Opinion: 10 LY range for colonization is ridiculously low.

[Cmdr Travers]

I would think that once your facilities are built, they'll function like any other station in a bubble system. No upkeep from you required, except if you wish to continue to build out the system as they were describing.

Except that's another thing they alluded to but didn't say. "You are the system architect of this system" then they said normal BGS takes place. So I could lose control of the very bases I paid for.

Then, let's say you open a mine. If you've paid for the mine, you should always get what comes out of that mine absolutely free. It's your mine.

Lots needs to be thought through, I'm glad they're doing a beta of this.

 

[Don Alvarez]

Except that's another thing they alluded to but didn't say. "You are the system architect of this system" then they said normal BGS takes place. So I could lose control of the very bases I paid for.

Then, let's say you open a mine. If you've paid for the mine, you should always get what comes out of that mine absolutely free. It's your mine.

Lots needs to be thought through, I'm glad they're doing a beta of this.

But you don't pay for them. You're the architect, not the owner. You select the system and apply for the permits, you source the material, but an army of NPC's does the building and the faction owns it. This is my expectation.

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

Just re-listening again - Piers is talking about an inherent cost (presumably a once-off fee for the first station?) and quote "infrastructure cost for what comes after" so that's for the commodity grind ship for other bases presumably? No explicit mention of upkeep from what I could tell at least. But it does sound like solo players that value their time may as well not bother.

 

[Cmdr Travers]

But you don't pay for them. You're the architect, not the owner. You select the system and apply for the permits, you source the material, but an army of NPC's does the building and the faction owns it. This is my expectation.

You're the architect, but you're also the one paying to claim the system, paying for the materials needed to establish it, and paying for the materials, and any upkeep, needed to build bases and starports.

If I'm paying for it, I own it.

 

[Desirsar]

Someone did make a good point in a stream chat just now. If the distance is this low because colonization is meant to be attached to BGS and PP, and not a functional tool for explorers, then let it work entirely like BGS expansion - don't let the player choose the system more than being able to calculate which system is next for expansion - closest qualifying uncolonized system within range.

 

[William J Smith]

Is it 10ly from an existing owned system , or 10ly from a an existing colonised system?
In which case everyone will be expanding colonia and the route to it.... although maybe thats the idea

Bill

<<propped up at the bar at Chris and Sylvia's paradise hideout again... having a well rewarded beer for defacing holographic signs in some imperial systems

 

[Don Alvarez]

You're the architect, but you're also the one paying to claim the system, paying for the materials needed to establish it, and paying for the materials, and any upkeep, needed to build bases and starports.

If I'm paying for it, I own it.

I'd have to wait and see what the costs are. I see what you're saying, and I hope you're right, I just don't see FDEV working it that way - like player control of the markets, facilities, etc. etc. From what I gathered, you can choose the type of production and what gets built, but after that my expectation is it will become property of the BGS.

 

[the100thmonkey]

When does the "Colonization should be Open Only" group arrive?

Hahahahahha

 

[Don Alvarez]

Is it 10ly from an existing owned system , or 10ly from a an existing colonised system?
In which case everyone will be expanding colonia and the route to it.... although maybe thats the idea

Bill

<<propped up at the bar at Chris and Sylvia's paradise hideout again... having a well rewarded beer for defacing holographic signs in some imperial systems

The language was vague, but I think it might actually be 10ly from where you acquire the permit.

 

[Cmdr Travers]

Is it 10ly from an existing owned system , or 10ly from a an existing colonised system?
In which case everyone will be expanding colonia and the route to it.... although maybe thats the idea

Bill

<<propped up at the bar at Chris and Sylvia's paradise hideout again... having a well rewarded beer for defacing holographic signs in some imperial systems

Some of us are still hoping to end up 60,000ly from Colonia

 

[Desirsar]

I think distance should be based on cost- so 10LY is 'cheap' while 1000 LY is correspondingly expensive.

Just had the thought as I'm thinking I can't justify buying ARX for the new paintjobs I want badly when colonization sounds so boring... I will buy ARX instead of my steady stream of guitar gear if that gets me a 500 or 1000 LY range.

 

[William J Smith]

Some of us are still hoping to end up 60,000ly from Colonia

Is that because colonia is some hick outpost with dueling banjos in the distance?

Bill

<<chatting up the barmaid at Chris and Slyvia's paradise hideout... must be working... shes offered to buy me supper... but tell me.. what exactly is in a knuckle sandwich?

 

[Cmdr Travers]

Is that because colonia is some hick outpost with dueling banjos in the distance?

Bill

<<chatting up the barmaid at Chris and Slyvia's paradise hideout... must be working... shes offered to buy me supper... but tell me.. what exactly is in a knuckle sandwich?

Colonia has a fair few permit locked regions just outside it. It could become a VERY interesting place in the game if Frontier pulled their finger out and did the right thing

 

[Ian Skippy]

Make a ship with a 10ly range and try plotting a route to a system 500ly away.

For it to allow "building a route" in any sense it needs to be long enough for there to usually be a vaguely straight line; i.e. 25-30ly minimum.

 

[Cmdr Travers]

Also... Oh there are so many things here I don't think have been thought through.

After you successfully claim a system, the colony ship turns up and you then have to fill it with commodities with which to build your colony.

The further out into the galaxy the harder this gets.

