Unknown Artefact (or artifact) Community Thread - The Canonn

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The French. You never know what they will do next :)

There has been a lot of talk about the Wings trailer.
I think it may actually be full of hints.

California sector = New California
Cmdr Jameson = Jameson's Rock
Cmdr Kurtz = The Hart of Darkness

There is probably more, but I'm going by memory. I don't have the Band Width to watch the trailer.

The rest of the Cmdr names would be nice to have ;-)

Yeah, I have watched it now numerous times to see of there's anything in there - nothing jumping out, but like I said a few days ago, lateral thought isn't my strong point. But I am an inveterate conspiracy theorist - a trait I've tried very to suppress for this puzzle, because that way lies space madness!

Edit ... I jumped the gun - should've watched it properly! @Allitnil nailed it above.
 
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UA Wing:
Ishmael (has the UA)
Kohl (killed)
Halligan
Jameson (late to arrive)

Attack wing:
Flint (first killed)
unknown (second killed)
Vengar (third killed)

Others:
West - on Ishmael's friends list but not invited to wing
Sephirius (?) - shown as coming online in Ishmael's chat log (seen when his canopy gets breached)

I didn't see any mention of a CMDR Kurtz.

nb: Ishmael has his canopy blown out whilst still some 900 LY from Leonard Nimoy station and is shown as having only 4m09s of oxygen left. So he never made it there unless the UA is actually a life support module (possible clue??)

Thanks. I will read on.
 
So the thing yesterday.

i'll just put up all the info and people can make their own minds up...

Every now and then people will say well the purrs cant be random because there's never a string of three consecutive highs/lows. My reply is well there's a difference between true-random and pseudo-random, the bulk of ED is procedurally generated and it would not surprise me if they just have a few api calls that pull numbers from procedurally generated pools.

Of course this is just guess work, we have no idea how Frontier go about generating pseudo-random (if indeed this is what they do).

But then last night this appeared, it's about turrets of all things....

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=160794&p=2456434&viewfull=1#post2456434

Specifically this :

There's then a semi-random harmonic oscillator (summation of a handful of sine waves with different frequencies/amplitudes) that's multiplied by the current level of confusion to work out how much to delay the tracking by (whenever the oscillator outputs low numbers the weapon catches back up to its target - this is one of the changes that came in 1.3). There's a second 2-dimensional oscillator that applies the minor continuous wobble that gimbals share. Once this direction is figure out we go into the shared AimAtTarget code to do its thing.

Let that sink in for a sec.

To generate something random they take add a number of differing sine waves together then adjust for whatever is required.

It seems to fit perfectly.

This for me explains why we never see groups of three or more, yet there's no apparent pattern.

If you don't know what I'm talking about it's this sort of thing :

pic7_10.gif


That's a simple example but two sine(ish) waves combining into a third wave. Of course Frontier's will be out of sync so less regular but the point is there will be a semi-regular oscillating pattern there.


At this point I'm thinking that has to be it, but is it provable?

So my line of thinking is, well if we graph the points can we visually see this effect?

And here's the result, this is the high/low state and the time of each purr :

Screenshot%202015-07-18%2013.57.41.png


+1 = high -1 = low.

The zeros (the orange ones) are where there would be purrs but theyre missing or quietened, the gaps, those would be either a 1 or a -1, I've just set them to zero.

It's hard to be exact as the zeros change the curve but roughly it almost looks like two waves, a faster one and another maybe half the wavelength.


And given the pattern is essentially a combination of 2 or more sine waves my thinking was it may actually now be possible to infer the missing purrs.

Here's a Google spreadsheet, feel free to mess, the idea was I can drop 1 or -1 into the orange zero bits to "rebuild" the wave and therefore find the missing purrs. For example in the above I think you can say with a high certainty that at least one of the 3rd/4th 0 points would be a -1.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hYabz1D5HUsmj45kl0gdr_7aCMoqKspwHGwcZDyvA4E/edit?usp=sharing

^^ On this it seemed a good idea at 4:30am this morning! Today I'm not sure it's doable though. Still too much guesswork but it's fun to try and see what comes out - give it a go! Add in the missing 1,-1s.

There's also something called fourier analysis which takes data points and tells you what combination of waves would produce the pattern (and could therefore possibly fill in the missing purrs) but that's way beyond my ability.


So yeah that's it, make your own minds up, I might be wrong but the above combined with the evidence showing that it looks like CMDRs hear differing purrs :

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=162998&p=2541551&viewfull=1#post2541551

I think is a pretty strong argument that the purrs are pseudo-randomly generated, separately on each CMDRs ED client, from an algorithm with is essentially a combination of two or more sine waves.

I don't want to completely write the purrs off because there may still be something in them but I think if there is something to see there, then it will be something common to all CMDRs viewing a given UA. (cycle length for example)



Addendum....

