To the FDL who can't handle being shot at...

[tarks382]

I always laugh that you can have games that are about mass murder or stomping anyone who stands in your way but your not allowed to swear lol.

Hey, there are children and young teenagers out there commiting war crimes and mass murder. Their delicate sensibilities need protection.

More generally, this is akin to that uncomfortable Facebook zone where real, ugly violence is OK while nurturing mothers aren't (see what I did there? - that's reflexive internet etiquette for you). It's all so unbelievably convoluted I'm surprised any of us manage to communicate at all.

 

[Cosmos]

We simply can't have bad language while we're try to kill each other Gentlemen! It's just not cricket!

Shouldn't they just have a swear filter in game which we can toggle on and off?

 

[Ian Phillips]

Could everyone keep their posts focussed on the subject, and not the poster please.

 

[Jagaroth]

I could write a custom filter for the game.

It wouldn't censor anything but if it caught you swearing it would pull down your shields and slap you with 5% hull damage.

(and be smart enough to allow you to say anything to wings/friends)

That way you can play and say what you like but there will be consequences.

 

[Glenn Ross]

I don't care what anyone's age is and don't think age should exempt anyone from anything.

And that, there, is the problem in a nutshell. (I would so like to put in a comment about children drinking, doing drugs, begging, and getting STD's, but I just can't make myself do it.) That attitude from FD would have meant the game had an 18+ rating, less people would have been able to buy it, and it may have been unsucessful at even the KS stage. But more than that, it shows that the EULA means nothing to you.
.
You, like everyone who plays the game, electronically signed that you would agree to abide by FD's rules of conduct in the game. No cheating by using altered code to run the game, no this, no that. Well, in amongst the 'this' and 'that' you agreed to was a clause that basically stated "No Abusive behaviour". Well, guess what. "Abusive behaviour" includes
<Da Da Da!>
Abusive Language!
Anyone who swears in chat is guilty of using abusive language and has therefore broken their contract with FD. Plain and simple. You don't like that restriction, don't agree to it and don't play the game. You play the game, you play by the rules or don't whine when you get punished. [And don't forget, before FD can take any action, the person that is the target of the swearing has to find it offensive and report it to FD. Swear in local chat and you run the risk that other people may find the remarks offensive and report you. If you must do it, do it direct.]
.
[OK, given the (non) action taken by FD against the rammers at George Lucas, that might not be that much of a risk, but again that's up to FD not me.]

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I could write a custom filter for the game.

It wouldn't censor anything but if it caught you swearing it would pull down your shields and slap your Asp.

(and be smart enough to allow you to say anything to wings/friends)

That way you can play and say what you like but there will be consequences.

Fixed that for you

 

[Jockey79]

You can report for bad language? Really? I'd think that'd be part of life, and the game, too, as long as no real-life threats were made.

Have not read the rest of the thread, so sorry if this was covered - but this really gets me and had to answer it directly.

Part of life !!!
Really ???

Let me show you something;

UK Public Order Offences (arrestable without warrant) from;

The Public Order Act 1986

• riot - section 1 of the Act;
• violent disorder - section 2 of the Act;
• affray - section 3 of the Act;
• using threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour causing fear of or provoking violence - section 4 of the Act;
• using threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour intending to and causing harassment, alarm or distress - section 4A of the Act;
• using threatening, abusive words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour likely to cause harassment, alarm or distress - section 5 of the Act;

I'll tell you what "part of life" is, it is getting arrested and thrown in a cell to face a judge over using certain words, behaviour or signs that are deemed "offensive".
Online games are classed as public space, so yes, you can report people for it and FD are well within their rights to ban the account of the offender.

Remember, real life court cases have come about from Second Life (an online game) and folks have been investigated and arrested over Twitter remarks and Facebook posts. Just because you're sat in front of a computer screen, does not make it more acceptable than doing it outside of a police station.
Do not do/say ANYTHING online you'd not do in front of a police constable or a court judge.

 

[Tarman]

Also us Brits have learned a double language:

You have got my Dander up
You are quite an annoying chappie
I appear to be in a bit of a pickle

I knew a British guy once who fell in the pool and couldn't swim.

"Excuse me but I might be drowning." Not one word of a lie. Very surreal.

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Edit: Also in regards to the post above me, where I live you can be charged with insulting the police. If you don't explicitly frame your statement of their incompetence/brutality/stupidity as a matter of your opinion you're going into the back of the cruiser.

 

[Kayweg]

One thing came from it, we know now we can report foul language to FDEV if the person is being particularly excessively abusive.

We always knew that we could do that, nothing new there.

The fact that many people just shrug it off and move on is a different matter.

