Will FdL ever get nerfed/brought in line with other ship?

[gorankar]

Only nerf it needs is limiting SB, and HRP stacking. But that is a universal nerf.

 

[Sublime]

The most general possible. Ships of similar design goals and market segment should be roughly equally represented, in tasks that push them to the limits of that intended goal, if they are balanced. This is less the case now than before, which implies balance has suffered.

So if you only want to balance based on PVP combat, what ship would you want to be more equal to the FDL at PVP combat? The Python? The Krait? Chieftain? Suppose they do that and there are equal amounts of Kraits and FDLs in wing PVP fights. Do you now take away jump range from the Krait? Do you change most of the internals to military slots so it’s crap at hauling or anything multipurpose related (like the FDL is now)?

If you don’t do all that then everyone will be using Krait instead of FDL because it’s just as good as FDL at PVP combat and on top of that you can do all those other things with it as well.

We’d be right back to where we are now.

 

[Morbad]

So if you only want to balance based on PVP combat, what ship would you want to be more equal to the FDL at PVP combat? The Python? The Krait? Chieftain?

I want PvP to be the baseline for combat balance because PvP pushes ships to the limit of combat. If and when new PvE combat scenarios show up, the ships would already be balanced, and wouldn't need a rebalancing to account for new NPC dynamics, because CMDRs would already have explored those possibilities.

But yes, it would be nice if pretty much all the combat oriented vessels in roughly the same class as the FDL were viable alternatives to the FDL.

Do you now take away jump range from the Krait? Do you change most of the internals to military slots so it’s crap and hauling or anything multipurpose related (like the FDL is now)?

No, because such changes aren't needed to reduce the FDL's combat capabilities.

If you don’t do all that then everyone will be using Krait instead of FDL because it’s just as good as FDL at PVP combat and on top of that you can do all those other things with it as well.

I was there when the FAS, Clipper, Python, Gunship, Dropship and even Vulture (to an extent) were potentially viable alternatives to the FDL for combat, the FDL was still well represented in combat, because it was not worse at combat. It didn't matter one whit that it was worse at all those other things, because you couldn't be as good as the FDL at combat if you were also configured for any of those other things.

The FDL was very poorly represented among miners, traders, and explorers, which was fine, because it was never meant for any of those tasks. There is however, no excuse for the FDL to be significantly over represented in combat tasks relative to the FAS, Chieftain, Challenger, et al.

 

[Gully Foyle]

So what would be a fair debuff for the Ferdie? 2.0 level? Gotta be careful with asks with FD.
Better yet, just lose SBs and make all combat more exciting, less of an endurance race for all ships....
for incoming salt

 

[Marklar_]

So what would be a fair debuff for the Ferdie? 2.0 level? Gotta be careful with asks with FD.
Better yet, just lose SBs and make all combat more exciting, less of an endurance race for all ships....
☂ for incoming salt

I know, let's nerf it by making the fuel tank smaller

 

[Pug]

Do you think the FdL will ever get even a slight nerf to be brought closer in line to other ships? Even something smaller like change its engineered boost interval to 6s (still on the fast side of boost intervals) and 15% reduction to pitch/roll/yaw (only adds 0.3s to its 180deg turn time) and something like 15% lower base shield value.

Or whatever. Can we expect this any time in the near future so the "top dog" isn't sooo much better than others that a few other ships may become viable in high end pvp?

If it does get nerfed there will inevitably be a 'New kid on the block'
Pug

 

[Sublime]

So what would be a fair debuff for the Ferdie? 2.0 level? Gotta be careful with asks with FD.
Better yet, just lose SBs and make all combat more exciting, less of an endurance race for all ships....
☂ for incoming salt

While I’m not convinced that specific FDL nerf will solve all the problems (like agility or core modules), I really think something needs to be done about shield stacking in general. Maybe not being able to stack engineered shield booster or something. Maybe have additional shield boosters require exponential amounts of power.

You might still be able to do it under certain circumstances but you wouldn’t also have enough for high powered weaponry and it would be tricky to run SCBs without a fair amount of on the fly power management.

I realize this will be a universal nerf but it would be a bigger nerf to crazy shield tanks like the FDL..

