Yep, when the going gets tough just smack that big large button in the centre of the console marked 'Carebear Mode'
I would say going after shield-less T6's with no weapons is the definition of "carebear".
Yep, I went solo for trading rare goods
- Thread starter Zpike
- Start date
I would say going after shield-less T6's with no weapons is the definition of "carebear".
Did elite not use save games you simply reloaded when something bad happened?
Number 1 issue I'm seeing right here is the extreme hostility of you people that strongly reinforces the OP in his decision to stay away from open play.
This. if your idea of PVP is a basically riskfree, lopsided fight, you don't get to call anyone carebear.
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Thanks for that, pretty much my thoughts exactly! I play solo exclusively though, but who knows, some time in the future I might jump into open just for giggles, so it's nice that the option is there.
Anton Cano
Banned
Solo and Open need to be two different saves. This would accomplish a few things.
1. This would create a need for Open traders to hire player escorts for trade runs, effectively creating a new role in the game for us to fill.
2. Pirates would have more options for targets as people who use Solo to trade and Open to do other stuff could no longer do so without being unable to play with others on that save.
Making Open and Solo two different save profiles would hurt nobody other than people who switch back and forth to avoid potential risk in Open play. Solo and Open are both (and would remain) online-only because of the data stream that influences the dynamic universe. If I'm wrong, please enlighten me.
1. This would create a need for Open traders to hire player escorts for trade runs, effectively creating a new role in the game for us to fill.
a. Players could be paid in cargo or by player-generated bulletin missions if Frontier decided it was worth adding.
b. Pirates would likely have to form pirating groups to successfully interdict and destroy a trader's escort.
b. Pirates would likely have to form pirating groups to successfully interdict and destroy a trader's escort.
2. Pirates would have more options for targets as people who use Solo to trade and Open to do other stuff could no longer do so without being unable to play with others on that save.
a. Some players would opt to stick with Open, others with Solo, but hopefully the net result will be more traders in Open.
b. Players who want to play with others but not get pirated by other players could stay play in Group mode, which would use the same save as Solo.
b. Players who want to play with others but not get pirated by other players could stay play in Group mode, which would use the same save as Solo.
Making Open and Solo two different save profiles would hurt nobody other than people who switch back and forth to avoid potential risk in Open play. Solo and Open are both (and would remain) online-only because of the data stream that influences the dynamic universe. If I'm wrong, please enlighten me.
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Honestly, it always strikes me that it's the pirate who can't accept risk. There is zero risk in an asp/cobra/viper interdicting a hauler or type 6. Far from the trader being a coward by absenting themselves from the situation, it's the pirates who are being cowards by targeting players who cannot do not present any kind of threat to them.
You nailed it. This is the part of old Elites that I miss the most. I could just go and mess with things there and if it didn't work well, I'd reload. Here we always lose something if we make bad choices and that makes the gameplay completely different just because I'd select the safest option available just to avoid wasting time on recovering the credits. In other words, always online sucks from the classic Elite perspective
To get any viable PvP Frontier has to remove the insurance cost for any PvP death, that might get you guys somewhere althought I'd still rather troll you with a DC.
I dont' think you understand what the challenge is in piracy. The challenge is in getting the cargo, not in winning/surviving a fight. Whether a T6 has weapons or not doesn't really matter. Whether it has sheilds or not does a bit more. Trying to take cargo from a ship without blowing it up is hard, if it's through negotiation, or through violence. Incidentally, I pirate armed Cobras too. Even Asps at times.
I personally don't care where people want to play, only that they don't quit in the middle of a fight if they do chose to play in open.
Its funny how many people are so mad that other people are having fun playing the game their own way.
You're correct with the data from my understanding. But creating different saves doesn't help anybody. The people playing in Solo either A) Do not want player interaction or B) Playing it safe while playing their own game. You create absolutely no incentive for anybody to play in Open by separating them permanently. You'll have a bunch of Sidewinder Traders dipping their toes in the Open game.
No, the "fix" is for pirates to just ignore the fact you can play Solo. It is absolutely not detrimental to anybody's play. I don't even do it all the time, just when I'm in "trade mode" and my credit/hr is more important than satisfying your Pirate roleplay (even in the small chance you'd happen upon me anyway).
You would be taking an already pretty small player base and making it even smaller. I would probably just play Solo and Private Group at that point since there is absolutely no incentive for me to run trade routes in Open. And add to this the fact that I'd basically be 'starting over' ... nah, I'd just avoid it altogether.
But, keep them the same and I have incentive. Your gameplay elements are interesting, but until they flesh out the multiplayer that just isn't happening.
I agree with this last part. I don't think you should be able to logout while in combat or close to it. Basically create a cooldown on logging out when you're outside of a station. Say 1 minute or something, or if no other players are within a certain distance.
I also think you shouldn't be able to switch from Solo/Open unless you're in a station. The option would be 'greyed' out. So if you were playing Solo, logged out around a sun or in space, you could only log back into Solo until you made it to station to switch to Open. And vice versa, if you were in Open and started getting attacked and got away, you still couldn't log out to Solo until you got to a station.
I'm all for PVP options and reasons. But to force these on people isn't the right way. The old Elites and many people jumping in now don't care about the PVP aspect, they like the trading, flying bigger ships, the stars, the journey ... having CMDR XxxxTrollHuntexxxX asking for all their cargo doesn't improve the game for some.
Anton Cano
Banned
Quite the opposite. People who want to play with a mixture of friends and strangers (or simply want to play with other people, period) would have to play Open all the time, making the galaxy more populated, and if they choose to be traders, they give pirates more potential targets, which is good for the overall health of the game.
