The Star Citizen Thread v 3.0

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SC fans were very aggressive long before DS came along.
Just go to the SC forums and find some of the first posts critisizing AC flight mechanics.
The subreddit was better in the beginning but since the DS drama, it has also started going downhill as far as fans vs critics is concerned.

It probably has to do with so many people being critical of the project. Fans overreact to overacting critics and vice versa.

I've never seen so much vitriol as far as a game is concerned and I was playing EvE for years and years.
There is that part of the community yes, that's why i don't engage, i on all games i play, am a lurker. Because i'm a supporter but also a critic that's just not the best place, there is quite the criticism on the forums towards the game/CIG but the aggressive attitudes end up on different views of several points of something that is being developed. It scaled to ridiculous levels when the project started being attacked constantly, and people who didn't agree or defended the project were called "Deluded Cultists", that brought hell. But honestly i see one kind of "Cult" to Hate on the game as well, like when i saw Derek Smart re-posting tweets of SC fans about CitizenCon (that didn't mentioned him) on his feed so his followers could "group-insult" the person, humiliating, etc... It's incredible ridiculous, this say this several times, most recent one was just someone who asked on Twitter "So guys, what do you think was the best part of CitizenCon?".... =/

I mean things will only calm down with future content releases to keep the community more busy on the game, than on flame wars / drama. Elite had faced something like this when it had to readjust its scope and some people gone bananas over it.
Then there's the worse part, a VERY impatient community (not as a whole ofc), personally with me, if it's time they need i'm more than willing to wait for it.
 
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Just out of interest.. do you also post as zealous for ED on the SC forums as you do for SC over here? :)

I don't think I've ever seen a post of yours in the ED thread in the SC forums..

Not sure zealous is the word I would use. Informative would be more a thing.

I really want to get more in to Elite. I don't post about it as much since the E: D thread in the SC forums is full of information and people talking about it. It's actually one of the largest threads in the SC forum from what I know. I am really excited for E: D with Horizons due to that being the frontier in space games that needs to be conquered. First person in space and on planets. That's my dream. Every game that achieves that get's a lot of support from me. I backed E: D incredibly early on but Horizons really got my attention.

Also looking for like minded people to play Elite with. I think I got someone to help me get in touch with the good kind of people. Hope's up for some nice sessions of Elite in the near future.
 
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Care to give an example of for what I did not show evidence to backup claims (sometimes you don't need, since its opinion, but I am pretty sure that I brought many evidences about matters that I discussed, ad nauseum), or when I said that "I am God, deal with it", or anything similar, or when you brought any "counter-argument" that I should consider valid enough to change my mind, or any "concrete point" that you brought in any discussion that I ignored?

I mean... "You are hater" or "You this, you that", is not really a concrete point or valid argument that would make me convinced of anything. So, here, you seem in denial, if you don't believe that you are just behaving like people who is called toxic, as referred by the guy, when getting too personal, with comments/critics that are made to the project.

I am a very reasonable guy but not really the type that is convinced by personal offenses or arguments that are just "marketing speech". Give me something to work here, instead just your witch-hunt/sensationalist campaign. Or just move on? I mean. This topic is not about me, if you have an issue with me, let's solve it or clarify it in private messages? Otherwise, I will have to report you for harassment and trolling.

Thank you in advance for your comprehesion.
Several times, included just on this thread, the "es and drugs" quote, or the several times you do not reply certain arguments or give the type of "political" reply (the kind of reply that is meant to dodge the question) it's like someone thrown that on the Internet (that is what it is), so it must be true kind of thinking. Kinda what this on the whole drama story is set on.
Anyway, you're right, this is about Star Citizen, not about you, you already have your own "Wikipedia" page. :)

- - - Updated - - -

Also looking for like minded people to play Elite with. I think I got someone to help me get in touch with the good kind of people. Hope's up for some nice sessions of Elite in the near future.
Horizons kinda gets me hyped about, it's like while SC approaches this matter on a hand-crafted matter, Elite has a more Sandbox approach to it, what is fun because i like both! Waiting to see the first signs of its gameplay, seems soon enough. ^^
 

jcrg99

Banned
Several times, included just on this thread, the "es and drugs" quote

What is the issue with that quote? Was an example. Has nothing to do with stating that Chris Roberts is using backers money on es and drugs. You take the things too personal and its reading too much. That is because your hate, not mine.