 

[Obtuse]

The correct way to insult someone is to say " I bite my thumb at you sir." (+rep for anyone who knows the reference!)

 

[Bacon Sarnie]

The correct way to insult someone is to say " I bite my thumb at you sir." (+rep for anyone who knows the reference!)

I do not bite my thumb at you, sir, but I bite my thumb, sir.

 

[Yomamas Fett]

Fun fact #1,922:

The Term "Dude" was originally used in the American Midwest as a pejorative for Homosexual.

Legendary Aviation Pioneer Glenn Luthor Martin was referred to as "the Flying Dude" for his Sartorial elegance whilst Barnstorming in the years between the Great Wars. To the cornfed farmer anyone who wasn't covered in cow ploop must have been homosexual apparently.


OT: What I'm getting from this thread is that it's still ok to take a pop at the French. no?

 

[Cythrawl]

. If I learned that a child of mine was picking up obscenities from a computer game - whether it was from the game program or other players, that game would be removed and they would be banned from playing it.

Better ban said child from school then as well while you are at it.

I am 44 this year and I distinctly remember picking up the majority of cuss words from other kids in the playground..

and it is the same now with my son who is 11...

Just sayin' you cant wrap them in cotton wool all the time.. and more than likely that child of yours knows more than you think they do..

 

[Glenn Ross]

OT: What I'm getting from this thread is that it's still ok to take a pop at the French. no?

I am slightly embarrassed to admit that my first thought to that question was "Mais, Oui!"

 

[Yomamas Fett]

I am slightly embarrassed to admit that my first thought to that question was "Mais, Oui!"

I'm always reminded of the "Yes, Minister" episode where it's explained that the real reason the UK needs a nuclear deterrent is because the French have one.

 

[Glenn Ross]

Just sayin' you cant wrap them in cotton wool all the time.. and more than likely that child of yours knows more than you think they do..

Don't actually have any kids, hence the IF at the beginning of that post.
Do agree that you can't wrap them in cotton wool, nor do I believe it's good to try, but better they learn from their parents what is considered acceptable and what isn't and they won't get the difference between swearing at SOMETHING as opposed to SOMEONE if they get it from an online game [nor necessarily from the playground, buy as you say, you can't do anything about that.] I also don't have any misconceptions about how many cuss words the average 8-12 year old knows, but I would be shocked if they knew anything like the number I do.
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Which again brings us back to the topic of filters. How many filters can cope with the sort of words we know? I mean, we must be science fiction fans, all of us, on some level, or we wouldn't be playing this game, right? So What about words from SF shows and movies?
Farscape had a very rich linguistic landscape when it came to it's use of swearing. We all knew what it meant, but they had just made up words with no other meaning and put them in a sentence in such a way that it didn't take a rocket scientist to work out what they were ACTUALLY saying.
Or Star Trek? There are actually recognised language courses these days in KLINGON! Now there must be a language that is rich in swearwords and offensive phrases. I bet no language filter would stop them.
.
So filters are not as effective as some people seem to think - after all, if they were we wouldn't need the mods on this very forum - which DOES have a filter - to remove attempts to mask swearing or otherwise circumvent the filter. So you cannot blame the developer for what people 'say' in chat - especially not before the game is released - and that obviously cannot be the criteria for an ESRB rating, so the publisher has to cover themselves somehow. That is to put it into the EULA. At least then if a particular player keeps getting brought to their attention, they will have to do something about it, but if ost people are not that bothered, they can let it slide as "We were not aware they were making such a problem. Thank you for bringing it to our attention, we will now take action."

 

[Tarman]

Don't actually have any kids, hence the IF at the beginning of that post.
Do agree that you can't wrap them in cotton wool, nor do I believe it's good to try, but better they learn from their parents what is considered acceptable and what isn't and they won't get the difference between swearing at SOMETHING as opposed to SOMEONE if they get it from an online game [nor necessarily from the playground, buy as you say, you can't do anything about that.] I also don't have any misconceptions about how many cuss words the average 8-12 year old knows, but I would be shocked if they knew anything like the number I do.
.
Which again brings us back to the topic of filters. How many filters can cope with the sort of words we know? I mean, we must be science fiction fans, all of us, on some level, or we wouldn't be playing this game, right? So What about words from SF shows and movies?
Farscape had a very rich linguistic landscape when it came to it's use of swearing. We all knew what it meant, but they had just made up words with no other meaning and put them in a sentence in such a way that it didn't take a rocket scientist to work out what they were ACTUALLY saying.
Or Star Trek? There are actually recognised language courses these days in KLINGON! Now there must be a language that is rich in swearwords and offensive phrases. I bet no language filter would stop them.
.
So filters are not as effective as some people seem to think - after all, if they were we wouldn't need the mods on this very forum - which DOES have a filter - to remove attempts to mask swearing or otherwise circumvent the filter. So you cannot blame the developer for what people 'say' in chat - especially not before the game is released - and that obviously cannot be the criteria for an ESRB rating, so the publisher has to cover themselves somehow. That is to put it into the EULA. At least then if a particular player keeps getting brought to their attention, they will have to do something about it, but if ost people are not that bothered, they can let it slide as "We were not aware they were making such a problem. Thank you for bringing it to our attention, we will now take action."