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

I'd be okay with a shield nerf of some kind to make hulltanks worth it. I'd also be happy for FDL to be nerfed, alternatively. I see the usual forum myth-mongering, in this case about nerf-creep "oh no what else will these crazies nerf if they get their way? " - nope it's just about breaking some of the head and shoulders primacy of the FDL. And another invention - "it will just be replaced with new meta" - no, unless you overnerf it. Keep it the meta by all means, just "less meta" to give other options a look-in for anyone but the best pilots.

 

[Pug]

I feel that all the ships lack balance and dedicated usability, I use three for what I do but I don't play PvP.
Well technically Six but two of each.
Pug

 

[The Roofus]

Don't nerf the FDL, make more ships of equal combat strength.

 

[Pug]

Don't nerf the FDL, make more ships of equal combat strength.

There will still be a 'Winner'
Pug

 

[Doctopus]

By pure pricepoint, the Mamba, and Federal Gunship should roughly be sidegrades, along with potentially the alliance challenger. It'd be nice if the Alliance Clipper was good for something as well.

 

[Notwyn]

Hopefully not.
Isn’t PVP all about skill as a pilot? The ship is just the tool. So FDL vs FDL is perfect for demonstrating skill at arms.
The rest of us can go about beating up NPC’s as we like.

 

[The Roofus]

There will still be a 'Winner'
Pug

Aye, but at least it'd stir up a somewhat stagnant meta.

 

[Pug]

Aye, but at least it'd stir up a somewhat stagnant meta.

Yes it would bud, maybe they could change it every week to keep everyone on their toes
That may actually work.
Pug

 

[tolm]

I’ve said it before ... but ....

Federal Interceptor ... Internals / Hardpoints of the FGS with the flight model of the FAS. Instant viable FDL alternative for very little effort on FDevs part.

I am - however - biased. All I want is a combat ship that is as decent as an FDL or Chieftain that has a proper fighter-plane style cockpit (like in a Viper / Imp Courier / FAS / Mamba) rather than some off centre monstrosity or something that looks like you’re flying a freighter.

Don’t get me wrong ... I love flying my Chieftain ... but if it had the cockpit from the Mamba? I’d never fly anything else ...

 

[Pug]

I’ve said it before ... but ....

Federal Interceptor ... Internals / Hardpoints of the FGS with the flight model of the FAS. Instant viable FDL alternative for very little effort on FDevs part.

I am - however - biased. All I want is a combat ship that is as decent as an FDL or Chieftain that has a proper fighter-plane style cockpit (like in a Viper / Imp Courier / FAS / Mamba) rather than some off centre monstrosity or something that looks like you’re flying a freighter.

Don’t get me wrong ... I love flying my Chieftain ... but if it had the cockpit from the Mamba? I’d never fly anything else ...

I still love my ugly old FAS but the jump range is deplorable so it is Never used.
Pug

 

[tolm]

I still love my ugly old FAS but the jump range is deplorable so it is Never used.
Pug

Yeh, I’m a big fan of the look of the little Fed ships but that C5 shield simply isn’t big enough (C6 upwards BiWeaves are soooo much better) and the medium hardpoints are in a stupid position so far back underneath the hull - why not on the side like on the FGS? A couple of small tweaks and it would be up there with the Chief for me... and we know it can be done because the FGS has a C6 internal and mediums on the side so what is up with Core Dynamics that they haven’t figured that out yet?!

I’ve re-rolled my FAS as an AX ship with 3x Gaus cannon in a row underneath and as much hull as I can squeeze on. Haven't tried it yet but hoping that will give it a place in my fleet longer term.

 

[Maro-Val]

Everyone just flies an fdl and boom.. balance.

 

[Phazon Xenomorph]

The only ship that needs a Nerf is the Anaconda. Between it's abnormally freakish hull, shield potential, huge internal capacity, absolute best jump range in the game (fleet carriers do not count, screw those busted things for letting people reach fringe systems just cause they spent five billion from mining LTD's without needing to engineer the bloody things), good hard point placements, actual damage model while other ships are ignored... it's too strong a ship that beats almost everything. The only flaw is it's turning speed ... whoop-de-doo. It needs adjustments to be brought in line with the "proper" concept of balance that Frontier slaps on every other ship EXCEPT the Conda.