What is depth?

[bfgm]

No, it's not, it's exactly the same, as both are subjective opinions. You've given us a list of the top 10 games and said all of them had end game content, which was blatantly false, 6 of them have no end game and no end game content, so you clearly have no actual clue on these things and don't understand what you are giving such informed opinions about.

This isn't politics, being totally uninformed doesn't make you the best candidate for the job, it removes you from consideration totally.

Feel free to go back a couple pages and read the first time I replied to your similar post.

Your opinion acusations of those 6 games not having endgame content is false.

How can you say CS:GO has no end game... you sir need to think before you type.

Elite's endgame is CQC! /sarc

The only difference is you can play CQC as soon as you start the game which kinda takes away from the whole goal thing xD

 

[Triple88a]

How do you defend a game where every day theres dozens of threads complaining that the game lacks content all made by different people? If the game was this great and full of things to do why would there be so many threads saying the same thing?

Also one big big thing to end game content is to be able to enter with your real ship with its current configuration.

 

[Kristov]

world of warcraft has endgame content. It's called PvP, and Arena. Does the game "end" because you've made it to that level? nope...It just means you still have content to enjoy.

What does Elite Dangerous have after you own every ship and A-rated them all?

It has an entire galaxy of options, no pun intended. Exploration, mining, trading, hunting pirates, being a pirate, working the BGS(that's a real thing btw, quite a lot of us doing that), and so much more.

And PvP isn't WoW's end game content, raids are, I know, played it for years, you should try it some time.

Feel free to go back a couple pages and read the first time I replied to your similar post.

Your opinion acusations of those 6 games not having endgame content is false.

How can you say CS:GO has no end game... you sir need to think before you type.

The only difference is you can play CQC as soon as you start the game which kinda takes away from the whole goal thing xD

A league is NOT end game, nor it is end game content, you actually have to be TOLD this? That comment I made about being uninformed disqualifying you...it's not a joke.

 

[bfgm]

How do you defend a game where every day theres dozens of threads complaining that the game lacks content all made by different people? If the game was this great and full of things to do why would there be so many threads saying the same thing?

Also one big big thing to end game content is to be able to enter with your real ship with its current configuration.

All of this ^

 

[Ian Skippy]

Yeah, its bizarre. Every time you go to the official forum of a product and say its stupid some people will disagree with you. I can't explain it, its almost as if some folks, for some weird reason, go to forums of products they actually like. It makes no sense, why spend time on something you enjoy when you can be complaining about something you find boring and stupid and shallow in every way clearly like a lot? :S

 

[Red Anders]

But doesn't that add depth to the forums?

/s

As far as this topic is concerned, they're <ahem> a mile wide and...

I can often be found disparaging a great many things.

Just ask Red Anders and Garbarrage.

It's all true. There are tribes living in the Amazon rain forests completely oblivious to the outside world and untouched by our 21st century consumer society who will thankfully never have to learn that Leo has even disparaged them, so far-ranging is his general contempt for humanity and all of its works.

 

[CoreHaven]

Depth.

Missions: All the factions have exactly the same type of missions with the same descriptions. Also none of the factions have their own story mission lines. For all you know you could name the factions "faction a, faction b, faction c" and everything would be the same. Like there is nothing unique to it other than the endgame reward.. Like yes i understand the whole "sandbox make your own excitement" type of thing however just because you have a choice doesnt mean that there should be no information at all. For example X3 is also a sandbox and you can make your own game however theres 9 or 12 different faction story lines that you complete if you'd like and each one is unique to the culture of the faction/race. You could of course blow the faction from the face of the game and take over all the systems with your fleet of ships.

The mission types are very boring. Go find this guy in blah system and kill him.. so for the next half an hr you're stuck dropping in and out of cruise to look for 1 target.

Then theres the donation missions.. those are worst of all because they kill ALL type of immersion. "give us money and buy some rep... only you're gonna have to do it 500 times." It would be more RP to just spend 20 mill at once and get enough rep to rank up to max rank..

What else is there.. trading. Trading is pretty well done in ED. The only thing missing is there should be a log book of the prices and items from your last visit to station "a".

Theres no NPC voice comms. This kills the immersion big time. When you get interdicted by an npc, they should tell you that in voice comms. When you attack an enemy, same thing. When you're scanned, same thing etc.

Next is a big one.. the systems.. there is absolutely nothing memorable a system other than the sun. Theres 400 billion star systems.. you telling me that every single star system is well formed? Not a single one is still in the early state where it's still just a nebula? What about the asteroid fields? Where did those disappear to?

