No Single Player offline Mode then?

[Darcikon]

For me the biggest issue with this game has always been FDevs lack of communication on changes to the original vision.

Much of the backlashes could have been avoided by being far more open and honest with the backers (KS and after).

I'm not really sure what the reasoning behind launching 16 Dec 2014 are but it's pretty clear to everyone playing it that the game is not in a "finished" state. While there were always going to be features released post-launch there just seems to be a lot of cuts made just to meet this date.

I was never that bothered about single player (not the same as Solo online) but I am very concerned about the prospect of servers being closed down and not being able to play the game that I (and and sure we all) have paid a lot of money for.

One thing I think FDev need to take away from this is that their communication has been less than satisfactory and this needs to improve with immediate effect if they are ever to have trust again.

 

[Obsidian Ant]

Applying some logic....no, not really. Majority of people bought game for online, and in fact complaining much louder all over the place when it doesn't work properly (which is another story for another day ).

As I said, it hurts but that's truth.

I just meant that whilst forums are often echo chambers by the vocal minority - that isn't always the case. Just because the forums only represent 6k players, we can't make assumptions about the what the other 100k plus players not on the forums feel, can we?

 

[Diziet Sma]

Just adding my voice to this.. I'm SERIOUSLY disappointed.

My internet is waaay crappy.. disconnects on average every few minutes, never more than 30 mins without a d/c, and if things are bad, every 20-40 seconds. Disconnects can last anywhere from a second to a minute at a time. Nothing I can do about it unless I move house.

Online play just ain't happening.

Thanks for nothing, Frontier.

 

[Michael Brookes]

I just wanted to point to a more interesting part of this discussion: Technical reasons for "Online only".
As it stands so far I have not heard a single argument that states a reason against Offline Play.

The idea is to transfer the server database to your PC and connect to your PC. No Internet connection needed, no code change needed.
The only thing is the Game Server Data. How much of the data is calculated as in old Elite (and Frontier) and what part is fixed.

To not repeat myself I have written some basic details in this thread:
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=59074&p=1002363&viewfull=1#post1002363

Still from what I have played so far I cannot imagine that everything needs space of hundreds of terabyte space.
That would contradict everything that DB told us and what we are experiencing now.

So my question is: What are the actual reason to not offer us Offline Mode ?

As I said it's not simply the data although that is certainly an issue. Remember you don't just have the start point of the galaxy, you have any changes that are applied to it. The decision making processes for gameplay within the galaxy are also cloud based and it's not a simple job to transfer these over. The vision for how the game works has necessitated a much more encompassing online structure than we'd initially thought. We've not just said - let's not do offline. We've investigated the different ways we can do it and the simple answer is that we can't - not without compromising the game we're trying to make.

Michael

 

[Pibbles]

why not just apply for a refund through the store site and leave the forum ?

I don't want to, I am a four figure backer so in for the long haul regardless. . I am interested in if FD have made an innocent mistake and will rectify it, or if they are on a cash grab. Michael's answer (or lack of one) will define this.

 

[hebi]

Because a lot of folk cared tons about Elite , simply.
But also wanted to complain im utterly disappointed I was promised a game playable offline.
To be update sometimes if possible or needed and if not updated I could play till I went to the bloody grave, now if "THEY" stop the servers, for whatever reason, I don't have anything .

/)

 

[Vasious]

Well I guess it is time we cancel the whole game, no release for anyone, with all the venom amongst each other this has created.
Libel accusations of deliberate bait and switch.
Personal insults to anyone who isn't "one of us"
Veiled threats of DOS
.
No one deserves anything but the salt and ash in their mouths with this carry on.

 

[MINDWIPE]

ok i've heard enough!

at present the universe needs ppl to be online for it to function.. NP i get it thats fine!

perhaps in a few months a "static universe patch" could be added to the game for download where players can get a copy of a pregenerated universe to play offline via a menu option" the only thing i would reccommend is that players who play on that option are not able to transfer their charachter in that mode back to the online options. (theyd have to run two version of their toons on each online and static. (prevents pirated versions connecting and wouldnt hinder the ever evolving online community version with conflicting uber ships from a static play mode)

its something to look into possibly down the road but for now something like it wont be at launch!

 

[Michael Brookes]

Still going at it I see.


So why the small off comment a month prior to release.

Because we wanted to be certain before announcing. This isn't the choice we wanted to make, but one we had to.

Michael

 

[Michael Brookes]

I don't want to, I am a four figure backer so in for the long haul regardless. . I am interested in if FD have made an innocent mistake and will rectify it, or if they are on a cash grab. Michael's answer (or lack of one) will define this.

I don't get the point about a cash grab.

Michael

 

[Greyshadow]

If you guys knew offline mode would not work then why did you even bother offering pre-orders. I am sorry but this is a sad excuse. You never told anyone during anywhere in the beta to expect that the offline may not have worked. Instead you took every ones money shrugged your shoulders and took an oh well attitude. It has been mentioned in several posts by me and several others that if there was just communication from you guys to the community sooner then a week before release this type of blow up may not have happened.

 

[Major Plonker]

I wonder how close to release they're going to announce they're dropping coop features?

