I think you meant brain science!
The SCB (Shield Cell Bank) Thread
- Thread starter OnePercent
- Start date
I think you meant brain science!
You're suggesting some ships get a buff, and others get not?
The premise would be if you were to draw a graph using the current SCBs in single and double config, using the energy usage and the energy they apply to the shields, that's what I would hope the new "only one permitted" SCB modules 1E --> 6A would mimic...
The only major difference would be the new module would prevent more than 1, 2 or 3 uses X minutes (depending on module class). So no more 4-5 SCBs, with non-stop uses for minutes on end...
In brief imagine the current mechanics but you can't use more than 1-3 uses in X mins... That's where we're trying to get to roughly.
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Don't rant, rather educate.
People don't wake up good and combat ready - they need taught. That said, I agree - sorting of targets is the #1 priority at contact.
People don't wake up good and combat ready - they need taught. That said, I agree - sorting of targets is the #1 priority at contact.
Well honestly yeah a lot of people do want fast dirty expensive combat. I much prefer that style my self, but CQC scratches that itch for me now. The only reason every MMO goes to the bubble wrap nerf sword pvp style is that the faster kill style pvp drives away new players because it is harder for them to learn. The bubble wrap style of pvp is far more forgiving and allows new players to learn. You are dealing with a older gaming market in the ED community who probably does enjoy the older style of pvp.
If SCBs were on utility rather than internal compartments I would see the sense. As it is, the ship with the most 'cargo' space and loaded for battle will win because it has gigajoules of shielding. I'd love to stop for a PvP fight with my Python running powerplay missions, but my Python has 216t of powerplay cargo, the enemy has 16 shield cell banks. I cannot win, therefore I go solo.
I will admit, I have been against shield potions SCBs for a while. I had read the complaints about long, boring combat. That and the way they are implemented didn't really make sense to me. However, during this latest CG in Cayutorme, I decided to give them a go. So I added the best SCB I could power to my Cobra. I've got to say that I am converted... a little.
In my Cobra in a CZ it can be quite easy for the numbers to turn against you quickly. All of a sudden you find yourself the attention of 4 or 5 ships and you need to get out of there quick. I've found the SCB to be a helpful safety measure.
Now, I don't have any experience with larger ships yet. So I can't say this with authority. But while I can now see the usefulness of having one SCB equipped for emergencies, I fail to see the point in the larger ships loaded with - what? - eight or so of the things. If you're in a fight (holding your own), you're in a fight. If you're not, why drag it out by artificially pumping up your shields?
I tend to be of the opinion that a skilled pilot in a Cobra should be able to take down an Anaconda. It takes forever and is risky enough as it is. If an Anaconda can't use the superior shields and firepower that it already has to swat away a Cobra, it has no business sitting around slowly wearing down a smaller craft. I get that the rebuy on an Anaconda is huge. But I sometimes get the feeling that players want to buy one and then take on any fight and expect to be invincible. Surely skill (as well as knowing when to run) should still come into it.
Maybe I'll feel differently if, one day, I manage to get an Anaconda myself. It just doesn't seem right to me now.
In my Cobra in a CZ it can be quite easy for the numbers to turn against you quickly. All of a sudden you find yourself the attention of 4 or 5 ships and you need to get out of there quick. I've found the SCB to be a helpful safety measure.
Now, I don't have any experience with larger ships yet. So I can't say this with authority. But while I can now see the usefulness of having one SCB equipped for emergencies, I fail to see the point in the larger ships loaded with - what? - eight or so of the things. If you're in a fight (holding your own), you're in a fight. If you're not, why drag it out by artificially pumping up your shields?
I tend to be of the opinion that a skilled pilot in a Cobra should be able to take down an Anaconda. It takes forever and is risky enough as it is. If an Anaconda can't use the superior shields and firepower that it already has to swat away a Cobra, it has no business sitting around slowly wearing down a smaller craft. I get that the rebuy on an Anaconda is huge. But I sometimes get the feeling that players want to buy one and then take on any fight and expect to be invincible. Surely skill (as well as knowing when to run) should still come into it.
