What do I have to build here to get Cartographic working?

Doctor Dread · Apr 1, 2025

In the Asteroid Base I have everything working, Shipyard and Outfitting and missions, all fine, but the Universal Cartographic is locked.

What do I have to build on planet 3 slot 1, and on 4 slots 0 and 1 (both Ice Worlds) to make this system more representable / comfortable / whatever, so the UC will unlock their offices?

How to please the posh carto-nerds?

_Flin_ · Apr 1, 2025

Current consensus is you need techlevel. Friend of mine had one with Coriolis + Relay + L Bio + research station.

Kzak · Apr 1, 2025

The simplest way is to build a Science outpost, it should have Universal Cartographics immediately even if the other orbitals in your system do not.

Ian Doncaster · Apr 1, 2025

The simplest approach (if you don't mind where in the system the Cartographics service is) is probably just to build a Prometheus Scientific Outpost (default HT economy, T1) in any of the remaining slots.

If you really want it on the Asteroid Base then you'll need to boost your system's Tech Level. Without any landable planets, your "best in slot" option is ... probably again the Prometheus Scientific Outpost (+3 TL, +1 Population), but you could also use the Comms Installation (+3 TL, +1 Sec) or the Medical Installation (+3 TL, +5 Living) for variety and a wider spread of boosts.

Doctor Dread · Apr 1, 2025

Thank you all

@Ian Doncaster, yes it has to be on the Asteroid Base cause I'll land there with my big ships.

So the safe bet would be planet 4 slot 0 Prometheus Scientific outpost in any case, and then Medical Installation on 1 (can it really be built all alone, without prerequisite of a land installation?) and the third Comms on 3 slot 1, if the Prometheus don't finish the job?

Shurimal · Apr 2, 2025

Just a data point: my system has 4 completed facilities. Commercial outpost and relay installation around the same planet; scientific surface outpost on another planet and security installation orbiting the main star. The commercial outpost has 50/50 Colony/High Tech economy and Universal Cartographics along with outfitting; the surface scientific outpost is 100% High Tech economy and has no Universal Cartographics, nor outfitting.

So it seems Tech Level probably is part of the answer, but not the whole answer. You have 2 comms installations and industrial orbital which give a total of +9 tech level, no High Tech economy. And no UC. I have +5 Tech Level from the surface outpost and both stations have High Tech economy. UC only at the commercial orbital outpost, but not at the surface outpost. I suspect that the surface outpost is bugged.

Development level and standard of living don't seem to be a factor, your system has both higher than mine. At this point I'd try building a relay installation and see if that changes anything, though you can't place it locally to any of your existing stations so it's also likely that it does nothing to them if you need High Tech economyat a station and not just a High Tech installation somewhere.

root2 · Apr 2, 2025

Shurimal said:
The commercial outpost has 50/50 Colony/High Tech economy and Universal Cartographics along with outfitting; the surface scientific outpost is 100% High Tech economy and has no Universal Cartographics, nor outfitting.

This mirrors a bit what I encountered so far:

Almost 2 weeks ago I finished a T2 planetary bio settlement, a (non landable) orbital scientific station and a comms station but still the planetary bio settlement does not have cartography.

More here: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/universal-cartographics.635980/post-10595645

Its really kinda strange to have so much high tech in the system and yet the biggest high tech (bio) surface installation does not have cartographics

Shurimal · Apr 2, 2025

root2 said:
really kinda strange to have so much high tech in the system and yet the biggest high tech (bio) surface installation does not have cartographics

I'm fairly certain that surface ports are simply borked seven ways to Sunday. Only 3 commodities for sale, no UC, no outfitting...

James Razor · Apr 2, 2025

Honestly, no one knows.
My system is a mixed bag in this regard. I did build a lot of supporting infrastructure all over the system and my Coriolis did have a shipyard, but no Universal Cartographics.

My later build Tier 3 Ground Port did have both and a Tier 1 ground port build after that did not have either, while a space outpost (which is otherwise bugged, aka no commodities and Asteroid base logo) does have Universal Cartographics. As such, I could not tell you why I have it in some cases and not in others.

Also, even after I did get the Tier 3 Port and Outpost with Universal Cartographics, the Coriolis did not update to include it, nor did any of the previously established Outposts and Tier 1 Ports.

Doctor Dread · Apr 3, 2025

Nah, not working. I've built Prometheus Scientific Outpost on planet 4 slot 0, and on slot 1 I've placed a Medical installation tier 2.

Now only Scientific Outpost has the UC, but no Commodities Market

Asteroid base still have no UC, despite adding 6 more Tech Levels to the system.

This is silly. All this, us pushing and working hard in the dark with no clear rules, and FDevs is keeping silent on the internal mechanics.
I don't mind working hard and hauling my butt of, but give me the rules, the plan.

Shurimal · Apr 3, 2025

Try adding a Relay installation in the last slot. Maybe it helps, it seems to be the one that triggered UC for my Commercial outpost—but no quarantees ofc

Doctor Dread · Apr 3, 2025

Will do, that's the only thing left.

