Lets fix Arid Animal Pack

[Atiggerx33]

Speak for yourself. I love them, and many on the forums do.

I love exhibit animals, I absolutely adore reptiles and amphibians (more iffy on bugs, I enjoy looking at them through glass just fine but I wouldn't want to touch most of them) I just wish they'd make them feel more alive. I understand many reptiles don't exactly move much, but it'd be nice if they moved a bit and had slightly longer loops. I'm not asking for the gila monsters to start running around the enclosure that wouldn't be realistic, but walking from under the hide to a nearby basking spot from time to time would be nice. Snakes I at least understand wouldn't be fun to animate, it's just really hard to make them move in a way that isn't creepy.

Not saying snakes look creepy IRL, I own a boa and love snakes, but in games it seems most struggle to get the movements right and it ends up just looking just unnatural and creepy. Nothing at all like the movement of a real snake, I guess it's a bit like the uncanny valley effect?

 

[Atiggerx33]

• Dromedary Camel
• Addax
• Dama Gazelle Blackbuck
• African Crested Porcupine
• Sand Cat Coyote
• Black Rhinoceros
• Somali Wild Ass Hamadryas Baboon
• Desert Horned Viper Budgies

I'd be sad to lose out on two critically endangered species (dama and wild ass) for two least concern species. I'm not generally a huge fan of hoofstock, but it's always nice of Frontier to raise awareness of critically endangered species that are lesser known (and for the average person I think both the dama and the wild ass aren't really well known species). And I always enjoy seeing endangered species in zoos IRL (that the zoo is working on raising awareness and maintaining a genetically healthy captive population so that reintroduction remains possible if the worst should happen) so I enjoy putting them in my zoos in PZ.

That being said I wish we somehow could have gotten the baboon in this pack (hopefully it still comes out in a future one) without having to exclude any of the species we got. I spent some time watching a baby baboon in the Bronx Zoo playing with it's older sibling with mama closely watching, and it was just really sweet and so cool to watch. I'd love to put them in my PZ zoos (they're actually one of my favorite zoo primates because they don't give me weird "this looks too human to be in a zoo" feelings. I understand that for many primates their native habitats are vanishing and zoos are the best option for the survival of their species at the moment. I also understand zoos do everything in their power to enrich their lives. But in a perfect world where they weren't endangered and things were awesome I'd be really happy to never see them in zoos again).

 

[YesIndeed]

I personally like having such a small felid, it gives more variation for modders to work with and I personally find it super fun to design for small climbing animals, the small hitbox allows you to do things that just unfortunately won't work with the larger species. And good climbing/jumping ability allows you to have a lot of fun with foliage, rockwork, and elevation changes.

I am a bit upset with how it looks though. But I'm sure if Frontier doesn't fix them the wonderful modding community will (modders shouldn't be the ones responsible for it, but still, it's nice to know that either way it'll be fixed).

I don't know all that much about sand cats. I was wondering what is actually wrong with the design. With things the the binturong and hyena I could straight up see the obvious flaws but to me this just looks like a cat.

 

[yoav_r]

I don't know all that much about sand cats. I was wondering what is actually wrong with the design. With things the the binturong and hyena I could straight up see the obvious flaws but to me this just looks like a cat.

There's nothing wrong, there are sand cats that look like that design. It's just that there are cuter sand cats to model after.

 

[RightWhale]

Honestly it's just the sand cat that bums me out. Not only does it look comparatively bad (and yes, I am aware that some sand cats do look like that), it's the most underwhelming pick of the whole pack.

I still cannot fathom Frontier looking at this theme and completely omitting the baboon. Surely a baboon could be forged out of the mandrill rig with as much effort as it would take to make a sand cat out of the lynx rig or whatever they used.

Personally I would’ve rather got a Pallas Cat before we got a sand cat. I agree it’s definitely the “worst” of the pack for me personally. A baboon, tortoise, or bird would have been a much better pick in my opinion. Overall I have warmed up to the pack quite a lot! Personally I am starting to feel like I need something to shake up DLCs more.

 

[NZFanatic]

modders shouldn't be the ones responsible for it

They aren't responsible for anything. Modders voluntarily do their thing.

