Now i remember why I don't play this game in VR. (At least not DK1)

shreddog

shreddog
SO decided to try this on my DK1 while I wait for my HTC order to ship. URghhh [knocked out]

The UI is terrible for VR
-System map info is so far to the right it is unreadable unless you have positional tracking and lean out of your chair by the looks of it. Why not place this info closer to the center of view?
-The whole overlay in system map is not aligned at all and is all over the place. Good luck clicking on anything. And the view fills your entire vision plus more.. Just looking 1 minute on this thing makes me dizzy.
-Same goes for galaxy map: When I think I've finally managed to mouse over a star, and try to I click on it to mark, it sends me 100 LY's away to some distant star. in the background. Here also the view is way to big. I get sick just trying to navigate it [knocked out].
Both of these maps need a complete overhaul IMO. They need less visuals(don't fill up the entire field of view with a glitchy map)and bigger and more centered text. Simplify.

-The ship HUD is not comfortable to look at and it feels like I almost have to cross my eyes sometimes to not view a double image..

-The pilot chair is a constant issue. The headrest keeps clipping into view all the time and is nothing but a huge interference. Trying to look up out of my canopy I am greeted by a metal texture that blocks my view entirely sometimes. Same goes for looking sideways, or back into the cabin. Fix? Cut the top of chair away and eliminate this problem. This is done with pilot when in first person so why not chair to.

-The SRV is a sickness machine. This thing is ludicrously twitchy. It's almost impossible to drive a straight line in this thing, even on 1G world with sand surface it spins for the slightest thing. Not realistic at all. This has annoyed me in normal monitor play, but in VR it is a real game ender [blah][where is it][knocked out]

-To get acceptable(stable 60) FPS on planet surface I had to lower settings to medium. That is with a 970 running only native DK1 resolution(1280x800)... Ok I can live with that, except the shadows are flickering all over the place on this setting. Turning up shadows to high fixes it but then I get stuttering. Urghh,


There are probably a ton more to put in this list, but couldn't do any more gaming. If anyone have anything more to add please do so.

I gotta go lay down [knocked out]
 

Deimos-GOW

D
In order:
-I agree, system view is not great in VR and needs improvement. The info on the left needs to be turned in so when you look in that direction it is facing you. I believe this is a WIP so it may change. Also, since Horizons the system view is worse, I find it to be zoomed too far in, prior to horizons it was much further out.
-I agree, system maps needs improvement.
-The gal map, apart from the observation about the menu, I disagree. The gal map in VR is perfectly fine. I've said this before and I'll say it again, forget the mouse. Just don't use it at all. You need to tilt the gal map to see the selection circle, then you can transit the gal map and select systems very easily with your controller.
-I'm guessing your gripe with the ship HUD has more to do with your IPD or the fact you are using a DK1 as I don't have a problem with this at all. Even when the charging things pops up right in my face, it doesn't feel like I have to cross my eyes to see it.
-The pilot chair, I usually lean back a bit more than usual and reset HMD position. This resolves any issues with chair clipping for me but I kind of feel like the chair should not be rendered at all unless you stand up and look directly at it, but what ever, this doesn't bother me. Since you have a DK1 you don't have positional tracking so I'm not sure why you are even complaining. It's a very early dev kid, the fact that you can play at all is pretty remarkable.
-I agree, the SRV is vomit city. They have introduced a horizon lock which should completely resolve this but the setting is currently bugged as it also forces horizon lock when flying your ship, they need to fix this.
-I don't know what you expect. It has been fairly clear from quite a while back that VR will require decent hardware and if I'm not mistaken the minimum recommended specs is a 980. Also, the game does not run "native". Now that the full software has been released we have since learned that the game is being super sampled by a factor of 1.4. Also, IIRC the "render target" is much higher than a normal monitor because of the extended FOV and the game has to render twice, once for each eye.

Playing on the DK2 is actually fairly decent so hopefully you aren't too jaded to appreciate the upgrade to the HTC.
 