Faction home systems.. currently theres no difference between a faction home system that is suppose to be alive with billions of people population and an empty system in the middle of no where. Imagine if the streets of New York were empty.. No people, no travelers, no shoppers, no security, just empty.

ED lacks depth big time.

No I disagree with your point on missions. They can vary wildly. But yes in an open world, sandbox type game you ARE going to get the same missions over and over. The thing I like about Elite is there is no hand holding. Who knows what might happen. I still get this kind of thing every time I do a smuggling mission. I have no idea what's going to happen. Same thing with many other kinds of missions so to me they do it rather well. So what's the problem. HALF THE MISSIONS ARE LITERALLY BROKEN. Ahem...so whether I agree with you or not? There's that.

Trading. I don't agree with you. It's not done well because there's not the tools I need inside the game. Can i set a route and keep it? Nope! Can I bookmark a system then? Nope. Can I see past trade info? Nope. No log book like you said. There's not many tools to support trade. I have to go entirely outside the game constantly for that and if I didn't have a second monitor while playing Elite and trading I might quit trading due to the immense hassle it would be.

Yes NPC saying things would be okay. Except they say the same things over and over right now. Have you noticed? And they never shut up. So.....I actually can't support this right now because I don't need half a dozen NPCs yacking at me every time I jump into a system. Maybe they could shorten what they say to something a little more simple and give me the option to turn off audio coms. * shrug *

Systems. Agreeeeeeeeed. Sigh.

Faction Home systems I also really agree.

ED lacks depth. Agreed.

 

[bfgm]

PvP isn't WoW's end game content, raids are, I know, played it for years, you should try it some time.

Arena is just as much end game content as raiding. Both require you to be max level to compete for titles.

A league is NOT end game, nor it is end game content, you actually have to be TOLD this? That comment I made about being uninformed disqualifying you...it's not a joke.

Leagues are not end game content. Competitive modes ARE end game content. You progress through the ranks and if by some chance you do make it to the top then you have a chance of going pro. Thus an end game goal that is always pushing you forward just as raiding in wow, or arena in wow.

Yeah, its bizarre. Every time you go to the official forum of a product and say its stupid some people will disagree with you. I can't explain it, its almost as if some folks, for some weird reason, go to forums of products they actually like. It makes no sense, why spend time on something you enjoy when you can be complaining about something you find boring and stupid and shallow in every way clearly like a lot? :S

Maybe because we enjoy the game as well and would like to see the game improved upon in its weaker areas..

 

[Kristov]

Arena is just as much end game content as raiding. Both require you to be max level to compete for titles.



Leagues are not end game content. Competitive modes ARE end game content. You progress through the ranks and if by some chance you do make it to the top then you have a chance of going pro. Thus an end game goal that is always pushing you forward just as raiding in wow, or arena in wow.



Maybe because we enjoy the game as well and would like to see the game improved upon in its weaker areas..

Erm..look, competing in modes to get ranking to go up a rung on the ladder, that's called a league, it's not end game content, because there's no end to the game, just higher rungs on the ladder then up to another ladder until you reach the pros. I'm rather aware of how they work having spent years doing it, it's not end game content.

Once again, your lack of education, information and understanding of these things really does disqualify you from making factual statements about them, much less having informed opinions or even opinions worth the time it takes to think them.

 

[bfgm]

Erm..look, competing in modes to get ranking to go up a rung on the ladder, that's called a league, it's not end game content, because there's no end to the game, just higher rungs on the ladder then up to another ladder until you reach the pros. I'm rather aware of how they work having spent years doing it, it's not end game content.

Once again, your lack of education, information and understanding of these things really does disqualify you from making factual statements about them, much less having informed opinions or even opinions worth the time it takes to think them.

How is it any different from endgame content in wow? Both of them require hours of prerequisites before you can partake in the activity.

 

[CMDR Byr Goefin]

This thread delivers.

 

[SnowyNI]

Yeah, its bizarre. Every time you go to the official forum of a product and say its stupid some people will disagree with you. I can't explain it, its almost as if some folks, for some weird reason, go to forums of products they actually like. It makes no sense, why spend time on something you enjoy when you can be complaining about something you find boring and stupid and shallow in every way clearly like a lot? :S

Because every time there is forum PvP, God saves a kitten! You think we're here for fun??? We all must be wrong!

PS. you left out the "imagination©" part.

 

[Kristov]

How is it any different from endgame content in wow? Both of them require hours of prerequisites before you can partake in the activity.

