Of course it's not a real universe. It's "simulation" a simulated universe. And what the developers try to do is add a semblance of "realism". So if the scenario we are debating isn't realistic, then it's valid to point that out!This, I'm sorry to inform you, isn't a real univerese. It's a game.
PVP is not Griefing
- Thread starter darshu
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There is also another thing to. Bounty-hunters are justified to commit murder on anyone if they have a bounty on them, even if the people who have bounties never committed murder. This is yet another double-standard that the game has in place. It's OK to kill people, just as long as they have an arbitrary flag saying 'this person is bad'. Murder is murder, regardless if the person is a trader, bounty hunter, or pirate. For as long as there is no division between the two states, then murder is an OK form of piracy.
Also, FYI, bounty hunters kill more people than pirates do. Why aren't you complaining about them? If anything, bounty hunters are the real scumbags.
Also, FYI, bounty hunters kill more people than pirates do. Why aren't you complaining about them? If anything, bounty hunters are the real scumbags.
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@OP Just report any incident of the word "Griefer" being used on the forum. Whether applied correctly or no it is an obvious insult and intended as such, as evidenced by the way it is used, and insults are not allowed on this forum.
If we just report every post where this insult is used it should solve the problem.
If we just report every post where this insult is used it should solve the problem.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
It really is as simple as: a bounty means that the law has been broken and the options are to pay off the bounty or eventually get destroyed for the bounty.
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Sounds good - for balance, will we also report the use of pejorative terms for the less combative players?
At then end of the day Elite is a space flight simulator that features ship to ship combat. Sometimes that combat is PvP. However, combat is not the sole focus of the gameplay experience and it's not Call of Duty in space. If you play as a pirate and do so to make money by attempting to steal cargo, then fine. If, on the other hand, you are simply flying around in your big fully armed ship and are blowing up all the unwanted low level sidewinders and poorly armed haulers you can find just because you get some sort of perverse pleasure out of it, then your a very tiny minded, spiteful and pathetic individual. And a coward to boot!
No, it's just bogus way for people to kill other players. It's OK to kill people as long as they are 'bad' people. But murder is wrong!
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Bounty hunting encourages players to attack players who attack other ships - it's a support role to the security services.
Technically there is no murder of players - only a quick trip back to the station in an escape pod.
.... but taking the "murder is wrong" point - does that mean that all pirates who murder their mark are also wrong?
I just don't understand why people are moaning about getting "griefed" by other players. This is the way elite has always been, sometimes you die in horribly unfair ways.
Back on the c64 version you'd get randomly sucked into witchspace, surrounded by thargoids and murderised. If you survived the battle you had to hope you still had enough fuel left to jump out of there too. Now what difference does it make if you get killed by a player or npc?
Also, for me elite was never a space trading sim....I never bought cargo, I'd just go out with an empty hold, kill and collect booty. Unless I find rares it's what I do now. I'd also like to add, I'll happily kill another player if I can get away with it bounty or no.
Every kill is another step up towards elite status isn't it? As far as I'm aware all kills count. There have been a couple of time when my victim has smashed me to pieces too, it's all part of the fun. Elite would be a boring game without piracy and piracy knows no rules.
Back on the c64 version you'd get randomly sucked into witchspace, surrounded by thargoids and murderised. If you survived the battle you had to hope you still had enough fuel left to jump out of there too. Now what difference does it make if you get killed by a player or npc?
Also, for me elite was never a space trading sim....I never bought cargo, I'd just go out with an empty hold, kill and collect booty. Unless I find rares it's what I do now. I'd also like to add, I'll happily kill another player if I can get away with it bounty or no.
Every kill is another step up towards elite status isn't it? As far as I'm aware all kills count. There have been a couple of time when my victim has smashed me to pieces too, it's all part of the fun. Elite would be a boring game without piracy and piracy knows no rules.
Remiel
Banned
Well it's a good thing there's no murder taking place here then isn't it.
I take it you're not a fan of GTA though...
Tbh I don't really care, it's just a game. I'm just making an argument based on what the game is proposing though. I just feel irked how people refuse to see a full picture and want to see only their viewpoint.
