The Star Citizen Thread v 3.0

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Isn't that guy the just a community/forum manager? I doubt he as any say in how the game is made...

Looking for a Official Dev source, Chris Roberts for instance. I liked Freelancer controllers but never played in 3rd person since at the time I never owned a joystick, after purchasing one I can't play with the same enthusiasm if im using just mouse and keyboard! Joystick will always be more fun manoeuvring the spaceships.

Actually Ben is one of the new developers now and as such does have developer status. He was promoted somewhere around 2 months ago. James is the Community Manager now with Will being his assistant.
 

Ripley

Banned
Actually Ben is one of the new developers now and as such does have developer status. He was promoted somewhere around 2 months ago. James is the Community Manager now with Will being his assistant.

Really doubt he as any saying on gameplay, physics and core stuff. Ben is just a connection between Devs and the Community.
Director of Comunity or something. In 2013 he was exactly the same but without James and Will.
 
Really doubt he as any saying on gameplay, physics and core stuff. Ben is just a connection between Devs and the Community.
Director of Comunity or something. In 2013 he was exactly the same but without James and Will.

No, Ben was a dev from the get go except he also fell into the Community Manager role as well. Besides, Ben is not the only one stated that the game would play like Wing Commander and not Freelancer.
 
Pretty much this. There have been huge concerns over this debacle even before DFM now AC was released to the backers, hell a year before it was given to us. It's when CIG members tried to hush down this conversation with different remarks and comments stating that is not how it would be. People raised these concerns because it's not possible to balance joystick/gamepad and mouse on an equal footing when a mouse is given both flight and aim at the same time. When AC was first released, everyone raised hell because it was the exact same thing we had concerns over for the longest time. Heck, the closest the controllers came to balance was sometimes in .9 but then CIG allowed pilots to chose which targeting method they wanted and it basically negated all their effort.
SC isn't a conventional production. But compared to conventional your a alfa tester msking big fuss about prototyping gameplay. Where a lot of features of complex deep space craft are not yet posible to proto type.
Expecting release refined balancing on not even a feature complete part is nonsense.
Only argument you can have it't not conventional production. It a reality oroduction soap to keep backers in to the loop of dayly or weekly progress. Even for crowed funded production its not conventional.
The simplest balance perspective is, if the mouse wants to both aim and fly at the same time, then they must use another peripheral to utilize that aim while they use the mouse to fly. This is basically what joystick and gamepad players are forced to do right now, they have to use head tracking, which is no where close as good as mouse/flight aim combined. The mouse was artificially given, as in it was programmed that way to both have flight and aim combined while the other controllers are not. Even if the other controllers had flight and aim combined, it would still be no where as equal because the mouse is a zero order controller.
From my own perspective beyound this game. Dev chooses a balance in the end which type of gamer is best serviced. ED screwed mouse gamers all Hotas gamers happy but not all dev would do that. From production resources point of few. There is stated that bugs and features and balance is in essence a thing of case of urgency vs amount of work and dependancies, if it will be final state or mid fase state that get reworked due to new features make it broken again.
CIG has basically opened a huge can of worms balance wise when they introduced Freelancer controls, you really cannot balance that. If you want to balance all 3, either truly separate the flight from aim like it is separate on joystick/gamepad and force the users to purchase another peripheral to utilize to full advantage, or give gimbals to AI control like it is in Elite and you will basically avoid the balance issues.
My gues is balance get the highest priority and urgency even if it is hard work when they reach beta state and that means feature complete for the first release. Which means a PU in beta stage and multicrew gameplay worked out and that interworking with fighter gameplay.
The mouse would not be op if the flight and aim was separate function, but when it is, it becomes OP. Nobody here is saying nerf mouse or make it not a viable option, on the contrary, everyone wants you to play with your preferred controller, so far, the mouse is artificially buffed.
they can keep it or not but changing it is probaly not planed because it isn't a critical bug and if planned change all changes are deliverd with a feature release. Unless the very critical crashing bugs are fixed outside AC version feature release. Every change is que'ed for not the same release and also planned when to work on it.
Time will tell how CIG will end up dealing with this, but if the controls remain as they are, joystick players will either leave the game or be forced to switch to mouse/keyboard to stay competitive on the higher levels.
It more what it will be when PU is in beta fase. And what become on release and even then after release the can fine tune it. It's a MMO so blancing is work done after release to.
 
Pretty much this. There have been huge concerns over this debacle even before DFM now AC was released to the backers, hell a year before it was given to us. It's when CIG members tried to hush down this conversation with different remarks and comments stating that is not how it would be. People raised these concerns because it's not possible to balance joystick/gamepad and mouse on an equal footing when a mouse is given both flight and aim at the same time. When AC was first released, everyone raised hell because it was the exact same thing we had concerns over for the longest time. Heck, the closest the controllers came to balance was sometimes in .9 but then CIG allowed pilots to chose which targeting method they wanted and it basically negated all their effort.

The simplest balance perspective is, if the mouse wants to both aim and fly at the same time, then they must use another peripheral to utilize that aim while they use the mouse to fly. This is basically what joystick and gamepad players are forced to do right now, they have to use head tracking, which is no where close as good as mouse/flight aim combined. The mouse was artificially given, as in it was programmed that way to both have flight and aim combined while the other controllers are not. Even if the other controllers had flight and aim combined, it would still be no where as equal because the mouse is a zero order controller.

