Should have just combat logged.

[drkaii]

Let me ask you. Do you play PP and know the mechanics? If not:
You have 10 powers, each with a different (one of 4) major faction behind. The Feds have 2 powers, Alliance has 1, Empire has 4 and the indi's have 3. As soon as you join one of those powers you are marked as hostile for every other power.
Hostile means you are the enemy and you are allowed to strike down other enemys. It is not a thing in between or something. As soon as i see someone who is hostile, i'll check his faction and prepare myself.
But joining a power and ranting about getting killed by a hostile cmdr- with or without any kind of chitchat, announcement, parole or something else is unnecessary. And telling others that you'd been griefed is beyond my imagination.
People should begin to understand that some small actions might have repercussions. And if he wants to participate in PP but without any hostile incidents i am sure Solo will welcome him. But switching to solo until you can afford a revenge is just silly.

That definitely makes sense. Not sure if that's exactly what was happening here, and definitely not covered by my rant, but that makes sense at least. Rep also for being polite to me

 

[scorpyon]

Awesome!
Let me paraphrase my OP then:

I was griefed the other night.
I didnt react fast enough during the interdiction, so I submitted for fun.
i tried to talk with the chap, but he didn't respond and instead chose to attack straight away.
I wasnt kitted out for combat, so I had to try and flee. I didnt get away and was killed.
I decided to regroup with a much better combat vessel and hunt down my killer as is my right.


There we go!
You can apologise any time! ;-)

 

[Renegade Roach]

Almost seems like a debate of good vs. evil. One side is rigorously trying to defend the ability to kill other players with as few restrictions as possible, the other side trying to come up with as many restrictions as possible.


Both sides feel so passionate about it. I just wonder what it's like to be the other side. The side that is getting angry at people for being upset that they were killed by players under dodgy circumstances. You know...the dark side.

What is your deep seated value you are trying to protect here? Why is it you really really want to make sure it's ok to kill other players with as few limiting conditions as possible? What's your deep rooted motivation?

That's a serious question by the way.


I'm willing to admit that from my side, the deep seated root value is that I don't like the idea of people praying on people. I don't think it's nice, healthy, fun, a good atmosphere. I'm just not that kind of guy. I do like a good fight, with clear rules, with both sides in agreement - nothing vague or ambiguous. Nothing like "well if he didn't want to be killed he shouldn't have been flying in open in that sector where there is a power" or "he has no right to be upset that I killed him and made him lose 2 months of exploration data - he should have paid that 200cr bounty". I don't think you can justify that just because it's "allowed". It's fundamentally wrong, nasty behaviour in my opinion. Call me a softie, a goodie two shoes, a tree hugging hippie. Whatever you like.

I'll also admit that I've been killed by a couple of pirates for absolutely no reason other than I was weak and I'm angry and I overreact and am biased.

But what's YOUR motivation. Why do you want to defend this so passionately? Let's be honest here. Is it simply because one time you were called a greifer and you got so offended you are on a campaign, or is it because deep down you actually like hurting people? Or something I haven't thought of.

You seem to be misunderstanding a fundamental aspect of the game. This was a good fight with clear rules with both sides in agreement.... If you play in open and are signed up to a power you have stepped onto the playing field, end of story. You seem to be the one attempting to portray people as having unhealthy motives for simply playing the game as it is intended. You are attempting to place arbitrary moral codes onto a game where they are entirely unnecessary. It's a game, people chose their role and play it. As long as they are playing within the rules, not exploiting, not cheating and not being abusive then it's all good. If you have difficulty accepting how the game is played the issue is with you and not those you are trying to portray in a bad light.

- - - Updated - - -

Awesome!
Let me paraphrase my OP then:

I was griefed the other night.
I didnt react fast enough during the interdiction, so I submitted for fun.
i tried to talk with the chap, but he didn't respond and instead chose to attack straight away.
I wasnt kitted out for combat, so I had to try and flee. I didnt get away and was killed.
I decided to regroup with a much better combat vessel and hunt down my killer as is my right.


There we go!
You can apologise any time! ;-)

Very good, apart from the fact that you were not griefed although you have undoubtedly been deeply afflicted by grief after the fact

 

[stocko1111]

Awesome!
Let me paraphrase my OP then:

I was griefed the other night.
I didnt react fast enough during the interdiction, so I submitted for fun.
i tried to talk with the chap, but he didn't respond and instead chose to attack straight away.
I wasnt kitted out for combat, so I had to try and flee. I didnt get away and was killed.
I decided to regroup with a much better combat vessel and hunt down my killer as is my right.


There we go!
You can apologise any time! ;-)

You weren't griefed, you were attacked legitimately by another player as you showed as hostile to him. I understand what you're trying to say with your post but you shouldn't confuse people who are playing the game genuinely and those who are actually griefing.