So on from that and a little bit madcap. There's another theory which I think's interesting, is rather unlikely but would be very cool and could be another way to fill in the missing purrs.

It goes like this....

Assuming the purrs are generated from a pseudo-random generator as described above, and we KNOW the the turrets wavering motion is pseudo-randomly generated (since a dev has explicitly said so).

Then are the purrs and the turrets using the SAME generator or different ones?

Heh, do you see where I'm going?

It may be possible (but I think really unlikely) that the wavering of a turret's targeting reticule may align with the high/lows of the purrs. =p And that when the purrs go silent the turret (like a compass) will tell us what they would have been. =p

:rolleyes:

I've finally lost it haven't I.
 
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I vaguely remember this on the old sound analysis thread bitstorm.
I also remember it got either ignored or shot down.

Now the main issue I can see here is that there would be a reproducible, repeating cadence to the waveform. The problem is that you'd need a LOT of recording of the same UA in the same place to get a recording long enough.
In theory you could generate a waveform based on observed data so far and extrapolate it forward until it repeats. Then record a long chunk of UA sound, and try to see where it appears or fits in along the generated waveform.

That's all well and good, but if it's not encoding information, then what is the practical outcome of this? What can we learn apart from an idea of how the soundscape is constructed in the game code?
 
:rolleyes:

I've finally lost it haven't I.

Yes, indeed :D
I'm not the only one, it seems...

BTW, I agree with you that FD may be using the same pseudo randomizing algorithms in the whole game. Once you have one, ti goes ok in every situation...
 
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I vaguely remember this on the old sound analysis thread bitstorm.
I also remember it got either ignored or shot down.

Now the main issue I can see here is that there would be a reproducible, repeating cadence to the waveform. The problem is that you'd need a LOT of recording of the same UA in the same place to get a recording long enough.
In theory you could generate a waveform based on observed data so far and extrapolate it forward until it repeats. Then record a long chunk of UA sound, and try to see where it appears or fits in along the generated waveform.

That's all well and good, but if it's not encoding information, then what is the practical outcome of this? What can we learn apart from an idea of how the soundscape is constructed in the game code?

Well the only practical application is checking something off the list, or at least lowering it's priority. It's why I was saying I was a bit sad to uncover it all.

It just means the 65% I was at, 65% that there's nothing in the purrs high/low pattern, has gone up to 90 odd% and so I am less likely to spend time looking at them and therefore perhaps more time spent looking at something else, something I think more likely to be actually solveable.

Trying to predict missing purrs is just something to do for a bit of fun really, it's not required, it's just exploring the theory, half the fun has been looking at things, trying to piece things together and coming up with practical ways to prove/show hypotheses. ie The turret thing would be an amazing to behold, albeit I think really bloody unlikely. =p
 
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No that's it, there is no practical outcome beyond ticking something off the list, or at least lowering it's priority. It's why I was saying I was a bit sad to uncover it all.

That was almost clear to me even before (about the Purrs)...
I'm sticking to the "listen", and "not everybody will get it" hints right now.
It is related to something that not everybody knows, that means that some conditions are to be met:

1) You "get" it only from a particular ship? The Orca theory. BTW I've listened to some Orca's and Whale's sounds, and really, they are very different from the Howls. Very. However we should try to listen to the UA from every ship in game I think.
2) It has something to do with Elite Universe lore? So, only someone who knows about it can "get" it?
3) It has some connection with a sound from a movie (Sci-fi I think) or something similar and, obviously, not everybody has seen it.
4) It has something to do with audible frequencies? I don't think so BTW
5) Must be something already in game since 1.2 release, remember? The Wings release. Has it something to do with Wings?

In a few days I'll be in my beautiful Sicily, in front of its gorgeous turquoise sea, so I'll have an ideal position to let my mind "fly"... ;)
 
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Hi! Even though I have been on the forums since late 2013, this is actually my first post. To me, this thread is one of the most exciting to follow yet. Thank you!

I was looking around for any previous discussions or thoughts regarding the eight "claws" present in the pattern on top of the "head" of the artefact. Considering the amount of research that has already been done on these things, I assume this claw-like pattern has already been discussed. The thing is, I could not find any relevant mentions of it using neither Google nor the forum search features, and it is not mentioned on the wiki.

Could someone kindly point me in the right direction?

(Since I did not "find" this pattern until just a few days ago, I guess there could be others out there who have yet to notice it. You can see it quite clearly in this video by Ratking15. The best still image I have found is the last one in mrtree's post #1955 in this thread, though it is somewhat dark.)
 
I suggest comparing audio recordings of the same UA drop from multiple commanders.

It would show which parts of the sound are varying, may show which parts are proceedurally generated flavor and perhaps even highlight parts which have not received attention.

If the experimental team could do this in two or three different star systems some distance apart, that could be helpful too.
 
