Ships Vulture VS ASP

[Ziljan]

If you put in shield boosters, then the Asp shields can go to 330 (or higher even) without any sacrifices in utility. This is about what the power hungry Vulture will allow in a "balanced" build. You can boost a Vulture's shields too, but the sacrifices will be range/utility/firepower/etc. With an Asp you can have everything without being married to a high tech space station for re-outfitting to travel or change roles. The Asp is very liberating ship in this regard, and allows you to see more places and do more things when you get there. The only real sacrifice that you can't buy your way out of is maneuverability. But even this downside isn't too bad.

The Vulture encourages you to find a profitable cluster of systems with high tech stations and hunker down, while farming bad guys. It can do this role much more cheaply than a Asp, but an Asp can actually do it a little better if you have the money to upgrade it.

 

[Morbad]

If you put in shield boosters, then the Asp shields can go to 330 (or higher even) without any sacrifices in utility. This is about what the power hungry Vulture will allow in a "balanced" build.

My combat Vulture sits at 412MJ shield strength with an A4 SCB that is powered with hardpoints deployed. That's with A5 thrusters. If I dump the heatsink launcher or use a B class SCB, this goes up to 435-440.

 

[Cmdr Basskicker]

Why people keep insisting that a Vulture is gimped by it's PP output is beyond me. You can have an A rated Vulture without having a huge drawback as far as loadout goes.

OP should shoot for something like this.http://www.edshipyard.com/#/L=60N,5TP7Px3h03we01Q0mI,2-6Q7_6Q5K7_6k5A,7Sk7go4xo9ok2UI
IMO that build has everything you need for RES hunting, CZ's, and will also handle most SSS situations solo. Only thing you need to do is put your FSD, interdictor, cargo hatch, and fuel scoop in priority 3. Frame Wake Scanner in priority 2 (turn off KWS when you need to use FWS and it will turn on by itself). Everything else in priority 1 and you should be good to go.

Besides the ammo constraints there is very little downside to that build for PVE (PVP is another matter). Even the ammo issues are solved by using the cannon solely on big ship PP. Or if you just don't like the idea of having to run back for ammo then swap a couple things around and presto, you have power capacity for 2 pulse lasers.

 

[Alex Futura]

Maybe you are asking whether you should get a Vulture or ASP first? Because the ultimate answer is you should get both I went from Viper to Vulture and after getting into top 15% in the latest community goal activity had quite a bit of cash to splurge, so decided to buy ASP as well. It's work in progress at the moment while I buy the gear to get the ship to the specs I like, but I plan to use it for exploring and a little bit of trading, while Vulture can do what it does best - maintain law and order . However my opinion is that you can make more money from RES sites with Vulture first to then save up for an ASP.

 

[cowasaki]

Not having 4 hard points so I would have 2x lasers and 2 x multis is why I sold my vulture when I got an FDL but there is a rather large increase in cost.

 

[Ziljan]

My combat Vulture sits at 412MJ shield strength with an A4 SCB that is powered with hardpoints deployed. That's with A5 thrusters. If I dump the heatsink launcher or use a B class SCB, this goes up to 435-440.

If I wanted to sacrifice some utility on the Asp, I could also get my shields to be that high, and even slot a class 5A or 6A SCB. My DPS might drop slightly, but it would still keep pace with the Vulture. If I downgraded the shields to a total MJ equivalent of the Vulture, then my DPS would be slightly higher. I could even do it without having to reboot my FSD each time I stowed my hardpoints So again, the benefit of a Vulture is mostly price and maneuverability. The cost is a lack of flexibility and an anemic jump range. They are actually pretty well balanced I think because making an Asp as tough as a Vulture costs a small fortune. Half of the upgrades costs more than the base cost of a Vulture!

 

[Ziljan]

Not having 4 hard points so I would have 2x lasers and 2 x multis is why I sold my vulture when I got an FDL but there is a rather large increase in cost.

I felt the same way and tried to fix the problem by slotting a Class 2 MC and a Class 3 Beam. This turned out to be the strongest DPS combo available on the Vulture, because the beam is always on, and the MC only stops briefly to reload. It's significantly better than two beams, or two pulse, or any other class 3 kinetic combo.

 

[Phyl]

Maybe you are asking whether you should get a Vulture or ASP first? Because the ultimate answer is you should get both

I do want to get both eventually - but, yes, I was after understanding the strengths and weaknesses of the two to help me choose what would be best to get now. Advice on Vulture loadouts has been very useful.

Hoping to get back in my pilots seat tonight to take the old bird out for a spin...

Interesting discussion, thanks guys.