 

[rckstr]

Awesome!
Let me paraphrase my OP then:

I was griefed the other night.
I didnt react fast enough during the interdiction, so I submitted for fun.
i tried to talk with the chap, but he didn't respond and instead chose to attack straight away.
I wasnt kitted out for combat, so I had to try and flee. I didnt get away and was killed.
I decided to regroup with a much better combat vessel and hunt down my killer as is my right.


There we go!
You can apologise any time! ;-)

This still does not change the hostile standing between you and the attacker caused by your decision to join a power and still there is no griefing involved.
How can you react to late to evade the interdiction but in the same time submit to the interdiction just for fun? as long as you are not in the drop animation you can do both. Let's pretend you where in SC at minimum speed you still had the chance to increase your speed though you had the notification about submitting in the top right corner.
After dropping out of SC through interdiction you really can not expect your interdictor starts to talk with you. Some might have a line they paste into the chat but starting to type causes you to loose time to flee or to start a strike.
Also you are able to high wake into a neighboring system to get away.
You still don't seem to understand what the "hostile" indicator means and also that while in open anything can happen. Even "unfair" situations. It is not your opponents fault that you are running in a Clipper without hardpoints, proper shields or chaff for example. As soon as i knew what i can do to handle or avoid an attack i always got away, even last night where i had about 10% hull and a broken canopy. Then i started to flee. I was in my vulture and my attacker in a FDL. Clearly the better ship for such situations. I jumped out with 7% hull and about 4 minutes of oxygen left and survived. I really don't know what your problem is except that you might not know what you can do in a hot situation.
Undocking with a different ship or setup is all fine after that, i had about 5 or even 7 skirmishes with my opponent that night.
I still have the opinion that you have not been griefed but rep for staying in game and not combat logging.
No reason to apologize on at least my side.

 

[Morbad]

But somehow this oter clipper is faster than mine even with 4 pips to Engines and repeated boosting. He's able to stay right on my tail and non stop firing. Which is obv nonsense anyway.

Obvious nonsense? Hardly.

Unless you are running A6 thrusters, an A6 distributor, and your total ship mass is less than 720T, you should expect to lose a race with any decent combat Clipper.

It's also possible to fire pretty potent weapons nearly continually with just two pips in WEP on an A6 distributor.

Chaff? Shields? FA off?

Even against another clipper with these three things you should be able to get a jump back into supercruise and away fairly easily

FA Off doesn't really make you faster and trying to enter SC in a lightly defended Clipper while a decently piloted combat clipper is hammering away at you will probably leave you heavily damaged, if not destroyed.

Much better to just jump to another system.

I was in a clipper. Kitted for trading but no cargo. So I should have been faster.

Again, unless you have better thrusters and a better distributor, you aren't going to be faster unless you are at or below half thruster optimal mass and your pursuer is above it.

720T is a lot of mass, and it's completely possible to cram a heavy combat loadout on to a Clipper without any reduction in speed.

Everyone has the ability to scan the other ship to see what modules it has. And everyone has the ability to type something. Opening fire without any kind of warning is kind of cowardly if you ask me

Interdicting someone is tantamount to shouting "if you aren't faster, or can't outfight me, you will lose your ship".

I normally submit to all interdictions, and unless I think I'm completely outclassed, I immediately attack, with the intent to destroy my interdictor's craft. If I am outclassed or the fight goes against me, I jump to another system. Regardless, there is zero time for hesitation, and I am often firing or boosting away before my opponent has finished loading the instance.

 

[Battleship Kickass]

I wonder if the moderators would have locked this thread if the title was, "Should have just turned on my unlimited shield and speed hack."

You can't even mention someone's in game alias in here without an edit, lock, or ban. Stop letting someone muse about whether he should have broken the ToS.

 

[scorpyon]

The other post said he was griefed. Maybepeople missed that bit.
Peeps then said that was the way the game should be played.

I'm just pointing out the inconsistency.
My OP never said I was griefed, by the way. It said "Yay a griefer" or words to that effect.
My paraphrase said it purely because that is what this other post stated that everyone claimed should be the way the game is played.
Fair enough if thats what people want. Personally I dont but thtats just me.

Im not arguing for arguments sake. THough it may sound like it. I am trying to point out that it shouldnt matter how you put something across. Instead, you should focus on what is being said and the facts.

Avoid snap judgments and misunderstandings.
I never claimed to be griefed. I just used it as a known-term for someone who attacks for no reason other than to cause someone furustration and irritation.
And just as someone said ealier, this is a legitimate thought, since in the same way that he ccouldnt have known what Clipper loadout i was runnning, I hav no way of knowing what sort of commander he is other than how he acts which was to ignore any communication and go straight to the pewpew, which unfortunately is the M.O. of a griefer.
Its a shame, but there have been enough of them to make this case knwon to everyone who has played rhis game for a reasonable amount of time.

