Explorers - Should they lose their data upon ship destruction?

[jmp470]

I like the thoughts of this but would add:

The explorer outfits his ship with the DSS and advanced scanner in pods, those pods are jettisoned once the ship is destroyed. These pods have a transponder code on them, which the original explorer is able to see once he spawns at an outstation. He / she can go get the pods, however, here is the difference I see. The killing pirate can gather the pods (with the transmitter still going off) and the original person can then chase after them or put a bounty on the pirates head! The transponders on the pods will continue to go off, and the original explorer could see them on the galaxy map, UNTIL, the pirate brings the data to an space station and launders the data. I think the pirate then should get paid to sell the data on the black market. Here is another part, those transponders on the gear also put off a weak signal for all those who fly buy it. So in theory, if you get killed by a NPC, another play can then get your data (weak signal) and you can chase them down or put a bounty on their head.

That would be an in depth solution to a problem that doesn't really exist. But, would get explorers defending their data... or letting it go....

 

[thehairymob]

I like the thoughts of this but would add:

The explorer outfits his ship with the DSS and advanced scanner in pods, those pods are jettisoned once the ship is destroyed. These pods have a transponder code on them, which the original explorer is able to see once he spawns at an outstation. He / she can go get the pods, however, here is the difference I see. The killing pirate can gather the pods (with the transmitter still going off) and the original person can then chase after them or put a bounty on the pirates head! The transponders on the pods will continue to go off, and the original explorer could see them on the galaxy map, UNTIL, the pirate brings the data to an space station and launders the data. I think the pirate then should get paid to sell the data on the black market. Here is another part, those transponders on the gear also put off a weak signal for all those who fly buy it. So in theory, if you get killed by a NPC, another play can then get your data (weak signal) and you can chase them down or put a bounty on their head.

That would be an in depth solution to a problem that doesn't really exist. But, would get explorers defending their data... or letting it go....

Me thinks you have spent many sleepless nights. Hehehe

But yeah tha t is how I would love to see it too.

 

[Lord_Crazy]

So I could fly out 1000 ly, get a load of data, self destruct and be back instantly with all my data and 10% fee? That could save weeks!

No one said that. One option allows this but people didn't vote a lot for that (thankfully!). Other options are about a black box: it does not travel back with you if your ship is destroyed, you would have to go on the crash site. This might save your data but does not save you time as you would need to go there and salvage the ship to find the black box.

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Exploration is already the safest role in ED. Traders can lose millions in cargo, so why should explorers be immune to such losses?

Well I agree, that's why there are other options where you would need to go retrieve the data. You are not immune, it just gives you a second chance. Just like traders could chase pirates and retrieve their cargo.

 

[Flector]

Some people say that losing a ship for an explorer is just the same as for a trader or bounty hunter.
But these are completely different orders of magnitude. The trader or bountyhunter lose max. 20 millions and a couple of hours of play. A (long-range) explorer can lose 150 million and weeks of play (or even more).

This is also the reason that making explorers juicy targets for pirates is just bad in my opinion. It would completely kill of long range exploraration.

As for the poll: I chose keep it as it is. Currently the huge possible losses are compensated by a very low risk.

 

[Im_Lost]

It's fine as it is now I think.

Plus a "black box" wouldn't work. Because the galaxy is procedural it's generated on the fly, so technically an area doesn't exist unless someone is in it. There isn't even any persistence with NPCs, so no chance with loot.

 

[CMDRKNac]

Because the game cannot take easier enough ...

 

[NeilUK02]

I have posted on one of the other threads that my idea would be to include any data the pilot has gained in the insurance claim, so on destruction you get the usual screen but if there's some outstanding data on file the insurance screen gives the player the choice. He can just claim and get his ship back, or pay more and get the data as well. That way there's a punishment for dying and a choice to make, he/she will have to figure out whether to risk whether any payments for the data will outweigh extra cost of the insurance

 

[Jordan Cobalt]

Not really balanced or fair to other roles. every role loses their stuff when they die. Exploration should be no different.

 

[bassman]

I don't think increasing the gameyness of a feature is an improvement. I did expand my reasoning beyond that first catchphrase

Black box recorders are less "gamey" than a total loss of data in a setting a thousand odd years in the future IMO.

 

[Cmdr Rhott Roe]

I do explore. I have an account just for exploring. If my ship gets destroyed for any reason my data is lost, as it should be. Let's not take any risk away from the most relaxing profession in the game.

Coming home to sell my data is the most exciting time of exploring for me. The rest of the time out in the black is just relaxing and beautiful.

 

[Allitnil]

Ever jumped into a black hole system with a cracked canopy whilst 12000ly from civilised space ?