Firstly, it was a joke. Secondly, Elite isn't a PvP arena shooter, by any stretch of the imagination.
Nope, still a straw an argument. As far as I can see on the forums, most people in a tiz about PVP are annoyed because they are getting attacked with no justification. No bounty, no cargo, just blown out of the sky for the lulz.
So, if someone did have a bounty on their head, they're fair game. Doesn't matter where the bounty came from - NPCs or PVP - they're wanted and fair game.
Now, to pursue the argument a little further...
NPCs do not spend hours of their free time improving their skills, building up credits to get better weapons, shields etc.
It therefore is of no consequence when a player kills an NPC. It doesn't matter. It's not annoying, frustrating or unfair to the NPC. THEYRE NOT REAL.
That there is the fallacy in your argument that PVE = PVP. It doesn't. Because it doesn't matter when you kill an NPC, through piracy, legitimate bounty hunting or just ramming them into the toaster rack.
Flip side is, if you attack a player, you are taking away their investment from the game - and that's usually time based. So, it's actually ridiculous to argue that pirating a player, taking their cargo and then blowing them up just because you can - is any way equivalent to doing the same to an NPC.
Testing guns combination against a NPC is very poor. Best is to go head to head with a human pilot and hope he can put up a fight.
This being said, and call it grief or not, some folks jump into the fray ( like yesterday ) without even checking what is going on, then they get surrounded by a group of players playing together and go guns hot !?!? madness and call it griefing
- " I was ganged by griefers ! "
Yes yes, call it all you want but you come like that, weapons deployed you asking for trouble.
And many many folks never play alone. There will be a wingman behind the next asteroid to give you the run of your life.
To the "victims", when jumped by a mindless human ghoul you have two choices, fight back or run away. Sitting like a lamb is what mindless PvP'ers like the most.
This being said, and call it grief or not, some folks jump into the fray ( like yesterday ) without even checking what is going on, then they get surrounded by a group of players playing together and go guns hot !?!? madness and call it griefing
- " I was ganged by griefers ! "
Yes yes, call it all you want but you come like that, weapons deployed you asking for trouble.
And many many folks never play alone. There will be a wingman behind the next asteroid to give you the run of your life.
To the "victims", when jumped by a mindless human ghoul you have two choices, fight back or run away. Sitting like a lamb is what mindless PvP'ers like the most.
I'm not talking about griefing, show me where i mention griefing. I'm talking about you saying:
"This game was literally designed for the player interaction some players are complaining about. Yes this is a pvp game. Yet it is the people who dont like it that are calling for design changes. While people playing in open to encounter other players for pvp are playing the open mode as it was intended to be. There are 2 modes one is more Elite and Dangerous. If you don't like it they made a Solo mode for you"
So again, the game is not a Pvp game. It is a player co-op game. It was not 'designed for' PvP. In fact, PvP is only a small part of the game. The game was designed so that players can swop modes as the fancy takes them. ALL players. Open is not just for PvP. Players also play in open mode so that they can co-operate with other players to take on the background simulation.
I have been interdicted many times in Solo by NPC Pythons who immediately attack my Adder. I have no cargo or bounty as it's just there for exploring the galaxy. I doubt the devs programmed these NPC's for "da lulz", but are simulating something that would happen in the "real" Elite Universe.
I stopped reading here because you refuse to see things any other way.
darshu
Banned
Exactly! At the moment i believe there are far more traders then pirates and full time bounty hunters combined. They have goals in mind they are working towards. Once they achieve them i expect to see a shift in power.The traders having acquired their riches will turn their attention to combat and remember the pirates that once bit at them like mosquitoes. In the end players are creating a great deal of content for each other.
Once the Thargoid come who knows they might be a big enough threat to force players to work together. For now any game that has a trade route will have robbers and any game with pvp will have murderers. If players or Npcs are sieging a system(s) and you insist on being there, expect combat. Pirates and murderers have just as much right to play in that sector as you do. I for one think its part of what makes this game great as you never know what the next jump brings !
I agree and my response as usual to all the whiners: Elite: "Dangerous"
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
To which the usual response is: The "Dangerous" in the game's name refers to the lowest reputation rank considered for membership of the Elite Federation of Pilots.
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