- - - Updated - - -

I wonder if the moderators would have locked this thread if the title was, "Should have just turned on my unlimited shield and speed hack."

You can't even mention someone's in game alias in here without an edit, lock, or ban. Stop letting someone muse about whether he should have broken the ToS.

Ooh lookee!
Another poster who forgets to read the whole post/thread before commenting. I figred there would be at least one. Lol!

If you'd bothered, you would have reailised that the whole point was that Combat Logging wasn't even considered until as an after thought and even then was dismissed as being a non-option.
Do try and keep up, old chap...

 

[scorpyon]

This still does not change the hostile standing between you and the attacker caused by your decision to join a power and still there is no griefing involved.
How can you react to late to evade the interdiction but in the same time submit to the interdiction just for fun? as long as you are not in the drop animation you can do both. Let's pretend you where in SC at minimum speed you still had the chance to increase your speed though you had the notification about submitting in the top right corner.
After dropping out of SC through interdiction you really can not expect your interdictor starts to talk with you. Some might have a line they paste into the chat but starting to type causes you to loose time to flee or to start a strike.
Also you are able to high wake into a neighboring system to get away.
You still don't seem to understand what the "hostile" indicator means and also that while in open anything can happen. Even "unfair" situations. It is not your opponents fault that you are running in a Clipper without hardpoints, proper shields or chaff for example. As soon as i knew what i can do to handle or avoid an attack i always got away, even last night where i had about 10% hull and a broken canopy. Then i started to flee. I was in my vulture and my attacker in a FDL. Clearly the better ship for such situations. I jumped out with 7% hull and about 4 minutes of oxygen left and survived. I really don't know what your problem is except that you might not know what you can do in a hot situation.
Undocking with a different ship or setup is all fine after that, i had about 5 or even 7 skirmishes with my opponent that night.
I still have the opinion that you have not been griefed but rep for staying in game and not combat logging.
No reason to apologize on at least my side.

This has nothing to do with hostile statuses.
Hostile status was something you came up with and bandied about.
I never mentionedit in my OP.
I also didnt mention it in the post this was a reply to.

- - - Updated - - -

as for reacting to the interdiction,let me explain for you:

I reacted too late to avoid the interdiction attempt. Usually you can just swing around so they dont get behind you.
Instead, I didnt see the guy on the radar in time.
So he got the lock on me.
Rather than fight it, I submitted.
I prefer to do so, since I like to have a chance to interact withpirates /banter a bit before we do whatever we are going to do.
Thats why its a shame when people dont bother to interact.
If they dont want to talk to other people in the game,perhaps its they that should be in solo.
Just saying...

 

[rckstr]

The other post said he was griefed. Maybepeople missed that bit.
Peeps then said that was the way the game should be played.

I'm just pointing out the inconsistency.
My OP never said I was griefed, by the way. It said "Yay a griefer" or words to that effect.
My paraphrase said it purely because that is what this other post stated that everyone claimed should be the way the game is played.
Fair enough if thats what people want. Personally I dont but thtats just me.

Im not arguing for arguments sake. THough it may sound like it. I am trying to point out that it shouldnt matter how you put something across. Instead, you should focus on what is being said and the facts.

Avoid snap judgments and misunderstandings.
I never claimed to be griefed. I just used it as a known-term for someone who attacks for no reason other than to cause someone furustration and irritation.
And just as someone said ealier, this is a legitimate thought, since in the same way that he ccouldnt have known what Clipper loadout i was runnning, I hav no way of knowing what sort of commander he is other than how he acts which was to ignore any communication and go straight to the pewpew, which unfortunately is the M.O. of a griefer.
Its a shame, but there have been enough of them to make this case knwon to everyone who has played rhis game for a reasonable amount of time.

- - - Updated - - -



Ooh lookee!
Another poster who forgets to read the whole post/thread before commenting. I figred there would be at least one. Lol!

If you'd bothered, you would have reailised that the whole point was that Combat Logging wasn't even considered until as an after thought and even then was dismissed as being a non-option.
Do try and keep up, old chap...

...Err... What?!
Your title says "should have just combat logged". So this implies you have the opinion this is a good alternative.
And sure you are able to see what kind of cmdr is interdicting you. Simply press "highest threat" button and he is targeted for you during interdiction. In the bottom left corner you see his name, aligned to power and if he is because of this hostile or not.
The same after the interdiction. You can select him as a target and all the information is in front of you.
Also if you use the term griefer, you also express that griefing is involved. I am sure you don't call a BH a trader, do you?
Now you are circling around to find some arguments to defend your position instead of accepting that the attack on you was completely legit due to you and him being hostile to each other because of PP.