It absolutely is detrimental to people's play. I can't imagine the frustration of someone who wants to play as a pirate and knows that people who are trading do what you describe below simply to avoid risk. I appreciate all of the roles people can play in this game, and as long as Solo and Open aren't separate the pirating role is hurt and the galaxy feels emptier while people are amassing their fortunes in the safety of Solo play.
For the record, I run trades in my Cobra and I bounty hunt (PvE and PvP) as well on Open 100% of the time. I am not interested in pirating, but I am interested in escorting, and player behavior like yours makes the latter far less likely and over time will make the former less likely or non-existent because of your ability to switch between modes.
That's great! Stay in Solo and Group. That allows you to play alone or with trusted friends rather than expose you to the potentially chaotic Open galaxy, and that is perfectly fine.
No, you have the incentive to play in Solo while trading (the one thing pirates care about) and play in Open when you're not trading and enjoying your low-risk fortune. It's not fair to pirates and other Open players who are trading "legitimately" despite the inventive to trade in safety in Solo.
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But that goes both ways. Playing Open is detrimental to the trader because he is more exposed. You just don't see it from that point of view. You want this populated world from people who do not want to be part of that. It's really that simple. Force Open is just that, it's forcing people to play a different way. Your vision of all those lonely pirates does nothing to increase people's need to play Open. In fact I find it somewhat funny. Pirate NPC's. You're specifically asking people who have no interest in the PVP/Pirate roleplay to play that way even though it ONLY favors the pirates. And please, no "risk" is the reward stuff. It's not for a lot of people. There is a reason there are billions of dollars worth of single player games out there.
How is any of my trading in Solo affecting these pirates? The game is already instanced anyway so what about that 33rd pirate in the instance that is all alone after the 32 cap was met? Why is one mode that is available "legitimate" when I am able to look at the menu in my game that was designed by FD and select it. I'm not using a 'hack', there's no mods. It's just as legitimate.
All these arguments are ONLY for the benefit of the Pirate and their game. My "low-risk" fortune has been ended more times by my own human error than any interdicting pirate FYI.
You're basically saying "Come to Open play, it's empty!" and then following up with "Oh, stay in Solo, it's unfair". You say "giving pirates targets" without realizing these 'targets' are other players who don't wish to be part of that.
There is a vast array of people playing this game. You have some that take the trading game so seriously they've created tools that some airlines could benefit from. You have some that can fly so well they use FA off all the time. You have pirates that will kill anybody on-site regardless of the Pirates Code of Ethics that seems to be mentioned here. Forcing any of these players into a mode that they don't want will be detrimental to their play. Would you rather have somebody playing the game and supporting it or forcing an option that they don't want and abandoning it?
What's in it for the traders?
Actually Solo play is extremely detrimental for pirates, as I assume robbing AI traders is really bad business as they will rarely ship the expensive goods worth stealing.
I can fully understand that they want to rob players over AI, because a player will actually throw out a few tons of Gold without a fight while the AI always needs to be worked with guns.
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PvE groups. Mobius seems to be over 2K players strong already, and growing. It's in fact so big it's broken some of the group administration tools.
Not sure whether that was mentioned, but: Chris Roberts said that in Star Citizen, so far 80% of users play solo.
I never play open here, either.
That's a problem with NPC's then, not the choice of the players. If NPC's had bigger rewards for pirating as well as acted different in different situations, it wouldn't be on the "traders" to supply fodder for their cannons.
Don't blame solo players just because FD haven't created a challenging AI to play against.
Anton Cano
Banned
As someone who runs trades in Open, I definitely see it from that point of view, and that is what makes me want to split Open and Solo entirely. I am taking a much greater risk running trade routes in Open because players can (and have) interdict me and try to kill me or steal my cargo. I play a role necessary for those players to exist, who also play a role necessary for bounty hunters and escorts to exist. You playing in Solo and switching to Open when it suits you hurts the interdependence of player roles and actions.
If you do not wish to participate in non-consensual PvP, then please stay with Solo/Group and do not play on Open. This is part of the risk of playing on Open, and by playing in Solo and then switching to Open you are intentionally circumventing that risk, which cheapens the experience for us all.
That's fine, then stick to Solo. I'm not forcing you to play on Open. I just don't want people playing on Open who make their money playing Solo where there is no real risk to them.
I think you are being intentionally obtuse. I'll outline the problem as concisely as I can.
Some people are hopping between Solo and Open to avoid player interaction and do things that would be unsafe in Open, such as using a ship with large cargo capacity and eliminating defensive modules to increase cargo space. As you yourself have admitted, you do this to make safe trade runs, but play in Open other times.
This is unfair to people who play strictly in Open, especially a subset of those players who's aim in this open galaxy that Frontier has lovingly crafted is to pirate other players. This hurts pirates, potential escorts, potential bounty hunters, and the longevity of the Open game.
In order to eliminate the ability for players to dodge player interaction, I and other suggest that Open and Solo be made two separate save profiles, so that players who play in Open have to deal with other players 100% of the time, rather than when it is "convenient" for them.
Players who do not wish to interact with other players can simply play in Solo or Group mode. Like you said, there is a huge market for single-player games, so the people who legitimately want to play alone can do so. The people who want to always play with others can do so. The people that sometimes want to play alone and sometimes want to play with others can. The people who want to be wishy-washy and make money in Solo and then use that money in Open can't.
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I believe the same is true of most games that give the option to play solo. I've seen similar numbers with Diablo 3, Call of Duty, and many other games where the devs thought multiplayer would be the game's biggest draw. Most players seem to not want to play with strangers and/or to not have reliable friends available to play much multiplayer.