Buff Imperial Trader (ehm I meant Cutter) for 2.1

[Troa Barton]

Sorry, but in your OP you have concealed that you want to use this TRADER - and that's exactly how you called it - for PVP. But I actually use DUAL SCB's in my Python. BTW: I won't use DUAL SCB in a trading vessel with nearly 2100 MJ shield strength.




You're right, the power will deplete faster than you can say "empty". Have you ever thought about using 1/1/4 setting? My Python runs pretty well using it.

It's not a trader!
it is all its good at, besides running and taking a beating and is how it's used by the majority of the player base. That is however not what it is described as being, nor is it how the npcs use the ship.
btw 1/1/4 will get you destroyed in pvp... Every ship is good against npcs..

 

[Commander Biscuit]

So the Cutter isn't Clipper enough. Must be something broken or some calculations were off.

 

[OMIKRONXI]

It's not a trader!
it is all its good at, besides running and taking a beating and is how it's used by the majority of the player base. That is however not what it is described as being, nor is it how the npcs use the ship.
btw 1/1/4 will get you destroyed in pvp... Every ship is good against npcs..

...and ED is no real pvp-game. The pvp-part is completely unbalanced, that's why I don't even bother about this. But this only beside.

 

[Von Shadow]

The cutter is just a total waste of a ship .... tragic that the crowning jewel of the imperial fleet (pilotable) is just not up to its job
Don't know why they won't adjust it .... would make many of us supremely happy

 

[Derath]

that build clearly shows me your lack of knowledge, PVP side.

Have you ever heard of DUAL shield cell bank use?

and another question for you: Why does that Size 6-8 shield cell banks exists for this ship, according to your thinking?

Also, have you ever tried to fire those beams of yours with 2 pips to Weapons? How long do they last for you? 0.5 secs or smthg?

check out http://coriolis.io/ you might like it more.

There really isn't anything wrong with his setup for pvp, its a mix of kinetic and energy weapons for energy management and blatantly reliance on SCB's has always made a bad pilot.

Its also a cutter, which is frequently touted as being even less maneuverable than a T9, which basically means its a free kill for anyone with even limited competance short of the usual backwards invincibility. Like does anyone actually PvP in a cutter?

 

[tawittle]

You are complaining you don't have enough power for the cutter's shields? you realize a pvp cutter will have 2500 mj of shields while a corvette only has 1000mj right?

The Cutter is faster and has stronger shields than the corvette. The Cutter has better armament as well, with 4 mediums instead of 2 medium/2 small. If the cutter wasn't so slow to turn it would be way too OP.

The Cutter really does not need a buff at all tbh, the fact it's so tanky and fast makes it a presence on the battlefield even though it turns slower than grass grows (figuratively speaking).

 

[MarcusKross]

And here i thought we were finally done with buff my ship threads.

 

[sebbemann]

+ 1 for buffing the Cutters manoverability. As for power, I think it is fine were it is. It is a trader, not a combat ship.

The Corvette, IMO, could also need a buff. It's a dedicated combat ship and the most expensive. It should be next to impossible for another ship to take it down. As it is now, even a semi-skilled pilot could take it down in an FDL pretty fast. It should take several ships to destroy it. A T-rex would not be killed by a single velociraptor. Several, however.

 

[Odan Brota]

The Cutter has a turning problem, but that's about it. I wouldn't want to see the current situation that FDev has put the FDL in, where it's the undisputed king of PvP at the moment due to just how OP they made it. Power plant issues aside, I think it forces more creativity in build choice.

IMO, the cutter needs to turn and pitch WORSE than an Anaconda, but BETTER than a Type 9. For heaven's sakes.

Another concern of mine, is that when the Panther Clipper comes out, what happens to the Cutter? Only the imperial faithful will fly her, and there will be better trade ships, better combat ships, and a better multipurpose ship in the same class; what's the point of the cutter?

 

[777Driver]

Like does anyone actually PvP in a cutter?

Yep...

Free kill? Have you actually flown an A-rated cutter?

 

[pindleton]

Git gud, scrub.

Oh wait, I'm not SDC.

You should practice your piloting skills, good sir.

 

[777Driver]

IMO, the cutter needs to turn and pitch WORSE than an Anaconda, but BETTER than a Type 9. For heaven's sakes.

/QUOTE]

Dude, the Cutter has better roll,yaw, acceleration, top speed over the T9 (although I seem to spend more time in my T9) Pitch is slightly slower on the Cutter - News flash, stop pitching the Cutter to lock onto targets

 

[jgm]

So I am wondering if FD will address the really weak Imperial Trader to claim the name of Cutter in 2.1

FD said they would do a balance pass after they had released the majority of the ships. Attempting to nerf or buff individual ships is unlikely to happen for that reason.

(And calling things bugs when they aren't isn't the best way of starting a discussion).

 

[xondk]

So, whoever is experienced enough with the game will notice that the Imperial Trader (ehm Cutter) is lacking a lot.

Firstly there is a maneuverability bug presented very clearly in the video of Kornelious here:

So....I have to ask, what should be its downsides?
If it remains significantly faster then the other two endgame ships
if it keeps its more powerful shield.

I will try to sum the three ships up as I see it.

