Oculus Rift SDK update

[Yololo69]

They are real people and not robots: Give some times to FD to study the new SDK 0.7.0.0 to know how much work they need to adapt ED. If it's too heavy they will probably wait another version (or "final" 1.0). If it's easy they will probably proceed with 0.7.0.0 (or 0.6.0.1 for compatibility).

 

[Darkmark07]

They are real people and not robots: Give some times to FD to study the new SDK 0.7.0.0 to know how much work they need to adapt ED. If it's too heavy they will probably wait another version (or "final" 1.0). If it's easy they will probably proceed with 0.7.0.0 (or 0.6.0.1 for compatibility).

Aaaargh! The voice of reason and common sense! Internet fora are not ready for such radical thinking - get thee behind me satan!

I want answers, I want them now. I want everything to work IMMEDIATELY with my development kit with all the latest hardware, software and operating systems without fail and without issues. I am entitled to this because it's really important that I am able to play a GAME in virtual reality. I cannot live my REAL LIFE without this. It is FD's responsibility to make this work RIGHT NOW otherwise I'll cry / stop playing / whine about it incessantly.

^ for absolute clarity, the paragraph above is ironic but only faintly more ridiculous than some of the whining on here. Seriously people - it's a nice to have feature in a GAME. It's not a cure for cancer and it won't bring about world peace. Some of you really need to get some perspective.

On a more serious note, it would be nice to get a clear, unequivocal response from FD about what the immediate (0-9 months) future holds for us VR users but it's really unreasonable to expect them to support a small (but clearly passionate) minority of users with a potentially significant amount of development time to support an operating environment which will change significantly in the time period mentioned.

 

[Raptoyd]

Aaaargh! The voice of reason and common sense! Internet fora are not ready for such radical thinking - get thee behind me satan!

I want answers, I want them now. I want everything to work IMMEDIATELY with my development kit with all the latest hardware, software and operating systems without fail and without issues. I am entitled to this because it's really important that I am able to play a GAME in virtual reality. I cannot live my REAL LIFE without this. It is FD's responsibility to make this work RIGHT NOW otherwise I'll cry / stop playing / whine about it incessantly.

^ for absolute clarity, the paragraph above is ironic but only faintly more ridiculous than some of the whining on here. Seriously people - it's a nice to have feature in a GAME. It's not a cure for cancer and it won't bring about world peace. Some of you really need to get some perspective.

On a more serious note, it would be nice to get a clear, unequivocal response from FD about what the immediate (0-9 months) future holds for us VR users but it's really unreasonable to expect them to support a small (but clearly passionate) minority of users with a potentially significant amount of development time to support an operating environment which will change significantly in the time period mentioned.

Hey Darkmark, stuff your commentary you are an expert on nothing except yourself. Do not keep trying to read more into a simple statement than what is there. Asking for a simple we are working on it rather than complete silence except for the few know it all's like yourself is pathetic. I have a development kit, thanks for pointing that out again but not even what we are talking about. I will not support or pre-order anything from FD until they acknowledge what they are doing. The fund raising campaign is over so find a new hobby guy. You must really think very highly of yourself, loner?

 

[negatron99]

When the Game was sold to us on the Kickstarter it was sold to many of us that it would support the Oculus. An Oculus that was still in Beta. So quite a few of us bought into this.

So, they were selling some of us something on the back of a product that was in beta. Ok. So, it's going to be upgraded. It's going to obviously be unstable, and it's not unreasonable to expect people also upgrade the beta product as time goes.

I keep hearing how easy it was for them, almost minutes, to add in the version of VR support they currently have for the Oculus. However, there seems to be some great difficulty in getting the later versions in. This feels like it was a great hack to get the initial version in there. Slap the code in, "meh, it works, that'll do" kind of attitude, forget about it and ignore everyone who is now complaining, who is actually trying to use the Oculus for, I don't know, other things.

The same problem with Windows 10. It's not like there was any kind of warning it was coming or anything... none at all, it just appeared magically on our machines one day. I was as shocked as everyone else. (sorry about the sarcasm).

Either the devs have actually stopped development altogether on VR, or they just don't actually feel like they owe the people who actually paid them money for it any more.

It IS their responsibility to fix the issue with the development kit, Darkmark, they linked the Beta libraries into their code and failed to maintain it when things changed.