Maybe I'll feel differently if, one day, I manage to get an Anaconda myself. It just doesn't seem right to me now.
And please can you explain how the combat skills and SCBanks are related in your post?
All your point is useless, because you say that SCB are good as them are, it's just people is not good at combat:
Maybe you missed the point: who wants to modify/reduce/nerf or whatever you want the SCB is because is a BROKEN an UNBALANCED game mechanic, and wants the game more challenging,engaging and DANGEROUS....not more easy.
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There's some merit to the idea of putting SCBs on utilities.
Personally I think they should just be rebalanced, only one permitted - you only get one shield module for example - and depending on the SCB module size only 1-3 used per X minutes permitted. Done... (Ammo is still applicable too)
A 1E would be small 30Mj 1 use affair. A 6A would be something more akin to say 600-800Mj, with three charges, but would use bucket loads of energy (eg: well over 2 times a current 6A). In short, you'd be trying to encapsulate the behaviour and energy usage 1 or 2 SCBs across the new single module's range. With the limitation of 1-3(?) used per X minutes.
So in a Python, instead of 4 x 5A SBCs (running them in pairs). Maybe with the new single unit approach, I'd have a single 5A which would for all intents and purposes behave exactly the same (same energy usage and same shield replenishment), but would only allow upto 3 uses in say 10 minutes? And say 9 ammo?
Surely what we want it tactical/logical use of the SCB, without the mindless (boring?) use of 4-6 of them.
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Pretty much exactly what I'm proposing...
- Only allow one SCB
- Make the 1E --> 6A units behave (energy usage and shield replenishment) akin to the behaviour of one and two current units (run in parallel) at the moment across the range.
- Class 1&2 get 1 use per X mins. Class 3&4 get 2 uses per X mins. Class 5-6 get 3 uses per X mins.
- Max ammo depends on unit size too. eg: 3-->12.
So in a Python, instead of 4 x 5A SBCs (running them turned on in pairs). Maybe with the new single unit approach, I'd have a single 5A which would for all intents and purposes behave exactly the same (same energy usage and same shield replenishment), but would only allow upto 3 uses in say a 10 minutes (each of the three individual cells takes 10 mins to replenish)? And say 9 ammo?
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Once again .....
WHERE are you finding these ghost ships with 16 Shield Cell Banks ?
I presume when you are talking about these non existent ships you are possibly talking about pythons or anaconda right ?
No TRADER will EVER have that many SCB. Because they use all that space for CARGO.
No MINER/BELTER has that many either because they also need the cargo space refinery and the limpet controllers.
Everyone else has a combination of Hull Reinforcements/Cargo/Interdictor/Fuel/Scoop/Docking/SCB you name it. Even my FDL has 2 SCB for those CZ moments and between fights.
Only 1 type of ship in this game is FULL of SCBs and they are only there to TANK. They are not worth Pirating since they do not carry any worthwhile cargo.
They are not worth fighting because they are not there to PVP ...... although if a wing of ships chooses to have a support Python or Anaconda to just sit there and defend them it might make some sense.
Personally if a target only has SCBs I would ignore them and leave. I can guarantee you they would be too slow to chase you anyway.
Fortunately most people I meet only have a couple on board at the most.
In my new tradeaconda I have 3 because I am cheap and do not want to spend 9Million to repurchase it just in case a Pirate gets bored.
WHERE are you finding these ghost ships with 16 Shield Cell Banks ?
I presume when you are talking about these non existent ships you are possibly talking about pythons or anaconda right ?
No TRADER will EVER have that many SCB. Because they use all that space for CARGO.
No MINER/BELTER has that many either because they also need the cargo space refinery and the limpet controllers.
Everyone else has a combination of Hull Reinforcements/Cargo/Interdictor/Fuel/Scoop/Docking/SCB you name it. Even my FDL has 2 SCB for those CZ moments and between fights.
Only 1 type of ship in this game is FULL of SCBs and they are only there to TANK. They are not worth Pirating since they do not carry any worthwhile cargo.
They are not worth fighting because they are not there to PVP ...... although if a wing of ships chooses to have a support Python or Anaconda to just sit there and defend them it might make some sense.