I'm slowly losing my calm with all this.

Doctor Dread · Apr 4, 2025

Shurimal said:
Try adding a Relay installation in the last slot. Maybe it helps, it seems to be the one that triggered UC for my Commercial outpost—but no quarantees ofc

Nah, not working. It says "it's active" but all the issues are still there. All slots filled, added Scientific Outpost, Medical installation and Relay installation.

OK, let's wait for the next Thursday tick but so far this is frustrating as hell.

Shurimal · Apr 4, 2025

Doctor Dread said:
Nah, not working. It says "it's active" but all the issues are still there. All slots filled, added Scientific Outpost, Medical installation and Relay installation.

OK, let's wait for the next Thursday tick but so far this is frustrating as hell.

That's really inconsistent an unpredictable, then. By all accounts your system has better stats than mine, so either the availability of UC is completely random; it's bugged; or there are some hidden variables. I find it hard to believe that only High Tech economy enables UC. Or maybe you really need the relay installation to be right next to the station? Bonkers.

Ian Doncaster · Apr 4, 2025

Shurimal said:
or there are some hidden variables

I'm pretty sure it's this one, where each station ends up with its own TL threshold for cartographics, and you either exceed it or don't.

Whether it's a new set of hidden variables especially for colonisation or just the consequence of whatever mechanism means that pre-colonisation outposts rarely have a full set of refuel/rearm/repair ... probably we'll never know.

Shurimal · Apr 4, 2025

Ian Doncaster said:
I'm pretty sure it's this one, where each station ends up with its own TL threshold for cartographics, and you either exceed it or don't.

Whether it's a new set of hidden variables especially for colonisation or just the consequence of whatever mechanism means that pre-colonisation outposts rarely have a full set of refuel/rearm/repair ... probably we'll never know.

I think I can do a (partial) test of it—I've already laid down a Civilian orbital outpost around a different planet (non-atmospheric landable ice world with 2 surface, 3 orbital building slots) in my system. My completed commercial outpost is around an atmospheric landable ice planet with 5 surface and 3 orbital building slots*. It's going to be the next thing to build, and if it gets UC when it comes online, we can exclude "Needs a Relay around the same body" and "Needs High Tech economy" as a requirement. If it doesn't have UC at first, but will have when the planned space farm next to it is build, we can speculate that "Needs an economy other than Colony".

*Specific planets are Scorpii Sector PT-R b4-2 2 and 5.

Ian Doncaster · Apr 4, 2025

I did get a Civilian Outpost to pick up UC service by building enough HT influence next to it to switch it to High Tech economy (it didn't get UC half way through when it was Colony 0.5, HT 0.5). So it may be that the thresholds are much lower for HT economies than for any other type.

Shurimal said:
If it doesn't have UC at first, but will have when the planned space farm next to it is build, we can speculate that "Needs an economy other than Colony".

Though at this point the new planetary influence "bug-or-feature?" will probably confuse that a lot anyway.

Shurimal · Apr 4, 2025

Ian Doncaster said:
I did get a Civilian Outpost to pick up UC service by building enough HT influence next to it to switch it to High Tech economy (it didn't get UC half way through when it was Colony 0.5, HT 0.5). So it may be that the thresholds are much lower for HT economies than for any other type.

That High Tech lowers the threshold is a valid hypothesis. My Commercial outpost w/ UC is 50/50 Colony/High Tech and system development level is currently at 6; tech level at 5.

Ian Doncaster said:
Though at this point the new planetary influence "bug-or-feature?" will probably confuse that a lot anyway.

I actually didn't see any change in economies in my system, even after finishing one facility yesterday evening. But that was before the BGS tick, I'll check again this evening—or really, anyone interested can at any time

Scorpii Sector PT-R b4-2; scientific surface outpost on Planet 3 (was 100% High Tech yesterday) and orbital outpost around planet 5 (50/50 Colony/High Tech).

ruifo · Apr 4, 2025

Has anyone tried to build this Surfice Hub listed as Exploration?
Could it add the Universal Cartographics to our stations, if we build it?

Cheers

Doctor Dread · Apr 4, 2025

Shurimal said:
That's really inconsistent an unpredictable, then. By all accounts your system has better stats than mine, so either the availability of UC is completely random; it's bugged; or there are some hidden variables. I find it hard to believe that only High Tech economy enables UC. Or maybe you really need the relay installation to be right next to the station? Bonkers.

Ian Doncaster said:
I'm pretty sure it's this one, where each station ends up with its own TL threshold for cartographics, and you either exceed it or don't.

Whether it's a new set of hidden variables especially for colonisation or just the consequence of whatever mechanism means that pre-colonisation outposts rarely have a full set of refuel/rearm/repair ... probably we'll never know.

There's also one more possibility: that Spaceports have/don't have stats/variables needed (whatever they are) for Shipyard, Outfitting, missions, Universal Cartographic etc at the moment they are finished. And it stays locked as it were, regardless of improvements in the system you make afterwards.

"WYSIWYG, move along. Better luck next time."