 

[ranix]

the VR in Elite is too well done to have been slapped together in 5 minutes. You should see some other VR implementations in other games. Go try Assetto Corsa right now

 

[Darkmark07]

Hey Darkmark, stuff your commentary you are an expert on nothing except yourself. Do not keep trying to read more into a simple statement than what is there. Asking for a simple we are working on it rather than complete silence except for the few know it all's like yourself is pathetic. I have a development kit, thanks for pointing that out again but not even what we are talking about. I will not support or pre-order anything from FD until they acknowledge what they are doing. The fund raising campaign is over so find a new hobby guy. You must really think very highly of yourself, loner?

If you don't like what FD are doing, you're doing the right thing by voting with your wallet. What I'm trying to point out is simply that resources are limited and supporting a few early adopters and their desire to run latest versions of SDKs / VR-ready drivers and so on is not high on their priorities list, especially with significant changes on the horizon in the near future with the release of the consumer-ready kit.

If you read my post to the end you'll see that I too want an answer from FD regarding what their plan are between now and the launch of the CV1, however I'm rather more laid back about it than you are.

It's great that you're so passionate about it but perhaps you need to see it for what it is - it is just a game. It doesn't really matter in the great scheme of things.

 

[Yololo69]

And people can't compare quickly implementing using extended mode; which mean basically (no offense devs), display a side by side 3D picture in a buffer and call the tracking API, with the Direct Mode API which is clearly a different and specific way now to reach the screen device. This is not maintenance, this is a complete rewrite of nearly all VR output functions...

 

[Darkmark07]

When the Game was sold to us on the Kickstarter it was sold to many of us that it would support the Oculus. An Oculus that was still in Beta. So quite a few of us bought into this.

So, they were selling some of us something on the back of a product that was in beta. Ok. So, it's going to be upgraded. It's going to obviously be unstable, and it's not unreasonable to expect people also upgrade the beta product as time goes.

I keep hearing how easy it was for them, almost minutes, to add in the version of VR support they currently have for the Oculus. However, there seems to be some great difficulty in getting the later versions in. This feels like it was a great hack to get the initial version in there. Slap the code in, "meh, it works, that'll do" kind of attitude, forget about it and ignore everyone who is now complaining, who is actually trying to use the Oculus for, I don't know, other things.

The same problem with Windows 10. It's not like there was any kind of warning it was coming or anything... none at all, it just appeared magically on our machines one day. I was as shocked as everyone else. (sorry about the sarcasm).

Either the devs have actually stopped development altogether on VR, or they just don't actually feel like they owe the people who actually paid them money for it any more.

It IS their responsibility to fix the issue with the development kit, Darkmark, they linked the Beta libraries into their code and failed to maintain it when things changed.

Refreshing to read a reasoned post that isn't littered with frothing insults

I would take slight issue with the Windows 10 point. As far as I know, ED works perfectly with Windows 10. The problem for us VR users is that Oculus failed to have a fully compatible SDK available in time for launch. This is not FD's fault, nor is it something that they had much control over.

What remains to be seen is what they will do to shift to the new SDK, and this is what it would be good to have some information about. That said, it's only been a few days for them to assess the effort involved and therefore decide what their stance is (which they will hopefully communicate).

I'm still a bit surprised about the angst here. I understand that many of you use the rift for other things but it's reasonably trivial to have a dual- or even triple-boot machine so you can run different OSs and SDKs to support whatever combinations you need.

Of course, it's up to you to decide whether or not ED and VR is worth the effort involved in doing this. FD have, at least, made a clear statement about what is currently supported - again it would be nice to hear a little more about what their plans are for the next few months.

Once again, it's a matter of prioritising dev time. With all that's going on at the moment and it's not massively difficult to understand why it's not a priority at the moment.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

As usual I am on the fence on this one - despite the fact that i wont play ED out of VR.

1 thing i would say, whilst it is true that right now the number of people playing in VR is a drop in the ocean, DB himself claimed that at least 10% of KS backers were playing in VR.

so whilst it is a tiny %age of current gamers, it is a significant (imo) %age of people who actually helped get the game off the ground.

I STILL sympathise that its not the highest priority, but I still think a dialogue with us VR guys is not too much to ask. Yes I know they said no promises etc etc but there was still a lot of vagueness in their post. did they mean no promises for 0.7, or did they mean no chance for 0.7 and no promises for 1.0?

it is not too much to ask for a post from someone at FD telling us if rift support is now fully on the back burner until SDK 1.0 where they may get back to it, OR if they are still *actively* working with oculus on getting direct mode working with 0.7 and if so if there is a chance even it will be "soon" or not.