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I just meant that whilst forums are often echo chambers by the vocal minority - that isn't always the case. Just because the forums only represent 6k players, we can't make assumptions about the what the other 100k plus players not on the forums feel, can we?

It would be true for any other topic. Not for this one. ED is being sold as online, even MMO game. I think very few people knew about offline mode. As I said, understand how (still) many people who wanted that offline mode feel. I would feel horrible if I didn't have connection. However I wouldn't ask for refund, because I know involved risks and I still like game and how FD has designed it.

 

[mbpoblet]

I just wanted to point to a more interesting part of this discussion: Technical reasons for "Online only".
As it stands so far I have not heard a single argument that states a reason against Offline Play.

The idea is to transfer the server database to your PC and connect to your PC. No Internet connection needed, no code change needed.
The only thing is the Game Server Data. How much of the data is calculated as in old Elite (and Frontier) and what part is fixed.

To not repeat myself I have written some basic details in this thread:
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=59074&p=1002363&viewfull=1#post1002363

Still from what I have played so far I cannot imagine that everything needs space of hundreds of terabyte space.
That would contradict everything that DB told us and what we are experiencing now.

So my question is: What are the actual reason to not offer us Offline Mode ?

According to Brookes:

The generation of the galaxy isn't the main issue (although it is part of it). The issue arises from the processes and data that changes as players interact with the world. The previous games were essentially static universes with some specific changes. For Elite: Dangerous aspects of the entire galaxy can be changes and there isn't an easy way to abstract that out. We were faced with a tough choice and it's not something we wanted to do, but to release a game that matched what we set out to do we had to go online online. I'd love to be able to make everyone happy but sometimes we have to make a hard choice as we have here.

Michael

To make that happen we'd essentially have to create two games. The servers handle more than just the data, they handle all the key processes for interaction in the game, so trading, mission generation and background simulation to name a few.

The decision wasn't made this week, we've spend a lot of time and effort trying to come up with a way that would allow us to support offline play - however the answer is no we can't.

Michael

But nothing prevents them from giving us a local private server, except that apparently they don't want to:

Michael, so what would it take hardware wise to run a "personal" server that you could connect to via LAN? I have a spare PC sitting around doing nothing or are we talking about needing terabytes of RAM and a dozen Xeon cores?

The problem here is that you'd have access to the server which isn't something we'd want to allow as it contains the secrets of the galaxy. Which was also an issue with an online version.

Michael

 

[Titus Balls]

As I said it's not simply the data although that is certainly an issue. Remember you don't just have the start point of the galaxy, you have any changes that are applied to it. The decision making processes for gameplay within the galaxy are also cloud based and it's not a simple job to transfer these over. The vision for how the game works has necessitated a much more encompassing online structure than we'd initially thought. We've not just said - let's not do offline. We've investigated the different ways we can do it and the simple answer is that we can't - not without compromising the game we're trying to make.

Michael

Thank you Michael, to me a clear and concise final answer. It's not the one most people are going to hear - but what I see is, if you compromised the online game for the sake of an offline mode the backlash here would be 10x worse.

Like shirts and spaceships, people really need to put things in context.

 

[jamotide]

This. A million times this. Honestly, it's almost like the Devs made this game with MMO capabilities and a Persistent Universe in the forefront of their mind... Odd, that... Yeah, Offline was planned, but it came to be found it just couldn't be done. Boo-hoo, moving on, enjoying the brilliant game that's being developed for us.

Honestly, how did these people expect to patch or update their game that was repeatedly stated would be in constant development.

No, zero times this. I was expecting to patch it like any other "Physical DRM-free collector's premium boxed edition" of games that I buy.

 

[Milky82]

Just adding my voice to this.. I'm SERIOUSLY disappointed.

My internet is waaay crappy.. disconnects on average every few minutes, never more than 30 mins without a d/c, and if things are bad, every 20-40 seconds. Disconnects can last anywhere from a second to a minute at a time. Nothing I can do about it unless I move house.

Online play just ain't happening.

Thanks for nothing, Frontier.

To be fair though you have stated before that on release you will be wishing that you had a computer that could play ED, so if you don't have the hardware to play the game, I'm taking it as read you haven't bought the game.

 

[Darth Krayt]

I'm actually torn now about whether I want a refund or not. I'm hoping this thread may encourage Frontier to rethink their position.

In the mean time, I find the game compelling enough that I don't really want to give up on it. I don't need injected events or anything of that nature - a static galaxy is perfectly fine by me.

Now back to some more exploring in my Cobra.

 

[S.H.A.D.O]

I am a little disappointed and feel sorry for the people that bought the game or kickstarted it and now can't play. I can play and I'm happy I can but I do feel sorry for those that can't for various reasons. I also very surprised how we are told this so close to launch, I'm amazed they didn't know this earlier.

also I'm concerned about what happens in 1-2-3-4 years down the line when the game is no longer profitable and the servers get turned off. 30 years later I can still play the original Elite but in a few years I might not be able to play Elite Dangerous. that is a concern and a big one.

 

[Toejam]

I dont mind connected to the internet or not. I play on a pc thats always connected anyways so its no concern of mine however would be interested to know how many of the people asking for a refund really do or if they are just tring to put the wind up the developers