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shreddog

shreddog
Deimos-GOW said:
In order:
-I agree, system view is not great in VR and needs improvement. The info on the left needs to be turned in so when you look in that direction it is facing you. I believe this is a WIP so it may change. Also, since Horizons the system view is worse, I find it to be zoomed too far in, prior to horizons it was much further out.
-I agree, system maps needs improvement.
-The gal map, apart from the observation about the menu, I disagree. The gal map in VR is perfectly fine. I've said this before and I'll say it again, forget the mouse. Just don't use it at all. You need to tilt the gal map to see the selection circle, then you can transit the gal map and select systems very easily with your controller.
-I'm guessing your gripe with the ship HUD has more to do with your IPD or the fact you are using a DK1 as I don't have a problem with this at all. Even when the charging things pops up right in my face, it doesn't feel like I have to cross my eyes to see it.
-The pilot chair, I usually lean back a bit more than usual and reset HMD position. This resolves any issues with chair clipping for me but I kind of feel like the chair should not be rendered at all unless you stand up and look directly at it, but what ever, this doesn't bother me. Since you have a DK1 you don't have positional tracking so I'm not sure why you are even complaining. It's a very early dev kid, the fact that you can play at all is pretty remarkable.
-I agree, the SRV is vomit city. They have introduced a horizon lock which should completely resolve this but the setting is currently bugged as it also forces horizon lock when flying your ship, they need to fix this.
-I don't know what you expect. It has been fairly clear from quite a while back that VR will require decent hardware and if I'm not mistaken the minimum recommended specs is a 980. Also, the game does not run "native". Now that the full software has been released we have since learned that the game is being super sampled by a factor of 1.4. Also, IIRC the "render target" is much higher than a normal monitor because of the extended FOV and the game has to render twice, once for each eye.

Playing on the DK2 is actually fairly decent so hopefully you aren't too jaded to appreciate the upgrade to the HTC.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your detailed reply :) Some good tips there, especially the galaxy map trick. Will have to check that out(when I get a better headset). Didn't know about the horizon lock feature either, I am sure that would have helped. Though I was already queazy before getting in that SRV, lol.

I've found I get much easier sick in VR if I fumble and struggle with things to much. I basically first had to struggle allot to navigate the galactic map to get to the next system on my exploration trip. Then it was a fight against the system map. When I finally arrived at first planet in system to check it out I had my view constantly intruded by clipping polygons from the pilot's chair. Then final straw was wrestling the SRV to get anywhere. My god was I nauseous .. [haha]


While I am sure positional tracking will help with the chair issue, it's still going to be a nuisance. I've had this thing clip into my view while playing on monitor to, because of the head movement when accelerating/decelerating. If they would only remodel it and remove the headrest it would be allot simpler. There's already a creepy headless pilot sitting there, so a cut off headrest wouldn't really affect the experience any more while walking around your ship in VR. Better yet(as you kind of mentioned) have the normal models for both pilot and seat show up when you get a certain distance from the chair.
 
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Deimos-GOW

D
shreddog said:
While I am sure positional tracking will help with the chair issue, it's still going to be a nuisance. I've had this thing clip into my view while playing on monitor to, because of the head movement when accelerating/decelerating. If they would only remodel it and remove the headrest it would be allot simpler. There's already a creepy headless pilot sitting there, so a cut off headrest wouldn't really affect the experience any more while walking around your ship in VR. Better yet(as you kind of mentioned) have the normal models for both pilot and seat show up when you get a certain distance from the chair.
Click to expand...

With DK2 this is not a problem at all, I don't experience any unless I contort myself un-naturally to see something I wouldn't normally look at anyway. I kind of agree about rendering the player model except it's kind of necessary to render hands and arms, but what I don't get is, if there is no head, why render the neck? Take a look at yourself right now, can you see your own neck? Alternatively they could link the player model and chair to positional tracking, like a real damn chair, lean back and the chair moves, turn your head far enough and the chair/shoulders follow a little. This shouldn't be too difficult to implement.
 

shreddog

shreddog
Good news. I tried it again tonight after some tweaking. 2 hours, no nausea, just a bit dizzy.