Hi! Even though I have been on the forums since late 2013, this is actually my first post. To me, this thread is one of the most exciting to follow yet. Thank you!

I was looking around for any previous discussions or thoughts regarding the eight "claws" present in the pattern on top of the "head" of the artefact. Considering the amount of research that has already been done on these things, I assume this claw-like pattern has already been discussed. The thing is, I could not find any relevant mentions of it using neither Google nor the forum search features, and it is not mentioned on the wiki.

Could someone kindly point me in the right direction?

(Since I did not "find" this pattern until just a few days ago, I guess there could be others out there who have yet to notice it. You can see it quite clearly in this video by Ratking15. The best still image I have found is the last one in mrtree's post #1955 in this thread, though it is somewhat dark.)

Some of us think that they will "open", in some particular conditions, revealing the content inside the "head".
That will lead us to the next step of the Mystery.
 
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There talk through that the players will decided which track we will be on when we encounter Thargoids. It also possible that we will encounter a different branch of Thargoids that won't be peaceful, whilst still allying ourselves with Oresrian.

Those would be the Klaxians. Among others, perhaps. ;-)

As to FD's intention for players to decide how the latest Thargoid contact goes, it would be interesting to see how that works out in practice. The very first person to encounter them sets the tone for reaction? Or some sort of CG with war and peace sides? Missions with alternate ending possibilities, that are tracked by FD and after a certain period of time the results are tallied up to see if it is war or peace? In any case, they need to have a baseline of where things are at before that happens for context, presumably based on some combination of the new and old lore. Unless they intend to just ignore it all, which is also possible - but would annoy a lot of people.
 
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I was looking around for any previous discussions or thoughts regarding the eight "claws" present in the pattern on top of the "head" of the artefact. Considering the amount of research that has already been done on these things, I assume this claw-like pattern has already been discussed. The thing is, I could not find any relevant mentions of it using neither Google nor the forum search features, and it is not mentioned on the wiki.

Could someone kindly point me in the right direction?

(Since I did not "find" this pattern until just a few days ago, I guess there could be others out there who have yet to notice it. You can see it quite clearly in this video by Ratking15. The best still image I have found is the last one in mrtree's post #1955 in this thread, though it is somewhat dark.)

Welcome to the barmy theory society! :)
You've raised a fair point, and I'm not discounting anything you've suggested. I've not heard much about that part of the UA either.

My opinion is that it is an opening. 4 "petals" folded over keeping SOMETHING in? Think of the top of one of the eggs in Alien or Aliens for comparison.

Now this could tie in with the "let it die" suggestions. We know that at the point of 0%, a UA will scream, blow dust/spores/confetti from the 12 "pods" and flash. The flash is the bit that the "let it die" people want to see more clearly. Perhaps the 4 petals flip open at that instant of the flash?

In fact that's a point I'll leave standing with everyone. How will we know we've done what we need to do with the UA's? Will the "head" open up?
 
Some of us think that they will "open", in some particular conditions, revealing the content inside the "head".
That will lead us to the next step of the Mystery.
Has anyone tried shooting it at the moment it lights up and howls? Something timed?
If we assume that they will open and they do that based on interaction, perhaps that interaction has to happen at the right moment?

(Sort of triggered by the opening bit and that CQC has doors that only open when shot at)
 
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Hi All,

Another possible crackpot theory, so bear with me:

I've been thinking (dangerous I know) and I keep coming back to asking myself "why does the UA need to know where it is?" or "what purpose is in having a morse signal telling anyone nearby which body is closest?" - I thought on the following explanations by trying to guess the UA's purpose (any of these could be valid but I was trying to rate theories based on likelihood):

1. Its a delivery device for something nasty or good - not likely as anyone delivering goodness or nastiness would likely have a target in mind and either take the object there themselves or have it guide itself under its own propulsion. We haven't seen evidence of this other then its being transported when found by Federal Navy ships and from their chatter they are as mystified by the UA as we are seemingly, or they would have some kind of protection against its ill effects.

2. Its some kind of transmitter - could be but I'm not convinced its transmitting over interstellar distances, as a. it would have to contain a dirty great big power source and b.would likely have to be pointing in the right direction to whoever the transmission is intended for. A directional signal doesn't seem to feature in any of the observed behavior I have read about. This is interesting as it would indicate the Morse (or other signals in the noises it makes) are intended for local observers i.e. somebody who has "found it". Also some noises are only audible when you are close to it.

3. Its a homing beacon - again not likely, as we would either have to have the right equipment on board our ships or be able to get the right equipment in order to locate the UA in space (outside of someone's hold).

4. Its a locating device or map (somewhat inferred by the SAP8 description) - now this one does seem to fit. When you go to a tourist attraction covering a wide area you tend to see a map on a board and one thing they nearly all have is "YOU ARE HERE" with an arrow so you can more easily orientate yourself to the various locations on it.

