Sorry guys. It's the best I could do. I'm all for FD sending a poll to all commanders by email. What are our chances with that, do ya think?
The New Guilds and Player Owned Stations Discussion Thread.
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Sorry guys. It's the best I could do. I'm all for FD sending a poll to all commanders by email. What are our chances with that, do ya think?
Well I come from a "no to guilds" and powerplay has ruined my game" position. However Powerplay is not going anywhere so might as well make it work better, one day we will see a player influenced minor faction promoted to power, long way off though.
I would however, vote exactly the same as Cmdr Taimaru, Powlerplay desperately needs better organisation and comms tools, Morbius and other PVE groups could do with the same, or at least alluded to this on the laveradio cast a few months back. I continuously prune my friends list back to 10 cmdrs, just to manage it, so heck even I would gain from better organsation tools.
Having had a go at powerplay, it really is not for me. Our little area of space is now exploited by a power, I do not like it. However we prepared our systems for it occurring, and its affects were very negligible so back to making our chosen minor faction expand to a 4th system. I therefore have changed my opinion on Powerplay to "its not for me, but its affects are manageable".
Simon
I would however, vote exactly the same as Cmdr Taimaru, Powlerplay desperately needs better organisation and comms tools, Morbius and other PVE groups could do with the same, or at least alluded to this on the laveradio cast a few months back. I continuously prune my friends list back to 10 cmdrs, just to manage it, so heck even I would gain from better organsation tools.
Having had a go at powerplay, it really is not for me. Our little area of space is now exploited by a power, I do not like it. However we prepared our systems for it occurring, and its affects were very negligible so back to making our chosen minor faction expand to a 4th system. I therefore have changed my opinion on Powerplay to "its not for me, but its affects are manageable".
Simon
True MMO!
Are you a Scotsman?
No sorry, Scotland alone is a small, insignificant country with a tiny economy in a remote location.
The old-school, single-player oriented Elite fans were disturbed when they couldn't dominate the poll. So they blamed other things.
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The majority of the dev's seem to be old school Elite gamers. And the man himself definitely is, or this game wouldn't have been made.
How would you define true MMO and sandbox features.
I'm all for some form of player controlled stations and guilds/player groups (whichever way they would be called in Elite's universe). Even started a thread about it a few days ago outlining how I would imagine solo-players and guilds could coexist, which got merged into the old guild poll.
Key to coexistance in open imo, would be to keep jurisdiction managed by the game. No player or guild should ever be able to deny or grant permission to other players to access an area. Whoever simply doesn't want to see the existence of guilds, can play in group play or solo play. Individually deciding that somebody doesn't want guilds to interfer with their game is one thing, completely denying features to players who would like to group up in such a way is another thing.
Key to coexistance in open imo, would be to keep jurisdiction managed by the game. No player or guild should ever be able to deny or grant permission to other players to access an area. Whoever simply doesn't want to see the existence of guilds, can play in group play or solo play. Individually deciding that somebody doesn't want guilds to interfer with their game is one thing, completely denying features to players who would like to group up in such a way is another thing.
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You've got me all misty eyed (I'm serious. This is not sarcasm.). A lot of business plans need adjusting after release. Once the customers have feedback about the product. That is normal.
But, ultimately it's FD that will either stick by the original game or change the game under commander feed back.
Low. Since Frontier won't heed the results of polls. You can't throw away your existing development schedule due to a poll or a popularity contest.
They have probably planned months if not years in advance. Heeding feedback from the forum is one thing, totally succumbing to it is quite another.
Probably somewhere near nil. They'll do as they want, without any player input, as has been proven by Powerplay and CQC.
The other poll was valid only in the sense that it was a true(r) reflection of what the small amount of people who were invested in the game enough to bother to sign up and talk about it, were thinking at the time.
The point is this game will not survive for 10 years without deep MMO and player emergent content. Younger gamers want Guilds created and managed by players, player owned systems, share inventory, better communication to organize guild members, guild combat and diplomacy.
In Powerplay the major factions are all controlled by the developer, players are cogs in a wheel unable to become their own power.
Player owned Guilds and Systems add more long-term goals for players. Long-term commitment to build guilds and play Elite other than getting the best ship or shallow career paths. Interaction within and among guilds will be a lot more interesting and entertaining than the Major Factions.
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And you base this on absolutely nothing
I trust FD a lot more in this department than a random forum persona.
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Old School - Checked (and old - period)
Single Player - Yes I have played in Solo
Elite Fan - Definitely, otherwise I wouldn't be here
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I asked a question several times and never really got an answer. Apart from communication which has already been discussed and acknowledged by FD as needing improvement (well at least I hope they have acknowledged it), what do the players want to do as part of a guild with their own fortress, err Station:
(1) Play as a group - current mechanisms in the game limit an instance to 16 players, so will that be the maximum size of a Guild?
(2) Attack other guilds - see point (1), unless by mutual agreement you restrict it to 8v8, it will be a non event
(3) Trade with other guilds - You can't set prices for the commodities, so it is no difference to how it is now
(4) Have a Fleet - you can't share ships, you will still be restricted to whatever ship you own
(5) Run the station - you can try, but you can't do anything, you can't charge for fuel, ammo, modules, docking fees can you.
(6) Rule the Roost - well yes you can declare your little bit of space as yours alone and attack anyone who dares enter it
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So I am still bemused by what all those who are asking for Guilds and Guild owned Stations, just what will you do if you finally get it?