 

[Atiggerx33]

They aren't responsible for anything. Modders voluntarily do their thing.

I meant it that Frontier should fix it. Frontier's work should be good enough that modders shouldn't feel the need to fix it and players shouldn't feel the need to have to download mods to fix a game they paid for.

 

[Atiggerx33]

There's nothing wrong, there are sand cats that look like that design. It's just that there are cuter sand cats to model after.

They aren't responsible for anything. Modders voluntarily do their thing.

I think the face looks a bit too wide. This is a correction I saw on Reddit (not my images).

Original:

Corrected:

I think the minor changes make a world of difference to the model.

 

[becks474]

I meant it that Frontier should fix it. Frontier's work should be good enough that modders shouldn't feel the need to fix it and players shouldn't feel the need to have to download mods to fix a game they paid for.

Most base game models were just fantastic when the Game was released and still look great in my opinion. Comparing it with the newest Models is okay but telling Frontier did not do the best Work at that time is just unfair as improving Things is Just a normal Thing (there are examples Like the Malaysian Tapir which really was Bad Work because it was just a new coloration). I think a complete overhaul would be very time consuming and will only be the case in a PZ 2 or with a bigger paid Update which would be more expensive than the normal DLCs.

I think the face looks a bit too wide. This is a correction I saw on Reddit (not my images).

Original:

Corrected:

I think the minor changes make a world of difference to the model.

In my opinion the original Frontier Sand Cat Looks more accurate than the "fixed" one. The Sand Cat looks sweet but also a bit Strange in my opinion and if you Google it there are also examples which are looking exactly the way Frontier did it. The "fixed" one would stylize it in my opinion and this is the thing which was Always criticized all the time for Frontier cats.

 

[Atiggerx33]

In my opinion the original Frontier Sand Cat Looks more accurate than the "fixed" one. The Sand Cat looks sweet but also a bit Strange in my opinion and if you Google it there are also examples which are looking exactly the way Frontier did it. The "fixed" one would stylize it in my opinion and this is the thing which was Always criticized all the time for Frontier cats.

Can you link an image where the sand cat more closely resembles the first image, I looked through about 20 pages of sand cat photos on google and couldn't find a picture of single one that when with a face so wide that you couldn't tell it had a neck. And in all the images I could see, unless they're squinting their eyes are more round than oblong. I also can't find a single image where their chin looks so pronounced instead of much more gentler and rounder. I also can't find an adult with a tail that long and slender, they're generally a bit shorter and more bushy.

Maybe I'm just not finding them though.

 

[Captain Callum]

Can you link an image where the sand cat more closely resembles the first image, I looked through about 20 pages of sand cat photos on google and couldn't find a picture of single one that when with a face so wide that you couldn't tell it had a neck.

Exactly why I created my cursed sand cougar image, its really hard to find a sand cat that matches exactly like frontiers model. Yes there are examples but it took dozens of pages the last time I checked.

 

[becks474]

View attachment 358742
View attachment 358743View attachment 358744
Narrow-Eyed one (on left) Slightly Wider (on right)

View attachment 358745
Both wider and more narrow like the in-game one has (since I was also wondering if the eyes weren't Round enough)

I originally agreed with the sentiment that the eyes are too spread out but wanted to make sure this wasn't a case of making that conclusion strictly off one individual cat that may just have narrow eyes. I've now found a few pictures of Sand Cat's with eyes that are set a bit wider apart. I'm back onboard with thinking the in-game model is perfectly fine. The narrow eyes do not seem to be a species wide trait but varies from individual to individual. Also I was starting to wonder if the eyes weren't round enough, but this also seems to be based on the individual where some have very round eyes and others have more narrow eyes.

I think this post was a good one to point out that different indivduals of Sand Cat can really look different. Nevertheless the "fixed" one still looks overstylized and more like a common house cat to me than a real Sand Cat.

Edit: It is from another thread and I have Problems to See the Pictures Here. Just click on the upper Arrow and you will come to the original Post.