You dirty petaQ.


Edit: Okay, Klingon passes the filter.

 

[JeffRyan]

Have not read the rest of the thread, so sorry if this was covered - but this really gets me and had to answer it directly.

Part of life !!!
Really ???

Let me show you something;

UK Public Order Offences (arrestable without warrant) from;

The Public Order Act 1986

• riot - section 1 of the Act;
• violent disorder - section 2 of the Act;
• affray - section 3 of the Act;
• using threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour causing fear of or provoking violence - section 4 of the Act;
• using threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour intending to and causing harassment, alarm or distress - section 4A of the Act;
• using threatening, abusive words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour likely to cause harassment, alarm or distress - section 5 of the Act;

I'll tell you what "part of life" is, it is getting arrested and thrown in a cell to face a judge over using certain words, behaviour or signs that are deemed "offensive".
Online games are classed as public space, so yes, you can report people for it and FD are well within their rights to ban the account of the offender.

Remember, real life court cases have come about from Second Life (an online game) and folks have been investigated and arrested over Twitter remarks and Facebook posts. Just because you're sat in front of a computer screen, does not make it more acceptable than doing it outside of a police station.
Do not do/say ANYTHING online you'd not do in front of a police constable or a court judge.

I wish I could make it rain rep for you.

 

[Archvillain]

From a dev perspective, there are popular games where the online trash-talking is enough of a Thing that it severely curtails the demographics of who will put up with that and play. It is actually a serious problem with serious $$$ losses to the devs in lost sales and lost cultural influence and acceptance. The lost sales aren't even kids who can't get permission to play, a large chunk of interesting adults are turned off by having their limited and valuable leisure time filled with abuse.

There are a lot of options competing for the same entertainment dollar, so people absolutely can and do go elsewhere rather than put up with trash-talking, and the result is that the awesome interesting people go elsewhere, the game becomes the domain of foul-mouthed boys (who pretty much no-one likes playing with except other foul-mouthed boys), game sales falls, dev money is curtailed.

Trash-talking is just not worth it. Discouraging this is doing us all a service - when you encounter other players, would you prefer they be a mix of people from real-world rocket scientists to dancers, or mostly just 12-year-old boys who can't stop saying "homo"?

Heh, I like one of the earlier suggestions here - if you feel like trash-talk, try trash-talking as if a 19th century gentleman speaking to his peers

 

[Bostlabs]

Fun fact #1,922:

The Term "Dude" was originally used in the American Midwest as a pejorative for Homosexual.

Legendary Aviation Pioneer Glenn Luthor Martin was referred to as "the Flying Dude" for his Sartorial elegance whilst Barnstorming in the years between the Great Wars. To the cornfed farmer anyone who wasn't covered in cow ploop must have been homosexual apparently.


OT: What I'm getting from this thread is that it's still ok to take a pop at the French. no?

Dude! Not cool!
LOL!

 

[Tarman]

From a dev perspective, there are popular games where the online trash-talking is enough of a Thing that it severely curtails the demographics of who will put up with that and play. It is actually a serious problem with serious $$$ losses to the devs in lost sales and lost cultural influence. The lost sales aren't even kids who can't get permission to play, a large chunk of adults are turned off by having their leisure time filled with abuse.

There are a lot of options competing for the same entertainment dollar, so people absolutely can and do go elsewhere rather than put up with trash-talking, and the result is that the awesome interesting people go elsewhere, the game becomes the domain of foul-mouthed kids (who pretty much no-one likes playing with except other foul-mouthed kids), game sales falls, dev money is curtailed.

Trash-talking is just not worth it. Discouraging this is doing us all a service - when you encounter other players, would you prefer they be a mix of people from real-world rocket scientists to dancers, or mostly just 12-year-olds who can't stop saying "homo"?

Heh, I like one of the earlier suggestions here - if you feel like trash-talk, try trash-talking as if a 19th century gentleman speaking to his peers

Nothing is more fun than confusing someone with polite diatribe that only slightly later do they realize has shut them down completely. Hi-end trashtalk is a sport of kings.