And really. I don't understand what you want to tell us with your last post. It is kinda... weird. (no insult)

 

[rckstr]

If they dont want to talk to other people in the game,perhaps its they that should be in solo.
Just saying...

I think sticking to your role is enough interaction. Sure, it is welcome if you can exchange a couple of words but i don't really expect that and the result wouldn't be much different.
Also i and probably the others here assumed that you and him where hostile to each other because you mentioned you will continue your PP work in Solo. That means that you are pledged and thus hostile to a lot of people.
I really would welcome a "quick chat" with predefined and maybe even custom lines to chose from. Also it would be a great addition if you could write while in the interdiction mini game, but we don't have this. Starting to type after an interdiction is loss of precious time that you maybe should use to get away instead of ranting about no response and being unable to get away after he started shooting.
All i can see is that you could have reacted different and started to rant about it without reason. The reactions to this should be proof enough for you to take into consideration that you are not right.

 

[Jognt]

To everyone saying that straight up shooting on sight is the same as what NPCs do:
NPCs always announce their intent in chat. You will know why he is firing at you before he even does it "Gimme your cargo" etc.

Just sayin..

NPCs are better at social interaction than the online-gaming-kids apparently. Online interaction with players = social interaction, deal with it and learn to behave like a normal person in society. Or expect other people to hunt you down.

 

[rckstr]

To everyone saying that straight up shooting on sight is the same as what NPCs do:
NPCs always announce their intent in chat. You will know why he is firing at you before he even does it "Gimme your cargo" etc.

Just sayin..

NPCs are better at social interaction than the online-gaming-kids apparently. Online interaction with players = social interaction, deal with it and learn to behave like a normal person in society. Or expect other people to hunt you down.

But on the other hand NPC's are able to "type the message" and control the ship at the same time. Also you might consider to take evasive action and try to type while you are running. But expecting a response while not moving is just silly. If the interdictor had the intention to just chat, he could have done this in SC.

 

[Roybe]

This is rubbish. Playing in Open doesn't mean flagging yourself up as someone else's plaything. It means you want to see other REAL players & maybe have some kind of non-hostile interaction with them. And as long as this kind of attitude persists there is no hope for co-operative play.

Co-operative play occurs BETWEEN the modes and WITHIN Private Group...not WITHIN Open. Open, flags you to be seen by all players...good and bad...moral and immoral.

If you want co-operative play Play with like minded people in Group...or work with shared goals from within solo.

Do not expect rainbows and unicorns in Open..the unicorns have been killed, gutted, and eaten..and the rainbows used as toilet paper to clean up the excretions the next day.

 

[Dave1029]

The problem lies with how easy interdiction is. The mini-game should heavily favor the one getting interdicted, not the interdictor.

 

[scorpyon]

Whelp! This was fun discussing this, but I'm going to get back to playing now I'm done working.
Thanks for the distraction eveyone!

 

[Ralph Vargr]

This is a good reason to not join a faction, OP. If you are a trader or a pirate, once you join one, you significantly limit your mobility. That's kind of counterproductive.

This is a major reason for not participating in Power Play.

 

[Chann3l]

There are always going to "bad" guys. There are bad NPCs that attack for no reason. Some players do the same and while I'm happy that most people choose to follow a code and not attack unless the other commander is an enemy or has a bounty or they are pirating , it is of course a choice. If you are 0ledged you assume the risks that come along with that.

 

[hoppingdeth]

I wonder if the moderators would have locked this thread if the title was, "Should have just turned on my unlimited shield and speed hack."

You can't even mention someone's in game alias in here without an edit, lock, or ban. Stop letting someone muse about whether he should have broken the ToS.

Lol! i got two posts on this thread removed with warnings about insulting or upsetting people!

actually, make that three....

 

[hoppingdeth]

To everyone saying that straight up shooting on sight is the same as what NPCs do:
NPCs always announce their intent in chat. You will know why he is firing at you before he even does it "Gimme your cargo" etc.

Just sayin..

NPCs are better at social interaction than the online-gaming-kids apparently. Online interaction with players = social interaction, deal with it and learn to behave like a normal person in society. Or expect other people to hunt you down.

im not a kid and i have no interest socializing or interacting with any cmdr i see as either flagged as wanted or flagged as a mission target. nor do i see any reason for giving then an explanation for my actions, but now it appears that this is wrong, and when interdicting and cmdr i am expected to have a cup of tea and slice of cake with them before doing anything, or being 'sportsman like' and allow them the time to give me a very bad day.

it's the wild west out there in ed land people. shoot first and then shoot again. that's what i say.