Ranking the areas still requiring animals

NachoB

NachoB
SuzieSky said:
The North American deserts and grasslands can easily go blue.
I'd probably make Patagonia yellow, but we're all waiting on the mara for green. There aren't many other realistic, unique, or likely options I'm aware of.
The South American forests stay orange for me. I'm still waiting on the coati and another monkey to turn it yellow. Green would take them plus another bird and monkey. Blue would take even more monkeys, perhaps another bird, and at least one more thing, probably the tamandua, Arrau turtle, or an agouti.
The South American grasslands remain yellow. It's still missing the South American coati, lowland tapir, and howler monkey. One of those would bump it to green.
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For Patagonia we are still missing mara and guanaco to be green. And tbf the species of rhea we got is not exactly the one that is most prevalente in Patagonia either.

No coati and like 2-3 more monkeys are needed for rainforests of SA and maybe something like a tamandua.
 

KönigDerKaffeebohnen

K
KönigDerKaffeebohnen said:
Assuming the 5 animals are:
  • Big Horn Sheep
  • Coyote
  • White Faced Saki
  • Greater/Lesser Rhea
  • American/Chillean Flamingo

So first of, all of north america gets to enjoy blue based on
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and
View attachment 423309

do i think both animals are lame additions to the game? Yes

Do they in arguably fill the niche of desert ungulate and carnivoran while also adding one of the most iconic animals of the north american grasslands to the point that its frequently refferd to as Prarie Wolf in multiple languages? Yeah i think they do move both the desert and the prarie to blue. Would another desert critter be cooler? Certanly but you also can build a quite in depth area for what is for zoos a rather niche area so i have no qualms calling it blue, especally considering its pretty well represented by exhibits aswell. If we should get the ocelot and/or the white nosed coati as one of the 2 remaining animals double that statement

The saki is a wonderfull addition but argueably not enough to move the rainforest out of orange. A second monkey or a bird could convince for that but rn it doesnt even have its resident small cat or any small carnivoran for that matter so thats another south america L right there

The existance of the rhea alone would boost patagonia to orange as a second animal together with the cougar and if u wanna stretch the lama as a third. If we should get the Mara aswell, patagonia would go to green. The greater rhea is the last bastion keeping the south american savannah out of green as arguably the by far most important missing key species, but the lesser rhea would not impact this region atall. While allready green, the lesser rhea would defenetly have made the argument for putting the andes into green, but doesnt move it to blue.

For the flamingo, if its american its singlehandedly boosting the carribeans to a present in the game with an orange rating. One animal is no great representation, but it certanly is some but at the same time one animal also really isnt what should make an area be deemed as good when their are other realistic options. It should also be noted that they are present on the tropical north coast of south america as a weak but welcome boost to south american rainforests. If its chilean then we can count that as a big patagonia W, boosting the area together with the rhea to yellow.
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The new guys change nothing besides the ocelot really bringing home the blue for the north american desert and being a nice boost for everywhere else but without enough of it to put them up to the next level, and the bush dog is just kind of whatever, need addition for tropical south america as smaller ground animals were needed but pretty meh in that regard
 

DarthQuell

DarthQuell
KönigDerKaffeebohnen said:
The new guys change nothing besides the ocelot really bringing home the blue for the north american desert and being a nice boost for everywhere else but without enough of it to put them up to the next level, and the bush dog is just kind of whatever, need addition for tropical south america as smaller ground animals were needed but pretty meh in that regard
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I dunno, I feel like we can bring SA rainforests to yellow now. Another monkey would do wonders, and a coati would be helpful, too.
The only other tropical animals could be the scarlet ibis or spoonbill
 

Mjmannella

Mjmannella
I'd love to see people make full zoo game rosters with the criteria that every region presented here is in the blue. Maybe set it to a species count of 200
 