This time I went with default setting on everything. Btw, using runtime 0.8 through SteamVR. First adjusted the Rift software IPD back to factory setting. Then went with ingame graphic quality set to HMD High. Didn't touch any other setting. Everything ran butterly smooth. Even the hud lined up now, probably because of using default IPD setting. If I tried to make any custom graphic setting I got immediate stutter though, and changing it back didn't help. Weird. But changing it back to HMD preset settings and it worked flawlessly.
Didn't mess with the sys/galaxy maps, just did some low altitude flying on a planet, and trying out the SRV with horizon lock(great improvement).

The immersion is pretty good on the old DK1 I gotta say. (When it all works properly.) Going to be interesting when I get my hands on the Vive. Positional tracking will be the 'numero uno' improvement. Can't wait to roll my chair over to the sidewindow in my DiamondBack to take a glimpse over the railing :D

(Just posting this info if it helps anyone else with DK1 :p)
 
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kepler84

K
This game has some serious UI issues, at least with the current Oculus and Vive HMDs.

You need to be persistently forcing the vision to be able to do anything. Choose a destiny (even without the atrocious galaxy map for vr), ask for permision to land, choose a target, reading the messages from other ships, supercruise deceleration, do business with a station, outfit your ship... EVERYTHING.

I was expecting to spend hundreds of hours "inside" this game thanks to VR, now I just play Audioshield.

This game has an amazing UI, and I can see how it has been developed and improved during years. It just... Doesn't work with VR. It's broken, flawed.
It needs a complete rework, not just a bunch of modifications, it needs a major overhaul.
 
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CylonSurfer

CylonSurfer
kepler84 said:
This game has some serious UI issues, at least with the current Oculus and Vive HMDs.

You need to be persistently forcing the vision to be able to do anything. Choose a destiny (even without the atrocious galaxy map for vr), ask for permision to land, choose a target, reading the messages from other ships, supercruise deceleration, do business with a station, outfit your ship... EVERYTHING.

I was expecting to spend hundreds of hours "inside" this game thanks to VR, now I just play Audioshield.

This game has an amazing UI, and I can see how it has been developed and improved during years. It just... Doesn't work with VR. It's broken, flawed.
It needs a complete rework, not just a bunch of modifications, it needs a major overhaul.
Click to expand...

Are we playing the same game? I don't have any of those issues with my DK2.
 
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shreddog

shreddog
Kepler is right. UI needs reworkd for VR.

My biggest gripes with UI is System Map and Galaxy Map. They are HORRIBLE for VR.
The galaxy maps fill your entire view causing massive motion sickness when you start navigating it. It goes against what Oculus has said NOT to do in VR. NEVER take the player on a 'out of body' wild ride.
And System Map is just a glitchy mess(not sure that's cause of my ancient DK1), with floating "info pointer" all over the place and a menu placed so far to the side you need to leave your chair and walk 3 meters to look at it :p
 

BigDuke6ixx

BigDuke6ixx
kepler84 said:
This game has some serious UI issues, at least with the current Oculus and Vive HMDs.

You need to be persistently forcing the vision to be able to do anything. Choose a destiny (even without the atrocious galaxy map for vr), ask for permision to land, choose a target, reading the messages from other ships, supercruise deceleration, do business with a station, outfit your ship... EVERYTHING.

I was expecting to spend hundreds of hours "inside" this game thanks to VR, now I just play Audioshield.

This game has an amazing UI, and I can see how it has been developed and improved during years. It just... Doesn't work with VR. It's broken, flawed.
It needs a complete rework, not just a bunch of modifications, it needs a major overhaul.
Click to expand...

I have absolutely no problem with it. Maybe you need to visit the optician?
 
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