of an edge case, not many player would intuitively look for a direction of travel indicator. (y)
 

SouthernGorilla

S
Decksmeck said:
Edt: A simulation like that might have a less broad appeal though. Not sure. I would make a game highly focused on the ships. Elite Dangerous is not just about the ships. It seems more about the avatar. That is super important but the ships are the reason to have an avatar.

For example. I would spend resources to make realistic turbulence when landing on a planet. I would see the various atmospheres as an opportunity to create diverse weather systems that affect flight. Still, there needs to be a reason to land at all, but the fun is the imaginary space flying, ship modding, and ship design. That is what I would expand on for all professions.
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I would buy that all day long. As a real-life outlaw trucker I like having gauges to look at. I also tend to get annoyed by "futuristic" games that don't even have contemporary technology.
 

Gauntlet

Gauntlet
Back in the Alpha days, 6-7 years ago, there used to be HUD indicators for vector. They were scrolling vertical and horizontal lines similar to the scrolling lines we have now in supercruise. I'm not convinced they were actually that useful unless you were drifting very slowly though. Here's an old video of Isonona.

 

Scoobe87

Scoobe87
Ok just realized I don't have anything that demonstrates what I am talking about :) Found a F18 HUD video.
The VV is a small circle with a single vertical line off the top and two horizontal lines out the side. Notice it goes off screen regularly in the high G turns and at low speed. When it does go off screen, notice the funky W that comes up, that basically is your clue that your VV is off HUD and is the indicator if where your nose is pointing.

 

Sysmon

Sysmon
I would have liked a solution where we did have velocity vectors and all the gauges we can eat. But with the option of turning them all off in a sort of "basic mode". Considering the way cars are developing, I don't think it is unfuturistic to have no indicators of anything and spacecraft would be simple point-and-click devices telling the pilots nothing as our input is not really needed and probably detriment to precise flying anyway.

However, the UI must cater to the expectations of humans today.

:D S
 

Catherine Abrasax

Catherine Abrasax
[VR] here_it_comes said:
FD does not listen to us at all, this subforum may as well be called The Void.
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I prefer /dev/null personally.

What I never understood was that there's already an element on the HUD dedicated to showing a direction in space: the direction to your target signal, planet, system, or landing pad. It's pretty easy to understand, and players are already familiar with it. So why not piggyback on the mental model already in place by adding a blip for direction of motion to either the existing indicator or a second instance of the indicator? If they're worried it might be confusing to some, they could hide it behind an option.

Basically: filled for ahead, hollow for behind. Dead center when moving parallel to facing, at the boundary when perpendicular. Maybe fade out as you near a dead stop to avoid confusion between it and full forward/backward motion. For example, the following would mean you're moving forward, upwards, and to port:

DirectionIndicator.png
 
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Decksmeck

D
SouthernGorilla said:
I would buy that all day long. As a real-life outlaw trucker I like having gauges to look at. I also tend to get annoyed by "futuristic" games that don't even have contemporary technology.
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Me too. Many of the players here are more Avatar centered though and there is nothing wrong with that. I just like playing with the ships. I don't really care about the Avatar very much at all. I play Ghost Recon and games like that for FPS. It isn't as if adding space legs is bad. I don't think so at all, but I would be far happier if they had gone into the ship design direction. Instead of just modules, it would be nice to be able to modify the entire body too and for that to affect flight characteristics in space and in various atmospheres while doing various professions.
 

popuptoaster

P
Decksmeck said:
The HUD should be a module.

!!!!!Boom!!!!
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According to the lore the HUD is projected directly to the pilots brain via an implant and doesn't visually exist in the ship, this is also the reason you can "hear" sound in space it's artificially piped in to help with situational awareness. Now that we have space legs it might make sense to have various diffeent implants to chose from, some more combat centric for example, might have a VV indicator in the ships and better gun sights while on foot.

(Software versions for implants from different manufacturers maybe?)
 

Decksmeck

D
popuptoaster said:
According to the lore the HUD is projected directly to the pilots brain via an implant and doesn't visually exist in the ship, this is also the reason you can "hear" sound in space it's artificially piped in to help with situational awareness. Now that we have space legs it might make sense to have various diffeent implants to chose from, some more combat centric for example, might have a VV indicator in the ships and better gun sights while on foot.

(Software versions for implants from different manufacturers maybe?)
Click to expand...
Definitely!
 
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