Personally if a target only has SCBs I would ignore them and leave. I can guarantee you they would be too slow to chase you anyway.
Fortunately most people I meet only have a couple on board at the most.
In my new tradeaconda I have 3 because I am cheap and do not want to spend 9Million to repurchase it just in case a Pirate gets bored.
Nice point.
Just you have to say that players are not outside just to fight. There are people (not me, i am a combat oriented-player) who are not always well prepared for fighting because they do other things (mining, trading, exploring). In that case, maybe, SCBs seem unfair because they give a BIG boost to the combat, especially if you do not have any and your enemy does!
+1 rep ...
I would rather watch two very ugly people bump uglies than sit through watching two Anaconda's endlessly spam SCB's until one finally runs out and does a runner.
It's worse when it's a 4v1, it's just dull and uninspiring.
I do not think it promotes combat in a positive way in this game.
I have probably said too much.
I do not care.
It's worse when it's a 4v1, it's just dull and uninspiring.
I do not think it promotes combat in a positive way in this game.
I have probably said too much.
I do not care.
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The Quote feature is your friend... ie: Who was your comment aimed at?
I think the point many are making RE SBCs is regarding straight on PvP. ie: If two players face off in similar Pythons, one with just one SCB, and the other with four SCBs... What will happen?
Wouldn't it be better if the game allowed a more reasoned and compromised approach with just one SCB, where depending on its size/class it could behave as a pair current 5A SCBs if so wished (in your Python), and that was it? In effect meaning you can use it say three times in X minutes and that's it? No more having a dozen+ charges, over and over and over..
As for your "tradeaconda", the suggestion is you'd still be able to fit in a single SCB giving you the same sort of behaviour as now... But not more than for example 3 uses (recharges) in X minutes...
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I mean ...
Can you imagine me starting a thread about .... PVP players have TOO MANY FIXED WEAPONS.
They should only be allowed to have 2 but not 4 ... and have no choice but to install 2 gimballed or turreted.
I think if you have room ... you should be allowed to install ANYTHING YOU CAN AFFORD.
Hell if you want to install 6 or 8 fuel tanks ..... then HAVE A NICE TRIP.....in fact let me speed you on your way.....
If you want to install ONLY SCB ...... good for you .... I hope someone bothers to waste their weapons capacitors just to entertain you.
Personally if people feel so unsafe ... I would let them install 4 or 5 layers of shields....if the game allowed it......I certainly would not complain about how hard it is to penetrate them.....in fact I wouldn't even interact with them with a laser.
Get where I am going ? I would only complain about how many SCB people had if I desperately wanted to kill them. WHY ??? They do not have ANY CARGO ..... knock knock ... no have any Palladium in this ship ....
lol
I give up ...
Can you imagine me starting a thread about .... PVP players have TOO MANY FIXED WEAPONS.
They should only be allowed to have 2 but not 4 ... and have no choice but to install 2 gimballed or turreted.
I think if you have room ... you should be allowed to install ANYTHING YOU CAN AFFORD.
Hell if you want to install 6 or 8 fuel tanks ..... then HAVE A NICE TRIP.....in fact let me speed you on your way.....
If you want to install ONLY SCB ...... good for you .... I hope someone bothers to waste their weapons capacitors just to entertain you.
Personally if people feel so unsafe ... I would let them install 4 or 5 layers of shields....if the game allowed it......I certainly would not complain about how hard it is to penetrate them.....in fact I wouldn't even interact with them with a laser.
Get where I am going ? I would only complain about how many SCB people had if I desperately wanted to kill them. WHY ??? They do not have ANY CARGO ..... knock knock ... no have any Palladium in this ship ....
lol
I give up ...
You are not ranting, you are bragging.
I used to play exclusively open, now it's more and more Mobius. Why? Because I tried PVP a few times and quickly realised I had more fun fighting the NPC's. Whats the point learning to control an agile combat ship to stay on the tail of a larger non-combat ship only to see it's shields magically re-ignite?
All IMHO but the game was initially sold as spitfires in space, it became anything but.
All IMHO but the game was initially sold as spitfires in space, it became anything but.