Ah, damn man, why didn't you say so sooner?! That's blinking scary! FD - get guilds in the game now or you will fail abysmally, Cosmo told me!
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Given that Open "belongs" to all players, a proportion of whom do not want Guilds to be implemented, to say that "Whoever simply doesn't want to see the existence of guilds, can play in group play or solo play." is rather selfish. A more equitable solution, if Guilds were ever to be implemented, would be to add an Open-Guild mode to the matchmaking system in which Guild features function. All players would have access to this mode, Guild affiliated or not, but, importantly, those who like Open as it is now would not need to move to a different mode to avoid Guilds.
Spend the rest of their playing lives paying for it, and wondering why they bought it in the first place. They wont even be able to sell it due to negative equity. At least us explorers will be able to come across abandoned stations.
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Given how niche ED is, I expect that the "younger gamers" will either play CQC on xbox or not play at all. Most who try will prang their Sideys a dozen times trying to take off, write the game off and go back to the latest mainstream game. The rest will appreciate ED for what it is, MS Flight Simulator in space.
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And you base this on absolutely nothing
I trust FD a lot more in this department than a random forum persona.
If they don't add deep sandbox and MMO features, players will have burned through the auto-generated content, gotten bored with it. Already 70% of players in friends lists are offline. They don't play anymore.
Only by allowing players to create their own content and fun together can an MMO game stay alive and grow for a decade or longer.
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I think this thread is going nowhere now, its just cycling arguments.
What i think is needed is for this to be closed and two new threads opening.
1) Would you like clans type functionality, and how do you think it should work? Written by someone with a good and well thought out idea of how clans could work within ED in a positive way (and not result in EvE style gankfests if possible) and let people discuss if they think its workable.
2) Would you like to see player owned stations and how do you think it should work? Written by someone with a good and well thought out idea of how player owned stations could work within ED in a positive way, etc.
Please note i say "a good and well thought out idea" - and i do mean this, not just "it would be cool" type mindset where people don't consider the knock on effects of adding something.
I'd also add an extra thought - the threads should be created by someone who is in general against the ideas!!! What?!?!?! i hear you cry! You never played that game where you argue for the thing you are against? It helps you clearly look at a thing from a different perspective and helps you spot the weaknesses and advantages from both sides. Also, when the inevitable people jump in being against the idea, if they start attacking the OP they can respond with "Hey, why you attacking me? I'm also against this!" In other words, it should help a slightly more rational discussion to be had.
Perhaps if mods would be willing to let this happen without a thread merge, i'd be willing to give it a shot. I'm not certain i can do it justice, but being in principle against it, but also used to playing devil's advocate, i'll do my best.
What i think is needed is for this to be closed and two new threads opening.
1) Would you like clans type functionality, and how do you think it should work? Written by someone with a good and well thought out idea of how clans could work within ED in a positive way (and not result in EvE style gankfests if possible) and let people discuss if they think its workable.
2) Would you like to see player owned stations and how do you think it should work? Written by someone with a good and well thought out idea of how player owned stations could work within ED in a positive way, etc.
Please note i say "a good and well thought out idea" - and i do mean this, not just "it would be cool" type mindset where people don't consider the knock on effects of adding something.
I'd also add an extra thought - the threads should be created by someone who is in general against the ideas!!! What?!?!?! i hear you cry! You never played that game where you argue for the thing you are against? It helps you clearly look at a thing from a different perspective and helps you spot the weaknesses and advantages from both sides. Also, when the inevitable people jump in being against the idea, if they start attacking the OP they can respond with "Hey, why you attacking me? I'm also against this!"
In other words, it should help a slightly more rational discussion to be had.Perhaps if mods would be willing to let this happen without a thread merge, i'd be willing to give it a shot. I'm not certain i can do it justice, but being in principle against it, but also used to playing devil's advocate, i'll do my best.
Trying for a common ground post. It's early in the day ... not truly awake yet, which makes me optimistic.
Player owned stations with total control have too many issues in the area of practical application, effort in development time and goes against the philosophy of Elite. So there's little chance of this idea happening.
There has been talk of owning a private station (inflatable asteroid thingy) which presumably you can upgrade to have either cosmetic or perhaps functional upgrades in it.
Could a cluster of these inflatable homes be a base for players who like to be aligned to each other? Suburban Guilds if you will. The management of your private station won't interfere with the economy, can be completely ignored by those who don't want anything to do with guilds and are already somewhere at least on a design sheet at Frontier Development.
Could this be a platform as a base of operation which would satisfy those who like to band together and be located close to each other?
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Player owned stations with total control have too many issues in the area of practical application, effort in development time and goes against the philosophy of Elite. So there's little chance of this idea happening.
There has been talk of owning a private station (inflatable asteroid thingy) which presumably you can upgrade to have either cosmetic or perhaps functional upgrades in it.
Could a cluster of these inflatable homes be a base for players who like to be aligned to each other? Suburban Guilds if you will. The management of your private station won't interfere with the economy, can be completely ignored by those who don't want anything to do with guilds and are already somewhere at least on a design sheet at Frontier Development.
Could this be a platform as a base of operation which would satisfy those who like to band together and be located close to each other?
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As I said, baseless assumption. Thanks for illustrating my point
Docking and undocking isn't that hard. I don't think that many players destroy there Sidewinder while trying to undock.
Lol, I did....
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