Look, getting good enough to make pro isn't playing to end game, there is NO end game in CS:GO, it literally doesn't exist. It's like any other PvP online game, no end game, just a constant never ending stream of matches against other players.

Next you'll tell us that Hello Kitty Online is the ultimate online MMO because it's got cats in it and we all know cats rule the internet. That literally makes as much sense as saying CS:GO has an end game.

 

[bfgm]

there is NO end game in CS:GO, it literally doesn't exist

That's your opinion, and is in no way factual. Just because it isn't enough content for you doesn't mean it's the same for everyone else.

 

[Cynaqq]

That's your opinion, and is in no way factual. Just because it isn't enough content for you doesn't mean it's the same for everyone else.

I'll take over for a second and try to explain what Kristov said in his last comment.

The traditional meaning of an endgame is the activities you do in an otherwise completed game.

Let's say Diablo 3. That game has a limited amount of content. You finish it several times until you hit max level and then, you are able to continue playing. There is content specifically included to do once you hit max level.

On CS:GO, you basically do the exact same thing the first day you play the game and the day you hit pro if you can manage that. It's all a continuous improvement of skill but the actual activity you do doesn't change one bit. You do the same stuff in the same rotation of maps using the same weapons, with exactly the same mechanics. CS:GO can't have, by definition of being a competitive multiplayer game designed as an e-sport, an end game.

 

[Surly_Badger]

world of warcraft has endgame content. It's called PvP, and Arena. Does the game "end" because you've made it to that level? nope...It just means you still have content to enjoy.

By that definition, ED has endgame content - you can always PVP or play CQC.

And of course you can always trade, mine, smuggle, pirate... whatever.

What does Elite Dangerous have after you own every ship and A-rated them all?

PVP and Arena. Farming (mining) auction house (trading) smuggling, pirating. Etc.

When I hit the level cap back in MOP and finished the epic cloak quest was I at the end of the game in terms of "content"? No, I decided I'd take over the auction house and went into the rare mount/pet speculation business and bubbled the prices and made a mint.


It appears that whenever the "depth" and "content" discussions come up, these definitions may apply:
"content": stuff I like
"depth": amount of stuff I like
"grind": stuff you like but I don't

 

[dave11]

so what is it?

 

[Kristov]

That's your opinion, and is in no way factual. Just because it isn't enough content for you doesn't mean it's the same for everyone else.

It has nothing to do with opinion, it's actual a factual statement, there's no end game, it's an online PvP game, other players ARE the content.

 

[Surly_Badger]

Opinion is biased and unsubstantiated claim - ie I like Flowers - opinion. Fact - the flower is broken - I like Elite Dangerous Mechanics - Opinion. The mechanics in Elite Dangerous are broken - FACT.

Well, if you define facts as "what I believe" then yes, your opinions are facts.

But if you ever want to understand why people argue with your "facts" it's because you're mistaking your beliefs for universal truths.

I can't get through to you on that point, and arguing with you about philosophy is - in my opinion - a grind that lacks depth. So I'll stop arguing with you until you get upgraded to a version of you with better gameplay.

 

[bfgm]

I'll take over for a second and try to explain what Kristov said in his last comment.

The traditional meaning of an endgame is the activities you do in an otherwise completed game.

Let's say Diablo 3. That game has a limited amount of content. You finish it several times until you hit max level and then, you are able to continue playing. There is content specifically included to do once you hit max level.

On CS:GO, you basically do the exact same thing the first day you play the game and the day you hit pro if you can manage that. It's all a continuous improvement of skill but the actual activity you do doesn't change one bit. You do the same stuff in the same rotation of maps using the same weapons, with exactly the same mechanics. CS:GO can't have, by definition of being a competitive multiplayer game designed as an e-sport, an end game.

By that definition, ED has endgame content - you can always PVP or play CQC.

And of course you can always trade, mine, smuggle, pirate... whatever.



PVP and Arena. Farming (mining) auction house (trading) smuggling, pirating. Etc.

When I hit the level cap back in MOP and finished the epic cloak quest was I at the end of the game in terms of "content"? No, I decided I'd take over the auction house and went into the rare mount/pet speculation business and bubbled the prices and made a mint.


It appears that whenever the "depth" and "content" discussions come up, these definitions may apply:
"content": stuff I like
"depth": amount of stuff I like
"grind": stuff you like but I don't

Endgame content in its most simplistic form is extra content you get after meeting an extended prerequisite. The content always consists of a *SEMI*-unreachable goal.

other players ARE the content.

So you're admitting there is content...odd...*content* during the endgame..