KönigDerKaffeebohnen

K
DarthQuell said:
I dunno, I feel like we can bring SA rainforests to yellow now. Another monkey would do wonders, and a coati would be helpful, too.
The only other tropical animals could be the scarlet ibis or spoonbill
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ähem, let me just clear my throat:
  • coati, imagine having one :)
  • atleast 2 monkeys, if we want to get clean blue requirements are atleast spider and or howler, a tamarin and ideally either another tamarin or another monkey like the squirrel
  • birds, to be blunt one flamingo that lives on the coast doesnt suddenly enable an south american aviary, minimum here are scarlet ibis, roseate spoonbill and white faced whistling duck, but if we are real do we really have a decent bird representation of south american rainforest without macaws? I know no flying birds usually but they are among the first animals people would think about regarding south american rainforest or even south america as a whole
  • ground critters like agoutis, red footed tortoise or even the brazillian tapir as bairds doesnt cut it for the list
  • just goofy weird picks, for example the kinkajou, night monkeys or a porcupine

We are just talking about the most bio diverse spot on earth and even when ignoring plants and what would be exhibit animals there are still a ton of animals to add, defenetly more then the admittedly helpfull additions of a small cat and dog and a single monkey doesnt turn the famine into a feast
 

DarthQuell

DarthQuell
KönigDerKaffeebohnen said:
ähem, let me just clear my throat:
  • coati, imagine having one :)
  • atleast 2 monkeys, if we want to get clean blue requirements are atleast spider and or howler, a tamarin and ideally either another tamarin or another monkey like the squirrel
  • birds, to be blunt one flamingo that lives on the coast doesnt suddenly enable an south american aviary, minimum here are scarlet ibis, roseate spoonbill and white faced whistling duck, but if we are real do we really have a decent bird representation of south american rainforest without macaws? I know no flying birds usually but they are among the first animals people would think about regarding south american rainforest or even south america as a whole
  • ground critters like agoutis, red footed tortoise or even the brazillian tapir as bairds doesnt cut it for the list
  • just goofy weird picks, for example the kinkajou, night monkeys or a porcupine

We are just talking about the most bio diverse spot on earth and even when ignoring plants and what would be exhibit animals there are still a ton of animals to add, defenetly more then the admittedly helpfull additions of a small cat and dog and a single monkey doesnt turn the famine into a feast
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I agree with this😂
I'm talking about bring the rainforests to yellow, move it up from orange. There's a lot that would help, but I don't think it needs an entire expansion necessarily. This is just to get the bare minimum green. Of course I'd want it blue
 

KönigDerKaffeebohnen

K
DarthQuell said:
I agree with this😂
I'm talking about bring the rainforests to yellow, move it up from orange. There's a lot that would help, but I don't think it needs an entire expansion necessarily. This is just to get the bare minimum green. Of course I'd want it blue
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personally its still greatly lacking in biodiversity as it has a list of "missing key animals" that reads like "3+ monkey, 2+ waterbirds, macaws, 2+ ground critters, coati" which for me doesnt gell with the yellow tier as its just really still to much missing. Blame frontier for representing the north american desert equally with the south american rainforest in the pack but it really didnt do even close as much as it needed to do
 

yoav_r

yoav_r
KönigDerKaffeebohnen said:
personally its still greatly lacking in biodiversity as it has a list of "missing key animals" that reads like "3+ monkey, 2+ waterbirds, macaws, 2+ ground critters, coati" which for me doesnt gell with the yellow tier as its just really still to much missing. Blame frontier for representing the north american desert equally with the south american rainforest in the pack but it really didnt do even close as much as it needed to do
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To be fair most of these would be exhibit species. Even at best years we'd get 4 a year, now we get 1 a year, if any. The list becomes more manageable when you dont consider would-be exhibits and aviaries.
 

KönigDerKaffeebohnen

K
yoav_r said:
To be fair most of these would be exhibit species. Even at best years we'd get 4 a year, now we get 1 a year, if any. The list becomes more manageable when you dont consider would-be exhibits and aviaries.
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Thats fair but we still got a list of 3+ monkeys, 2+ waterbirds, 2+ ground critters, the coati and even if no flying bird the macaws really do be the definition of a key species here. Thats not "we are pretty good, we just need 2-3ish specific animals" but an entire lack of the back bone of the region. Ofcourse its much better then it was before but even for the context of habitat animals we are highly lacking. Its like saying the african savannah is missing key animals with 2 antelopes, a leopard, caracal, painted dogs, warthog, a croc and a giraffe cause we are that lucky, while the elephant in the room is still missing, not to mention variety of non antelope ungulates, but thats fine really cause we just got the somali wild donkey as an edge case, doesnt matter that the zebra isnt in the game yet, but its just a few key species am i right?
Ofcourse thats hyperbolic, but thats genuinly how south america still feels to me, as while we got a variety of animals the main animal groups that zoos typically keep in bulk (monkeys, aviary birds, waterbirds) are currently just laughably lacking (2,0,1ish if we really count the flamingo) and the key animal to the region in the coati just isnt here
 

yoav_r

yoav_r
Okay after all the comments here's my verdict @call me Omi :