5. Its a treasure map - now this got me a little excited, but I lack the time and/or skills (UA of course) to work this one through - you have your starting position (YOU ARE HERE) and the destination is coded somehow in the form of direction and distance (or vice versa) - a bit like the old 6 paces to the north and 8 paces to the west. As the UA gives out a location in morse based on an object in a system, it would seem logical that the direction and distance pointer is also in the same system, but it could be interstellar (or both even, so you have coords to the system and then coords from the main star to the location). The bit that troubles me is the purrs are different dependent on the observer, so there might be something in that or could be the purrs are the distance and relative to the current observer's orientation. Also the SAP8's alter the Purrs, so that could also be relevant i.e. interstellar coords from "no SAPs" and in system coords from 8 or more SAPs.

Enough rambling methinks.......
 
Has anyone tried shooting it at the moment it lights up and howls? Something timed?
If we assume that they will open and they do that based on interaction, perhaps that interaction has to happen at the right moment?

(Sort of triggered by the opening bit and that CQC has doors that only open when shot at)

I like it!

UA bearers please, can you try it with a lot of caution? Just a single short shot from a small pulse, for example.
Shooting at it in the "mouth", better when it lights up.
 
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Also the SAP8's alter the Purrs, so that could also be relevant

I think the jury's still out on this one tbh.

I also can;t help thinking it would be good to see another "two CMDRs one UA" video to confirm that the purrs do indeed to change for each CMDR, it's only been tested once, and well y'know, bugs.
 
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--snip--
If your sighting the day before the drama yesterday :)D) was really also a convoy in SC that would be a great changing to find some convoy's.
Stated today it is not sure if that happend in the wild or only if player follow (like yesterday).
Can you at least remember if the text was in "red" ? Also here: not really sure about the colours in Wing/Solo. Can only point to my picture.
But in the end like CMDR Lurius yesterday: player has in fact done no action (maybe one scan), only follow.
If Frontier here has change something we will have a lot sightings next day's ... But "not UA addicted CMDR" would ignore it like the "wedding barge".

Though I think my mind could be playing tricks on me, I'm pretty sure the text was in 'red' and also a DIRECT rather than a LOCAL message. Without that dang screenshot this could be me twisting things though.

The text was I'm pretty sure this:

Convoy dialogue snippet.PNG

Immediately followed by the normal text encountered in a gold trap. Just the once, and I did take time to check for the originating name given in the direct, but they weren't amongst the ships that were by that time starting to shoot me to bits. I think this is why I failed to get a screenshot to be honest, being confused by this and getting heavily shot at while still not running away...

I have also no clue about the possible "spawn area" as the most other CMDR's. Thats why many are go again to Timocani. Because: seems to work ... :D

I've been having a hunt around elsewhere, but noticed there are two locations with unconfirmed (but look legitimate) sightings of the UA convoy with their dialogue that are I don't think mentioned in the wiki:


Haven't checked their proximity to any of the other confirmed and unconfirmed locations as of yet, and I don't recall the Imperial Convoy sighting being discussed before (though there's a lot to recall tbh). I do recall Michael Brookes early on saying they were in 'regions' of space.

So as you definitly talk about a "low wake" SSS you entered: Naval convoy was there and you simple have not seen him? "A" sensors (I change extra to "A" for hunt all the time)?
"A" because: If follow convois that enter "low wake" ( have posted here before. a few first times convoy/T9 was not to find. Some generalized this instantly: they disappear! ->nuts)
___ have found it out as I next time flew a big round as nothing was there and: T9 was there and headed in opposite direction counterpart outpost. Can depend how long CMDR need to enter wake.
--snip--
I can confirm a big, big delay in contact list often. I ramm mostly Cobras before target rectangle fit and the entry came up.
I have noticed this delay before also, and can recall several times seeing comms chatter still appearing for a short while that was from the supercruise instance just exited. It could be either - that the named originator was further out in the normal space instance beyond my sensor range (not currently running A sensors, but will do so from now), or that it 'carried over' from the exit of the supercruise instance.

Of course, I freely admit that without evidence this could be my mind playing tricks on me adding in details that weren't there, having spent so long searching - but there was something odd about it and it seemed related. I definitely did get comms that was not originated by the gold trap crowd though, mentioning system failures.

An aside - has anyone ever managed to get a cargo scan of any gold trappers? I've always assumed they were just there to attack and nothing else, but wondered if anyone had (you'll need good shield-cell skills I would think to pull it off) to see what they are carrying. Not likely in my opinion, but haven't seen it mentioned.

I also signed up during the kickstarter campaign, but only started posting recently - so be aware my posts are sometimes still hitting the moderation queue and taking a while to show up.

My ign is CMDR Timsk, seeing as we're collecting names. See you out there!
 
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