or the several times you do not reply certain arguments or give the type of "political" reply (the kind of reply that is meant to dodge the question) it's like someone thrown that on the Internet (that is what it is), so it must be true kind of thinking. Kinda what this on the whole drama story is set on.
Sorry. It did not make sense. Bring an example, or it means nothing. If I don't reply to someone is because I notice that the person is not interested to discuss Star Citizen, but just interested on making marketing for Star Citizen, so, the discussion became pointless, because the other side has no interest to discuss, without any problem if that will lead to a conclusion that CIG is not doing the right thing. Coming to usual back and forth. It's not me who does not know how to discuss. It's you people. For some reason, you have to convince me and other people that CIG is doing right, in the end of the day, because Roberts claimed. That's usual your concrete evidence, so you dismiss all the project evidences that things are not doing ok. Because? Well... Because Roberts said. lol
You know... the guy that wants your money ;)

Anyway, you're right, this is about Star Citizen, not about you, you already have your own "Wikipedia" page. :)
Have I? And in case if it exists, do you agree with such things? I thought that you are trying to claim that your community is not toxic, that its a good community, but then, you corroborated with that? You are ok with bullying and harassment of people who criticize Star Citizen. You came here and talk a lot about I do this, I do that an is not capable to bring any serious example of anything that you said. I see.

It's interest that you did not realize that you are pointing fingers to other people, when you should just look to yourself to find the issues that you claim other people have. Projection.
;)
 
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It's not as flashy as CIG's map, but this fan made one is much simpler to follow:

VXGbKvM.jpg


I find the lack of a jump point between Sol and Vega highly suspicious. I bet that will factor heavily in SQ42.
 
What is the issue with that quote? Was an example. Has nothing to do with stating that Chris Roberts is using backers money on es and drugs. You take the things too personal and its reading too much. That is because your hate, not mine

Sorry. It did not make sense. Bring an example, or it means nothing.


Have I? And in case if it exists, do you agree with such things? I thought that you are trying to claim that your community is not toxic, that its a good community, but then, you corroborated with that? You are ok with bullying and harassment of people who criticize Star Citizen. I see.

It's interest that you did not realize that you are pointing fingers to other people, when you should just look to yourself to find the issues that you claim other people have. Projection.
;)
It's not one example, far i read it's one of the accusations thrown against CIG, also part of the same bunch that accuse Roberts of buying a Mansion with backer money. It's not personal, it's just... drama, too much drama disguised of it being any facts. I won't dig up old stuff just for show it, it won't really do any good in here.

Well you do, as you're certainly aware some people made compilations of your history and behavior before and after being part of it. I am not cool with harassment and bullying of nobody, both critics or supporters, as i exemplified adobe some of the acts of bullying and harassment towards supporters, i also see people take things too far attacking the critics, it's a story where both sides are going too far. If you never noticed, when we had discussions, some people got in attacking you directly and personally (about your story, ban, etc...), i never supported, replied or used those against you, i focus on the actual discussion, on the actual facts and arguments, and what gets me on this particular case is the Copy/Paste you do for months over the same thing non-stop (that pretty much ends up like talking to a brick wall). And i do separate drama/rumors and facts, because when you do, you see two different things.

Le back on topic anyway, waiting for PTU 1.3. :)
 
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jcrg99

Banned
It's not one example, far i read it's one of the accusations thrown against CIG, also part of the same bunch that accuse Roberts of buying a Mansion with backer money. It's not personal, it's just... drama, too much drama disguised of it being any facts. I won't dig up old stuff just for show it, it won't really do any good in here.

Well you do, as you're certainly aware some people made compilations of your history and behavior before and after being part of it. I am not cool with harassment and bullying of nobody, both critics or supporters, as i exemplified adobe some of the acts of bullying and harassment towards supporters, i also see people take things too far attacking the critics, it's a story where both sides are going too far. If you never noticed, when we had discussions, some people got in attacking you directly and personally (about your story, ban, etc...), i never supported, replied or used those against you, i focus on the actual discussion, on the actual facts and arguments, and what gets me on this particular case is the Copy/Paste you do for months over the same thing non-stop (that pretty much ends up like talking to a brick wall). And i do separate drama/rumors and facts, because when you do, you see two different things.

Compilations of my history = compilations of lies, never backed up for any fact, any proof, nothing. Still, you conveniently made your mind based on fanboy rumors/lies, because, well, it fits in your agenda. And then, claim now that only care about actual facts.
Ok.
Bias, incoherence, projection. Better stop. You are revealing yourself too much. It was better just to admit that you are mistaken and acted in prejudice behavior.

I only see fanboys making drama and going too far, because they take questions too personal. CIG making drama, instead revealing the facts themselves to prove the doubts wrong. Resorting to drama and buls to do not have to answer the questions. Threatening people. Disrespecting long-time backers/supporters (just as they did with me earlier 2013). Making a fear campaign that affects both employees and backers. Summed to all their history of bait-and-switch and shady tactics to mislead consumers, all that raises suspicious. That's what I see. And it's not just me.
 
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Also Derek Smart did take down the video Kate Russel made of him after all. Oh boy.