  • North American deserts - go blue, that area is extremely well represented
  • North American grasslands - go blue, who knew north america will get so much love
  • Patagonia - goes yellow - poor Mara keeps us away from perfection. While patagonia has more animals to offer, the 3 omnipresent species in global zoos are rhea, mara, and cougar, and 2 of them are now with us. Once the third is here (fingers crossed) we'll be able to make decent pataonian representation in our zoos.
  • South american rainforest - can go yellow. Reasoning below*
  • South american grasslands - remains yellow, coati is missing, monkey is missing.
  • Caribbean - remains grey as we are still under the 2 habitat species threshold.
South America rainforest reasoning
While I agree with @KönigDerKaffeebohnen that there's a chasm between south america's potential and its actual representation in the game, I went and looked back to the part of the thread where we were discussing the south american rainforests specifically, and the gaps raised there were:
  • Coati
  • Peccary
  • More monkeys - in cateogries big, medium and small
  • More medium sized animals for an area featured in the game only by charismatic megafauna compared to the weird medium and small critters of real life zoos.
  • (And of course birds but we don't count them in PZ1 unfortunately)
The new pack adresses these gaps pretty well, giving us a big monkey (saki), 3 mid-sized lesser known critters (ocelot, bush dog, saki), and technically even two birds that touch on the region (flamingo and rhea). So if we judge this area the same we judged the previous areas as compared to what's feasible and likely in the game, I think we can now pinpoint two specific gaps (coati, tamarin) that keep us away from a realistic baseline roster for global zoos. That in addition to @IberianFlamenco🦩🦖 's good point that the orange category became less relevant as most of the areas were more fleshed out.

Objections?
 
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DarthQuell

DarthQuell
yoav_r said:
Okay after all the comments here's my verdict @call me Omi :

  • North American deserts - go blue, that area is extremely well represented
  • North American grasslands - go blue, who knew north america will get so much love
  • Patagonia - goes yellow - poor Mara keeps us away from perfection. While patagonia has more animals to offer, the 3 omnipresent species in global zoos are rhea, mara, and cougar, and 2 of them are now with us. Once the third is here (fingers crossed) we'll be able to make decent pataonian representation in our zoos.
  • South american rainforest - can go yellow. Reasoning below*
  • South american grasslands - remains yellow, coati is missing.
  • Caribbean - remains grey as we are still under the 2 habitat species threshold.
South America rainforest reasoning
While I agree with @KönigDerKaffeebohnen that there's a chasm between south america's potential and its actual representation in the game, I went and looked back to the part of the thread where we were discussing the south american rainforests specifically, and the gaps raised there were:
  • Coati
  • Peccary
  • More monkeys - in cateogries big, medium and small
  • More medium sized animals for an area featured in the game only by charismatic megafauna compared to the weird medium and small critters of real life zoos.
  • (And of course birds but we don't count them in PZ1 unfortunately)
The new pack adresses these gaps pretty well, giving us a big monkey (saki), 3 mid-sized lesser known critters (ocelot, bush dog, saki), and technically even two birds that touch on the region (flamingo and rhea). So if we judge this area the same we judged the previous areas as compared to what's feasible and likely in the game, I think we can now pinpoint two specific gaps (coati, tamarin) that keep us away from a realistic baseline roster for global zoos. That in addition to @IberianFlamenco🦩🦖 's good point that the orange category became less relevant as most of the areas were more fleshed out.

Objections?
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What about Central America? It still has yellow. Or is that bunched with SA rainforests?

I don't have any objections. I'm shocked that NA got this many animals in the 1st place (still believe that the ABB deserves a spot somewhere)
 
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