CIG has basically opened a huge can of worms balance wise when they introduced Freelancer controls, you really cannot balance that. If you want to balance all 3, either truly separate the flight from aim like it is separate on joystick/gamepad and force the users to purchase another peripheral to utilize to full advantage, or give gimbals to AI control like it is in Elite and you will basically avoid the balance issues.

The mouse would not be op if the flight and aim was separate function, but when it is, it becomes OP. Nobody here is saying nerf mouse or make it not a viable option, on the contrary, everyone wants you to play with your preferred controller, so far, the mouse is artificially buffed.

Time will tell how CIG will end up dealing with this, but if the controls remain as they are, joystick players will either leave the game or be forced to switch to mouse/keyboard to stay competitive on the higher levels.

To my mind, the answer is simple. Give any controller method the same level of auto-aim/convergence for gimballed weapons - just like in Elite: Dangerous, none of this 'manual' gimbal aiming. To help balance, auto-aimed weapons have some level of innaccuracy, and be less powerful than their equivalent fixed version. It works in E: D.
 
To my mind, the answer is simple. Give any controller method the same level of auto-aim/convergence for gimballed weapons - just like in Elite: Dangerous, none of this 'manual' gimbal aiming. To help balance, auto-aimed weapons have some level of innaccuracy, and be less powerful than their equivalent fixed version. It works in E: D.

Yes that is the logical and common sense way to do it. But CIG would rather dance around it and work out some way of making combat just as easy for flightstick pilots as it is for mouse players totally ignoring the fact that in the process they are removing the skill requirement.
 

Ripley

Banned
Ben is also a designer for a looong time in the project.

No, Ben was a dev from the get go except he also fell into the Community Manager role as well. Besides, Ben is not the only one stated that the game would play like Wing Commander and not Freelancer.

If im not mistaken all Ben did was Lore / ship brochures and stuff like that for WC and managed a Fan-Site, no coding or design whatsoever involved.

Is Linkedin Page shows him as Director of Community Engagement and Content Strategy, prior to that he was the Community Manager. Then they added the AMD Chick, Jen as a new member of the community team, James was promoted to Community Manager and Will to Assistant Community Manager.

The "more like Wing Commander than Freelancer" was mostly in terms of aesthetic, because Freelancer ditched Cockpits and Chris Roberts wanted that back in for immersion reasons.
 
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anybody else glad that star citizen is coming out soon?

as we see with markets where there are no competition :::cough::: X Rebirth:::::

Devs dont feel the need to add anything original and expansive to the game while taking risk, all or nothing approach. as for rebirth, it's "you wanna a play a space sim... ya... either us or eve. have fun." with either a shirry game or an overly competitive game of number crunching. I personally reverted to X3, my favorite game of all time... i mean, second favorite game now (thank you so much Frontier)

IMO, without a strong competitor, more markets fall flat on quality and over price the product due to the idea of "if you want it buy what we got, you dont want it? the deal with out it" textbooks IMO are the worst.

so A/W, with Star citizen hot on their heels, i feel that Elite dangerous has to stand out really well and strive for Excellency (which it's doing beautifully).
as for Star Citizen, it has the disadvantage of coming out later so it has to prove right out of launch that it stands toe to toe with ED or else ppl will walk away without giving it a second look when bugs and stuff get fixed.


TLDR


so with two games competing in the same field, i think the devs will have a health competition with each other and result in two fabulous space sims game that will be what we all have been waiting for and deserve!! good example, COD and Battlefield, not my type of games but the competition between them made them try harder to make a great games.

Edit: when i mean soon i'm comparing how long a game is released in terms of announced and development cycles, 20ish months is soon. ask any game developer about how quick 8 months can go by and feels too soon.


it's about how competition of a rivalry makes better quality products. and i'm glad it turned out that way
 
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"Soon"????!!! SOON?!!!!???!!!!!

ROFL!!!!


The only game to rescue me from this grindy time-waste anytime soon would be Enemy Starfighter. Too bad its suddenly gone under the radar for the last few months. Yet I am confident it will manage to provide a worth-while story rich gameplay experience with meaningful NPCs and such years before Elite Tedious or Far Citizen will get around to it.
 
Unless SC is an absolutely perfect game in all respects, the same whiners that whine about ED are going to whine about it for more or less the same reason. There will be features left out, gameplay unbalanced, hiccups, and cheats, whine whine whine.

I'm an SC backer and I look forward to trying it.* But I'm actually less impressed with SC given the huge amount of money that has been thrown at it, and its release schedule. I'm more happy to see a game that comes out on schedule, mostly works, and adds features and improves, as long as there's an indication that it can continue doing so. SC's going to have to really stomp on the boost when they get it out the door.

(* I'm 53. I'd like to try it before I'm ... say... 60)
 
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Almost one year ago exactly we had Elite Dangerous Alpha 2, four barely functioning multi-player scenarios. The Bafta event was taking place roughly around this time and added the first station (Zelada) and the Cobra MK III (the first non sidewinder ship in ED). There was nothing else until Alpha 4. No hyperspace, no super-cruise, no trading, no mining.

A little under one year ago we were waiting for the release of the 'dog fighting module' for Star Citizen. An arena shooter with a few maps in Cryengine.

Yes competition is good. Wake me when it's here.

See you next year.
 
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