We can't just call into a repair shop out here you know.

Yep. Also done it well over twice that distance. The only risk is doing something dumb (why I had the cracked canopy in the first place) or falling asleep. Exploring needs *some* risk or else what's the point?

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I was talking about carrying the data in your escape pod as people suggested in the other thread.

An escape pod is OK, but it should take weeks to return to colonised space & be at risk from interception in the meantime. What we actually have is instantaneous conciousness teleportation which is presumably to a backed-up conciousness rather than actually transporting ourselves. As such it would be nonsense to also restore what data is held on our ships.

 

[Sallen]

Losing everything is reasonable, but an encrypted black box system would be cool and add an interesting mechanic to the very stale game of exploration, going back to recover your lost data. Also for third parties, a partial recovery of the encrypted data could be possible, netting them only part of the profits on sale.

Then again, since Elite does not have a persistent universe, this is not possible.

 

[Skuli]

You kind of screwed up your poll.

The thread title asks one question, and the poll itself asks the completely opposite question.

I wonder how many people clicked to the poll and immediately answered "No" to the question "Should explorers lose their data when they die?", rather than actually reading the poll question...

 

[Kayweg]

You kind of screwed up your poll.

The thread title asks one question, and the poll itself asks the completely opposite question.

I wonder how many people clicked to the poll and immediately answered "No" to the question "Should explorers lose their data when they die?", rather than actually reading the poll question...

I'm afraid you're the one who got it the wrong way around.

I've seen polls like the one you describe, but thisone isn't one of them.

Q: "Would you like a system preventing explorers from loosing all data ?"

A: "No, i like the current system, you die, you loose everything" = No, i would not like a system preventing explorers from loosing all data.

There are no contradictions in the poll options.

 

[Scienti5t]

With no FTL communications it makes sense that exploration data would be cached locally on the ship and lost at destruction.

I don't hold with the losing combat bonds, bounties etc though. That seems like it would be attributed to a pilot and ought to get uploaded for crediting as part of the docking registration.

 

[Skuli]

I'm afraid you're the one who got it the wrong way around.

I've seen polls like the one you describe, but thisone isn't one of them.

Q: "Would you like a system preventing explorers from loosing all data ?"

A: "No, i like the current system, you die, you loose everything" = No, i would not like a system preventing explorers from loosing all data.

There are no contradictions in the poll options.

I never said there were contradiction in the poll options.


The POST title asks: "Explorers - Should they lose their data upon ship destruction?"

The POLL asks "Would you like a system preventing explorers from losing their data?"

A "Negative" response to one is the exact opposite of a negative response to the other, and it's quite possible someone reads the POST title and simply immediately selects the "No" option in the poll, because reading is too much work for most people.

It's not a BIG problem, I just thought it deserved noting that the "No" answers might be slightly skewed thanks to people not fully reading the poll vs. post title.

 

[Matt Hawkins]

It's fine as it is. You can choose when to sell your data. You can choose how to balance the risk. Exploring is already fairly risk free.

 

[CMDR AKIRA MASAKARI]

In my opinion it's fine as it is. Exploration is basically dangerless, you can have problem if you mismanuever near a star, but you really must be tired or already asleep or nearly full drunk. Binary stars could pose a thread, but there are ways to safe land in them.

So basically now being aware you sit on several million data you can lose is a big fun mechanic, and it's the key point for when/if go back.

My answer is no, leave it as it is.

 

[Kayweg]

I never said there were contradiction in the poll options.


The POST title asks: "Explorers - Should they lose their data upon ship destruction?"

The POLL asks "Would you like a system preventing explorers from losing their data?"

A "Negative" response to one is the exact opposite of a negative response to the other, and it's quite possible someone reads the POST title and simply immediately selects the "No" option in the poll, because reading is too much work for most people.

It's not a BIG problem, I just thought it deserved noting that the "No" answers might be slightly skewed thanks to people not fully reading the poll vs. post title.

Reading comprehension and all that....you are correct.

The header contradicts the poll question....i apologize.

 

[Szyslak22]

I kinda like the idea of having a black box that stays in the system where you exploded. You could choose to go back and get it or even bargain for someone else to retrieve it on the way back. I really like the idea of stumbling across another explorer's data in a WSS in some random system, then trying to track them down to return it. Or possibly listen to the devil on the other shoulder and sell it.

Of course this also sets it up for piracy, which I don't think is necessarily a bad thing. If you're coming back with 50+ million of exploration data, you might want to wing up with some people you trust. That seems like something a station would pay 5% bonus for, as that data could be more valuable than a normal trade commodity. If only it wasn't such a pain to sell...