 

[NachoB]

• Dromedary Camel - Highly requested. Fits the pack perfectly.
• Addax - Replace by Secretary bird
• Dama Gazelle - Replace by collared peccary
• African Crested Porcupine - Highly requested. New type of animal. Iconic animal.
• Sand Cat
• Black Rhinoceros - Replace by Hamadryas baboon
• Somali Wild Ass - Replace by patagonian mara
• Desert Horned Viper - Replace by egyptian or indian cobra

So basically i would replace almost everything to make a pack that has more variety in both types of animals and world representation.

On a second thought i would replace the sand cat for the baboon instead of the rhino. I really wanted the black rhinoceros lol And the addax could come as anniversary i guess. I can live without the addra gazelle and the wild ass in the game.

 

[Atiggerx33]

I think this post was a good one to point out that different indivduals of Sand Cat can really look different. Nevertheless the "fixed" one still looks overstylized and more like a common house cat to me than a real Sand Cat.

Edit: It is from another thread and I have Problems to See the Pictures Here. Just click on the upper Arrow and you will come to the original Post.

Both the images linked as a much narrower face, the eyes are closer together and rounder, and the chin is less pronounced. The only reason they look further apart in the second image is because the head is angled very differently.

Edit: It's less about the eye distance IMO I think the eye distance is correct for the wider head, but Frontier's sand cat has a much larger head compared to body size of IRL sand cats. If you look at images of them straight on their head, even in the fluffiest examples, have kind of a box shape like this. Notice that you can still see part of his neck, while with Frontier's the neck is completely hidden. The head is about as tall as it is wide, giving the face a boxy appearance instead of the oblong one in Frontier's model. Also notice how flat the chin is in comparison to Frontier's much sharper chin. In 99% of images they have very round eyes (pupils contract and dilate as needed, I'm talking about the actual eyeballs), I have to assume that 99% of images are accurate and that the few photos of them with more oblong eyes are examples of them squinting. The fur of the corrected version also makes the face look appropriately soft and poofy while Frontier's ragged edges make it look more wiry (think of like a fluffy husky vs. a wiry terrier, the sand cat should be giving off fluffy husky vibes and instead it's giving off wiry terrier vibes)

That being said, the corrected image isn't perfect, the ears should be angled further apart, just by a bit. The chin still isn't quite flat enough. The fur on the lower face should come out a bit further (like tiny kitty sideburns) to give the face a fuller, more boxy shape (it should be more a square with rounded corners on their lower face, not completely rounded). I'm just saying it's better than Frontier's, but it could be even more accurate with a few further adjustments.

 

[becks474]

Both the images linked as a much narrower face, the eyes are closer together and rounder, and the chin is less pronounced. The only reason they look further apart in the second image is because the head is angled very differently.

Edit: It's less about the eye distance IMO I think the eye distance is correct for the wider head, but Frontier's sand cat has a much larger head compared to body size of IRL sand cats. If you look at images of them straight on their head, even in the fluffiest examples, have kind of a box shape like this. Notice that you can still see part of his neck, while with Frontier's the neck is completely hidden. The head is about as tall as it is wide, giving the face a boxy appearance instead of the oblong one in Frontier's model. Also notice how flat the chin is in comparison to Frontier's much sharper chin. In 99% of images they have very round eyes (pupils contract and dilate as needed, I'm talking about the actual eyeballs), I have to assume that 99% of images are accurate and that the few photos of them with more oblong eyes are examples of them squinting. The fur of the corrected version also makes the face look appropriately soft and poofy while Frontier's ragged edges make it look more wiry (think of like a fluffy husky vs. a wiry terrier, the sand cat should be giving off fluffy husky vibes and instead it's giving off wiry terrier vibes)

That being said, the corrected image isn't perfect, the ears should be angled further apart, just by a bit. The chin still isn't quite flat enough. The fur on the lower face should come out a bit further (like tiny kitty sideburns) to give the face a fuller, more boxy shape (it should be more a square with rounded corners on their lower face, not completely rounded). I'm just saying it's better than Frontier's, but it could be even more accurate with a few further adjustments.