 

[cowasaki]

I felt the same way and tried to fix the problem by slotting a Class 2 MC and a Class 3 Beam. This turned out to be the strongest DPS combo available on the Vulture, because the beam is always on, and the MC only stops briefly to reload. It's significantly better than two beams, or two pulse, or any other class 3 kinetic combo.

On the FDL I use 3 x Gimballed beams and 2 x multi canons. The 3 x beams (1 class3 and 2 class2) knock out most ships and I switch to MCs if the heat builds up or I'm attacked by 4 at the same time and need to dispatch a couple quickly.

 

[Alex Futura]

I felt the same way and tried to fix the problem by slotting a Class 2 MC and a Class 3 Beam. This turned out to be the strongest DPS combo available on the Vulture, because the beam is always on, and the MC only stops briefly to reload. It's significantly better than two beams, or two pulse, or any other class 3 kinetic combo.

After using 2 Class 2 MCs on a Viper I did get quite attached to MCs, but since there is no Class 3 MC, I though that it underutilised the hardpoint. Since then I got used to using 2 Class 3 Pulse lasers and haven't looked back. Once I turn up my weapons to 4 pips they never stop. And a bonus is that you never need to spend time and money to buy ammo, so you can stay in a RES or Conflict Point until you had enough.

 

[Ziljan]

Two pulse do decent damage, but a beam and a class 2 Multi-Cannon do about 20-30% more dps and they fire at least as long as two Pulse on 4 pips. The ammo for a MC lasts for about 30-40 minutes of nearly continuous firing in a CZ and over an hour in a RES. The bullets are dirt cheap, and snce I kill things much faster, I spend less on shield cell ammo, which is far more expensive.

You might want to try it since it's a cheap experiment and both weapons can be found at almost any station. Most ships go down in less than one clip.

edit: the only trick is to not waste bullets on shields and always target the power supply.

 

[puca]

DPS is misleading for beams. Yes they do more DPS over the spam of a few seconds, but no ship can sustain beams for very long. What beam vs pulse is really about is your time on target. If you are a big slow ship that cannot guarantee time-on-target like the anaconda, maybe you want beams so you can burst ships down. If you are the vulture and can stay glued to the target constantly, pulses will do more sustained damage. Beams are very energy inefficient. I personally can't stand beam weapons on any ship.

 

[Ziljan]

A single beam does about 70% the dps of two pulse and can be sustained. A class 2 multi cannon does roughly same DPS as a single pulse to hulls and can also be sustained. If you put those together, the total DPS is higher than pulse once their shields go down.

 

[tough boy]

A single beam does about 70% the dps of two pulse and can be sustained. A class 2 multi cannon does roughly same DPS as a single pulse to hulls and can also be sustained. If you put those together, the total DPS is higher than pulse once their shields go down.

what's the best DPS loadout on an asp in your experience? If you're willing to share it

 

[Ziljan]

what's the best DPS loadout on an asp in your experience? If you're willing to share it

I haven't had time to experiment with the Asp as much as I have with the Vulture. To conserve energy, I have 4 pulse lasers and two Class 2 MCs up top. It rips through anything in light bulkheads, even an Anaconda.


That being said, the Asp is more of a non-military combat Vehicle. It excels at bounty hunting, pirating, and 1v1. But if you're going to wade into an all out warzone where all of targets have military grad bulkheads, a Vulture is probably a better choice simply because it is a smaller nimbler target that can avoid so much damage by staying on the enemy's tail.

They are both great ships at their roles. If I am not in a war, or taking on a wing of opponents, then an Asp is a generally much better ship.

 

[waimser]

Ive been experimenting with the Asp lately too. Ive found 4 burst lasers in the C1 slots is great since you have plenty of spare power for them. IIRC someones testing showed they do more damage for the amount of capacitor drained than C1 pulse.
Then Ive been running Cannons in the C2 slots, and dropping Condas crazy fast. C2 Cannons rip through power plants like paper.

I dont know how this setup would go in PvP, since you have to get closer to your target to ensure the hits on internals, Multicannons are most likely better. For PvE, where its easy to close the distance, its crazy good. Once shields are down I feel like im killing power plants faster than I was with my C3 pulse laser Vulture.

At the moment, I am running missions to increase faction rep and influence, so there is no doubt the Asp is the better ship for me right now. I miss the Vultures stunning good looks and grace under fire, but the Asp is just too good at getting stuff done to ignore it.

 

[tough boy]

Thank you for your insight Ziljan and waimser. I don't have much time to experiment myself unfortunately, but the asp is probably the ship I enjoyed the most so far, and even if after that I got a Clipper and now a Vulture, I was considering getting back to it - but I was scared I could miss the large hard points. I plan to go back to imperial space and do general freelancing, so I should be good