Erm... Could it not just be possible to fill the colony ship with commodities when it's still IN the bubble? Let's face it, that's where it's coming from

 

[Commander Biscuit]

Feeling similar. I liked the idea of creating a mini bubble a couple of LY out, or even just my own little system (even if that would mean some level of grind). The way it looks now, I'm completely deflated (but not surprised unfortunately) after seeing today's preview. I've lost interest in PP2.0 after a couple of weeks realising it's a pointless hamster wheel to keep players busy for little payback (imo anyways), and Colonisation is dead in the water for me before the beta even starts, unless they seriously reconsider the fundamentals, which I don't think they're prepared to do apart from the odd tweak here or there.

This kinda reminds me of the original Fleet Carriers preview and the final product a year (or two?) later. Shame. Again.

I don't remember everything that was planned with FCs but they're pretty good in their current state. Good enough that most players have or want one. Maybe most players want to colonize as well, I'm not sure. Novelty by itself gets people hyped, but I don't see anyone asking what they gain from colonizing.

Who may be motivated to colonize when there's no incentive? Players may have to create their own incentive, such as irritating the people in Colonia, or arranging their expansion to spell out certain words, or draw certain objects when viewed in the galaxy map, if you catch my meaning.

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

I don't remember everything that was planned with FCs but they're pretty good in their current state.

They originally had FC variants (one for exploration, one for mining I believe, etc.) with the concept of support vessels. The original asset shots looked cool, the carriers looked distinctly different from each other.

Then the actual, much trimmed down (visually and gameplay wise) FC design released, and the visual assets were merely turned into Arx-only visual flavour. There wasn't even a simple bridge view.

It's the what could've been vs what we got in the end that reminded me of the FC release when looking at Colonisation so far.

It's also interesting how the Colonisation ships are basically various FC layout parts mashed up into one big lump, but that's an aside. Seems new assets are Arx only now.

Good enough that most players have or want one. Maybe most players want to colonize as well, I'm not sure. Novelty by itself gets people hyped, but I don't see anyone asking what they gain from colonizing.

Who may be motivated to colonize when there's no incentive? Players may have to create their own incentive, such as irritating the people in Colonia, or arranging their expansion to spell out certain words, or draw certain objects when viewed in the galaxy map, if you catch my meaning.

I can see a bunch of 10-100LY 'arms' reaching out from the bubble and then stop because people eventually gave up. Although your last suggestion is bound to happen either way

 

[Mr Lindsay]

I may have missed a post in here or in one of the other threads, but have any of the ED astronomy / maths boffins guesstimated what a 10 ly actually means for us.

That's a sphere approximately 320 ly in diameter, 10 ly thick.
By my extremely simplistic calculations, (calculating sphere volumes of radius 150 and 160 and subtracting) that gets us very roughly 3 million cubic lightyears of volume. Which is an increase in the volume of space taken up by the bubble by 'very roughly' 20%.

I've seen estimates of 100,000 systems in the bubble, of which roughly 20,000 are inhabited.
Taking that same approximate star density (which won't be uniform, but good enough for my loose numbers) players will gain access to around 20,000 systems on Day 1.
Not all of which will be desirable systems, but the potential is there to double the number of Human-inhabited systems in the Elite Dangerous in one week.

That's with 10 ly.
Some people want 500+ ly.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

Then, let's say you open a mine. If you've paid for the mine, you should always get what comes out of that mine absolutely free. It's your mine.

Does "paid for the mine" include "paying for all the mineral extractors, bioreducing lichen, HE suits, food, water, evacuation shelters, etc etc etc" the mine needs on an ongoing basis to continue operations?

If so, then sure, you should get the ability to take any produced commodities without payment (since you're giving up the ability to sell them to someone else if you do) [1]
If a bunch of NPCs magically handle all of that commerce without you needing to consider it ever again then you can pay for any Gallite they produce too.


[1] And in this case, market prices are going to need a serious overhaul so that raw materials aren't significantly more expensive per tonne than refined metals which are significantly more expensive per tonne than manufactured goods and components which are significantly more expensive per tonne than spaceships, or you're going to be making a massive loss on this facility whatever economy you pick for it.

They originally had FC variants (one for exploration, one for mining I believe, etc.) with the concept of support vessels. The original asset shots looked cool, the carriers looked distinctly different from each other.

Then the actual, much trimmed down (visually and gameplay wise) FC design released

Visually, yes.

Gameplay wise I strongly suspect what we have now is a lot better than an "exploration" or "mining" FC variant would be, which would probably have come with a static set of services enabled, including of course some outfitting and shipyard packs of minimal use to most players. The ability to set up your own carrier loadout and only have the bits you actually want is probably far more important than having a nice-looking support ship hanging around it.

 

[Commander Biscuit]

They originally had FC variants (one for exploration, one for mining I believe, etc.) with the concept of support vessels. The original asset shots looked cool, the carriers looked distinctly different from each other.

Then the actual, much trimmed down (visually and gameplay wise) FC design released, and the visual assets were merely turned into Arx-only visual flavour. There wasn't even a simple bridge view.

It's the what could've been vs what we got in the end that reminded me of the FC release when looking at Colonisation so far.

Ah yeah it was disappointing, yet FCs are still an asset to the player. Having the concourse added to FCs rounded them out for people's Odyssey gameplay and immersion value. Could be better, but the feature was at least improved after its initial rollout, which gives me a bit of hope colonization may be padded out as well. The roadmap for 2025 (if there is one) will be very interesting to see. New ships most likely, but what else? New feature, or fortifying the most recent one.