 

[dementia]

I don't think FD are likely to drop support for VR as that would be crazy considering how much better the game is in VR and that it was prominently shown off at the launch event. I can however understand why FD might not be wanting to expend development effort on integration when Oculus themselves are still trying to work out how to make it all work. The shift to 0.7+ was quite dramatic SDK wise so FD would be wise to wait and see what happens.

From a purely selfish perspective, all I care about is that it doesn't stop working as I too am very unlikely to play ED without VR. Once you've stepped into the light it is hard to go back!

I'm sure the team are fully focussed on the up and coming Horizons beta launch and all that comes with that.

 

[Ancipital]

I would take slight issue with the Windows 10 point. As far as I know, ED works perfectly with Windows 10. The problem for us VR users is that Oculus failed to have a fully compatible SDK available in time for launch. This is not FD's fault, nor is it something that they had much control over.

I have my doubts about this excuse. It's funny how whenever the runtime is updated, other developers, even smaller developers, seem to be able to access the necessary resources and release an update. I'm now in a situation where I have to decide if I'd rather (for example) play Eurotruck and similar, which require properly updated runtimes, or ED, which requires me to deliberately not upgrade.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

I have my doubts about this excuse. It's funny how whenever the runtime is updated, other developers, even smaller developers, seem to be able to access the necessary resources and release an update. I'm now in a situation where I have to decide if I'd rather (for example) play Eurotruck and similar, which require properly updated runtimes, or ED, which requires me to deliberately not upgrade.

ED runs fine on SDK6.0 - not quite as good as in 5, but its almost the same.
ETS2 ALSO works brilliant in it - WAY better than 5, as does fly inside FSX.

from what i can tell, at the moment for gamers not devs, SDK6.0 is the sweetspot for the best experience in VR in the biggest number of games.

i imagine this will change fairly soon however.

 

[Ancipital]

ED runs fine on SDK6.0 - not quite as good as in 5, but its almost the same.
ETS2 ALSO works brilliant in it - WAY better than 5, as does fly inside FSX.

from what i can tell, at the moment for gamers not devs, SDK6.0 is the sweetspot for the best experience in VR in the biggest number of games.

i imagine this will change fairly soon however.

Mmm, ED broke for me when I went to 0.6, and FD themselves advise using 0.5. ETSL2 looks amazing in it, though, I do agree. It shouldn't be as fun as it is.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Mmm, ED broke for me when I went to 0.6, and FD themselves advise using 0.5. ETSL2 looks amazing in it, though, I do agree. It shouldn't be as fun as it is.

thats unfortunate. I know the official stance is do not use SDK6, however I can only say what i have experienced myself. I finally cracked as i wanted to play ETS2 and was delighted when ED carried on working as before, with just an ever so slight FPS hit.

 

[Ancipital]

thats unfortunate. I know the official stance is do not use SDK6, however I can only say what i have experienced myself. I finally cracked as i wanted to play ETS2 and was delighted when ED carried on working as before, with just an ever so slight FPS hit.

For what it's worth, I don't begrudge you that, one bit

 

[goettel]

VR support for Elite has been half-$ssed for a long time now. Maybe you guys can finally start to take your promises on this front seriously.

 

[Lestenio]

I have my doubts about this excuse. It's funny how whenever the runtime is updated, other developers, even smaller developers, seem to be able to access the necessary resources and release an update. I'm now in a situation where I have to decide if I'd rather (for example) play Eurotruck and similar, which require properly updated runtimes, or ED, which requires me to deliberately not upgrade.

I think you serverly misunderstand how much the 0.7 runtime has changed with the introduction of the new direct to rift architecture. ED runs in extended more so there is significant work there. I assume Euro Truck Sim ran in direct mode which more likely made the porting task much easier.

As I said before. Nowhere have FD said they are dropping support or even reducing support. All they have said is don't upgrade yet. Honestly some of you are making a mounting of a mole hill.

Look how quickly they fixed the DK2 CQC bug. Does that really sound like a company that isn't continuing to support a DEVELOPER PREVIEW product?

 

[Raptoyd]

VR support for Elite has been half-$ssed for a long time now. Maybe you guys can finally start to take your promises on this front seriously.

Agreed at least speak to the fact

 

[Ankah]

I ran ED in direct up until a month ago and it runs fine in Direct

ED runs in extended more so there is significant work there. I assume Euro Truck Sim ran in direct mode which more likely made the porting task much easier.

 

[Popopinsel]

Come on FD, please give us support for 0.7 Runtime, I know you can do it!