From best to worst.
Jump range: Anaconda - Cutter - Corvette
Weapons : Corvette - Anaconda/Cutter ... really no third here and really also depends on the new huge weapons, but anaconda and cutter are very close, thanks to cutter having medium weapons instead of small, makes quite a difference.
Shield : Cutter - Corvette - Anaconda
Armor : Anaconda - Corvette - Cutter
Speed : Cutter - Corvette - Anaconda
Agility : Corvette - Anaconda - Cutter

Seems fairly well destributed to me currently.

Now if I am missing something please let me know, but I think people are underestimating the power behind 4 turreted medium weapons at the very least, mostly because "It doesn't do the most damage!" it doesn't need to because the cutter can be based around sustained damage, yes chaff will affect it, but because it is continual fire, it will be affected less then a ship that gets chaffed but is mainly firing only when aiming at a person, the way the cutter's weapon layout is last I checked the 4 medium can cover it completely with turret fire, any angle? Before I went to explore with my conda, I was melting stuff left right and center thanks to my conda's turrets continual fire, sustained fire is severely underestimated.


But I think people are seriously underestimating or misunderstanding the concept of a battleship, a battleship/warship doesn't really mean it is a dog fighter, which is what most consider combat currently, so yeah. Has anyone ever given it a serious attempt? like outfitted one and tried to haz res with it without giving up, and without trying to only use the tactics they are used to from other ships?

 

[777Driver]

Has anyone ever given it a serious attempt? like outfitted one and tried to haz res with it without giving up, and without trying to only use the tactics they are used to from other ships?

Yes, quite a few of us, hence why we don't see a major issue. My main Cutter for SSS,PVP doesn't even have cargo racks. My CG Cutter has plenty of cargo space and A8 shields, it hardly gets used.

 

[pindleton]

I use the same tactic in the Cutter that I use with the Anaconda. FA off, full reverse thrust, and thrust downward while pulling up on the joystick. I generally have no problem keeping PVE targets in firing position for turrets or gimbals.

And when in doubt, boost away.

Easy peazy.

 

[Jesse Blue]

If it remains significantly faster then the other two endgame ships

Yeah, when hauling cargo perhaps....

The Cutter is not significantly faster than the other ships, as its speed is quite the same as the other big fishes. It only BOOSTS faster. Which is quite nice when you are space trucking, as you can simply keep 4 pips on thrusters and 2 on systems all the time. However, in combat, make a wild guess about where do the 6 pips are placed most of the time...

FD shoehorned the Cutter into a trader role, simply because they wanted to have a combat ship, a multipurpose, and a trader one, and the Cutter drew the short stick. There is no other reason. That is the way FD maintain their delusion of 'variation'.

 

[TheoZ]

FD said they would do a balance pass after they had released the majority of the ships. Attempting to nerf or buff individual ships is unlikely to happen for that reason.

(And calling things bugs when they aren't isn't the best way of starting a discussion).

what part of the video I posted you don't understand?

Since you obviously didn't notice the video, here it is, especially for you:

Maneuverability index of
Corvette :2
Anaconda: 2
Cutter : 2

Lateral Acceleration:
Corvette :18.9
Anaconda: 16.53
Cutter : 28.11

Obviously a bug with lateral, they must have similar values due to same index.

Lateral Deceleration:
Corvette : 3
Anaconda: 4.38
Cutter : 4.8

Decel has similar values, np with that.

Vertical Acceleration:
Corvette :18.9
Anaconda: 16.48
Cutter : 28.13

Obviously a bug with vertical acc., they must have similar values due to same index.

Vertical Deceleration:
Corvette :18.9
Anaconda: 15.46
Cutter : 27.21

Obviously a bug with vertical dec., they must have similar values due to same index.

3 out of 4 tests which define maneuverability index do show how bugged Cutter's maneuverability really is. Not a problem if I hear someone saying that it is working as intended. If it is, then FD needs to change the maneuverability index of Cutter and place it to 0 or sub-0, and everything is fine.

 

[Arithon]

Slightly off topic, the game data (models, sounds, etc.) for the Imperial Clipper are named "imperial_trader" so it's not the Cutter that's the trader, but the Clipper.

I would agree the new ships need a little fine tuning. As I've said before the Corvette lacks fire power for a combat ship and has far less compared to the far cheaper Anaconda. This could be remedied by changing the two top Small hard-points to Mediums.

The Imperial Cutter is very slow to manoeuvre. What would be the downside of changing it? I can't see any. The cost of making the Cutter a warship is so high, the likelihood of the galaxy being flooded with killer-Cutters is pretty slim. It's currently the biggest ship and should be slow to turn, but that slow? Probably not.

 

[TheoZ]

Slightly off topic, the game data (models, sounds, etc.) for the Imperial Clipper are named "imperial_trader" so it's not the Cutter that's the trader, but the Clipper.

I would agree the new ships need a little fine tuning. As I've said before the Corvette lacks fire power for a combat ship and has far less compared to the far cheaper Anaconda. This could be remedied by changing the two top Small hard-points to Mediums.

The Imperial Cutter is very slow to manoeuvre. What would be the downside of changing it? I can't see any. The cost of making the Cutter a warship is so high, the likelihood of the galaxy being flooded with killer-Cutters is pretty slim. It's currently the biggest ship and should be slow to turn, but that slow? Probably not.

Corvette top problem is not that much the fire power but the lack of jump range! With the new weapons, corvette will truly shine!