Compilations of my history = compilations of lies, never backed up for any fact, any proof, nothing. Still, you conveniently made your mind based on fanboy rumors/lies, because, well, it fits in your agenda. And then, claim now that only care about actual facts.
Ok.
Bias, incoherence, projection. What more you will bring to demonstrate who you really are here today?
My mind was made by our discussions, i did not knew who you were till months later, when Sandi commented about you. Like i said, when you copy/paste the same thing during months, it's like talking to a brick wall, because you will never accept anything that doesn't fit the way you view things. If i were to grab everything awesome and good about Star Citizen, i would make everything look like it's perfect, if i were to grab everything negative, rumors, etc... about Star Citizen, i would sound like.... you? I mean one has to have a middle-term. There are bad things going on, there are good things going on, there's no point on dramatizing one of the sides to give it more value (because it doesn't).
 
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jcrg99

Banned
My mind was made by our discussions, i did not knew who you were till months later, when Sandi commented about you.
What Sandi's comment about me? And, whatever comment she made, please, tell me that she brought any proof for her accusations, since you are a man of facts, not rumors, or empty accusations, as you claimed.

What discussion that I had with you? I mean... I already addressed your points, for example, of how its you, who took the things too personally and read too much in what I wrote. Wasn't just a similar situation? Your bias leading to read too much in my statements? You are walking on circles now. It does not matter what I say to you. You are just do not listening.

Like i said, when you copy/paste the same thing during months, it's like talking to a brick wall, because you will never accept anything that doesn't fit the way you view things.
I am not copy/paste anything here. This is another sensationalist comment from your side. Why do you have to resort to that all the time? Well... because you have no argument. You made empty accusations, tried to make a witch-hunt campaign against me, here, and now is walking on circles and trying to resort to the sensationalist card, without any fact, again and again.

If i were to grab everything awesome and good about Star Citizen, i would make everything look like it's perfect, if i were to grab everything negative, rumors, etc... about Star Citizen, i would sound like.... you?
More vague stuff. Here's the thing. CIG never did anything positive so far. The only positive thing that they did is money, which for the sake of backers, consumers, does not matter at all. Specially when, in fact, this money, actually created a situation that put the project at the risk of an absolute and complete flop. So, I am sorry. But I am the one who has no fear to talk about the facts. I am the one who has no fear to speak to them, that they have legal responsibilities. That there is no such thing of "privilege". That they are accountable to their promises. There is no drama here. THIS IS FACT!
You seem the one who like to talk about "rumors", I mean... Roberts statements that 100% of the times, never became reality as stated, and the majority never became reality at all. A guy that already lied to the public and constantly tries to deceive everyone with shady tactics and statements (many already proven as false statements, tries to deceive, hoping that people forgot the past).

I mean one has to have a middle-term. There are bad things going on, there are good things going on, there's no point on dramatizing one of the sides to give it more value (because it doesn't).
I am not dramatizing. Again. That's you and CIG, which dramatizes to flee of the questions that should be answered in respect to the consumers. They were the ones who made a deal, a business, and transformed that in a church and in a glorious holy cause for the awesomeness of Roberts, instead thinking about the damn project and the consumers who paid to make it, based on the deal, not in televangelist bul.
 
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What Sandi's comment about me? And, whatever comment she made, please, tell me that she brought any proof for her accusations, since you are a man of facts, not rumors, or empty accusations, as you claimed.

What discussion that I had with you? You mean... I already addressed your points, for example, of how its you, who took the things too personally and read too much in what I wrote. You are walking on circles now. It does not matter what I say to you. You are just do not listening.


I am not copy/paste anything here. This is another sensationalist comment from your side. Why do you have to resort to that all the time? Well... because you have no argument. You made empty accusations, tried to make a witch-hunt campaign against me, here, and now is walking on circles and trying to resort to the sensationalist card, without any fact, again and again.


More vague stuff. Here's the thing. CIG never did anything positive so far. The only positive thing that they did is money, which for the sake of backers, consumers, does not matter at all. Specially when, in fact, this money, actually created a situation that put the project at the risk of an absolute and complete flop. So, I am sorry. But I am the one who has no fear to talk about the facts. You seem the one who like to talk about "rumors", I mean... Roberts statements that 100% of the times, never became reality as stated, and the majority never became reality at all. A guy that already lied to the public and constantly tries to deceive everyone with shady tactics and statements (many already proven as false statements, tries to deceive, hoping that people forgot the past).


I am not dramatizing. Again. That's you and CIG, which dramatizes to flee of the questions that should be answered in respect to the consumers. They were the ones who made a deal, a business, and transformed that in a church and in a glorious holy cause for the awesomeness of Roberts, instead thinking about the damn project.
I think if i remember she posted some emails you sent her (All on Caps if i recall correctly), i don't remember any of the contents.