Let us see what we will see today in moved pictures within the videos of the YouTubers. Have you already seen the picture on a bigger screen like your TV or only with your Smartphone? I must say I also had a strange first impression but I defend the Frontier Version after I have seen it the first time on my TV.

 

[Atiggerx33]

Let us see what we will see today in moved pictures within the videos of the YouTubers. Have you already seen the picture on a bigger screen like your TV or only with your Smartphone? I must say I also had a strange first impression but I defend the Frontier Version after I have seen it the first time on my TV.

I play on my PC, I think I can tell if a picture looks good when staring at a 16" screen 2ft from my face.

 

[FlameWizard492]

I'd be sad to lose out on two critically endangered species (dama and wild ass) for two least concern species. I'm not generally a huge fan of hoofstock, but it's always nice of Frontier to raise awareness of critically endangered species that are lesser known (and for the average person I think both the dama and the wild ass aren't really well known species). And I always enjoy seeing endangered species in zoos IRL (that the zoo is working on raising awareness and maintaining a genetically healthy captive population so that reintroduction remains possible if the worst should happen) so I enjoy putting them in my zoos in PZ.

That being said I wish we somehow could have gotten the baboon in this pack (hopefully it still comes out in a future one) without having to exclude any of the species we got. I spent some time watching a baby baboon in the Bronx Zoo playing with it's older sibling with mama closely watching, and it was just really sweet and so cool to watch. I'd love to put them in my PZ zoos (they're actually one of my favorite zoo primates because they don't give me weird "this looks too human to be in a zoo" feelings. I understand that for many primates their native habitats are vanishing and zoos are the best option for the survival of their species at the moment. I also understand zoos do everything in their power to enrich their lives. But in a perfect world where they weren't endangered and things were awesome I'd be really happy to never see them in zoos again).

I wasn't aware of the conservation status of the Somali Wild Ass or the Dama Gazelle. My hope was that we'd get animals from deserts all over the world, not just Africa, so I just prioritized that over conservation status. If Frontier had just called it the Sahara Animal Pack, I would've been happier with the pack we got.

 

[MeaghanEdwards]

I myself like all the species included. I was hoping for a Black Rhino to complete the African rhino collection <3

 

[Atiggerx33]

I wasn't aware of the conservation status of the Somali Wild Ass or the Dama Gazelle. My hope was that we'd get animals from deserts all over the world, not just Africa, so I just prioritized that over conservation status. If Frontier had just called it the Sahara Animal Pack, I would've been happier with the pack we got.

Yeah, this pack has the most critically endangered animals in a single pack with 4 critically endangered species (Black Rhino, Dama, Wild Ass, Addax). So that has me excited. I was hoping for some more location diversity in the roster as well. There are so many arid regions around the world and I'd love to see animals from all of them. But that's not to say I'm disappointed with the roster, other than the lack of baboon (but I'm hoping they're still intending to add the baboon in a later pack), all the animals are lovely and I'll really enjoy playing with them all (especially the camels now that they spit. My guests will feel my wrath!).

As you said it's more a frustration with what the expectation was based on the name (arid animals from around the world) and reality (Africa Pack Pt 2: We Finally Found North Africa Guys!). That being said the region absolutely needed to be fleshed out, it was a really underrepresented area in Africa considering we have an entire North African theme, so I'm happy it's done. If they're gonna continue on this trend I'd love for them to revisit South America next and go as crazy on the monkeys there as they went on the hoofstock here. To continue with the "technically true but its not the direction we expected" vibe from the titles they can call it something generic like the "arboreal pack" and then only feature SA arboreal species. To continue I then expect an "Islands Pack" that only addresses Australia and Tasmania.

 

[Antimony96]

Two paths--the first is to keep the African theme but rebrand it as a Safari Pack, the second is to keep the desert theme but have it represent deserts around the world.

Safari Animal Pack:
Black rhinoceros
African crested porcupine
Dama gazelle
Grey crowned crane
Secretary bird
Mantled guereza
Sulcata tortoise
Gaboon viper (exhibit)

Arid Animal Pack:
African crested porcupine
Dromedary camel
Addax
Hamadryas baboon
Patagonian mara
Chacoan peccary
Ratel
Budgerigar (walkthrough)