One example of the "copy/paste" comments is the one you frequently use: The 2014 release date for the KS and the scope increase. It's such a live in the past and keep hitting on it constantly, we all know the 2014 got dropped, the game currently being developed has a big scope increase (as the FPS) from the Kickstarter. As there is no such thing as time machines what thing CIG can do is move forward, as i said some posts back on the thread, all they can do to who isn't happy about that, and not willing to wait, is give them Refunds, and we clearly know, if you ask for a Refund being a KS backer based on that, you will get it.

It's not vague, it is how it is, every story has 2 sides, and you only see/tell one, it is dramatizing because of that, you take this approach to X point/situation, see the possible worse case scenario and that's it. I can exemplify this with some claims i saw recently on a video about this, when the person claims "if you check CIG jobs site you see that some positions are open for almost 1 year, this point towards the company running out of money and the jobs being just a way to tell that they are hiring, when they aren't.", that comment made me poker face, on all big companies, like Blizzard, the jobs take sometimes over 1 year to fill, not because the company is a "scam" or going bankrupt, but because quality people are not easy to find on the industry and the company is not willing to hire anyone who applies, so that is one example to show how a X fact can be put on several ways depending of the view you want to transmit.

Going further on this is repeat myself from what i said adobe.
 
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jcrg99

Banned
Also Derek Smart did take down the video Kate Russel made of him after all. Oh boy.
If Derek Smart made some video with a parody referring to the Sandi's sexual attributes, or changing her statements to make she playing a ridiculous role, what would you and others claim, I wonder?
I mean. If you would still consider an absurd, or like "oh boy", if Sandi asked to the parody be taken down? Or if even would claim,
like others claimed here, that Sandi should just have to have "humor".

For those who accuses others of been dramatic (while they are just stating facts), while been dramatic yourself, I just imagine the drama that you and other fans would make about that.
 
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If Derek Smart made some video with a parody referring to the Sandi's sexual attributes, or changing her statements to make her play a ridiculous role, what would you and others claim, I wonder?
I mean. If you would still consider an absurd, or like "oh boy", if Sandi asked to the parody be taken down? Or if even would claim,
like others claimed here, that Sandi should just have to have "humor".

For those who accuses others of been dramatic, while been dramatic yourself, I just imagine the drama that you and other fans would make about that.
People already do parodies about Roberts himself, like the one did with Smart, editing voice samples to the fitting result. I didn't saw take-downs.

The fact you don't like it is no reason to try to censorship it, specially content (his stream on this case) that was put publicly on a social network such as Youtube. And specially after him and Kate were supposedly "cool" as posted hours ago.
 

jcrg99

Banned
People already do parodies about Roberts himself, like the one did with Smart, editing voice samples to the fitting result. I didn't saw take-downs.

The fact you don't like it is no reason to try to censorship it, specially content (his stream on this case) that was put publicly on a social network such as Youtube. And specially after him and Kate were supposedly "cool" as posted hours ago.

So, in your perspective, people are ok to make parodies about the sexual attributes of Sandi Gardiner in similar fashion as Kate did with Derek Smart? You will be in their side, defending that Sandi Gardiner shouldn't take such parody down, just because she did not like, as well as, defending this idea against any member of CIG or fan or Sandi, in case they consider that the ultimate offense/abuse/harassment, whatever dramatic statement that they bring, or try to put that down?
 
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So, people are ok to make parodies about the sexual attributes of Sandi Gardiner in similar fashion as Kate did with Derek Smart? You will be in their side, defending that Sandi Gardiner shouldn't take such parody down, just because she did not like, as well as, defending this idea against and CIG fan who consider that the ultimate offense/abuse/harassment, whatever dramatic statement that they bring?
It depends on the intention you use, there are 2 kind of parodies, the ones who are just fun, and the ones that are meant to HARM the person in question. I believe the one made about Smart was a much lighter approach and more meant to make fun of the situation (that we all know about) than trying to attack/harm the person.

It all depends in how it is made, in how you put it, there are limits for everything, like attacking Races, the person Religion, also Sexuality in a way more meant to humiliate the person, that's where i think people draw a line.
 
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THE PTU 1.3 is Live! ~~ Le downloading.

An excellent technical but easy to understand explanation of flight model problem with SC ships, from user DEEDEE-101: https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/comment/5749877/#Comment_5749877

These are the kinds of people who invest their time and effort on correcting CIG's mistakes and incompetence.
Yeah i read that like yesterday night, it's pretty amazing. The Star Citizen flight model isn't wrongly made on tech side, but it is on the tweaks it needs to make its gameplay feel correctly (and make gameplay with HOTAs possible). There are decently big flight changes on AC 2.0, but it also needs more changes to make combat and actually navigation, also to be able to feel the ship "weight* (thanks Neo)" (sometimes it feels a big ship doesn't weight anything o_O).
 
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