Well you can always press the threat target key to see what's interdicting you.
You just had to didn't you..
Of course I did. Arturo shall be greatly missed
Discuss the AI here!
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Well you can always press the threat target key to see what's interdicting you.
Of course I did. Arturo shall be greatly missed
No way!!!!
I will be ridiculously sad if they lobotomise them as well as taking their toys away.
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*cries*
I really pray not. There are so many easy games, even totally non-combat space sims and other choices - I'm starting to weep inside a little time every day I hear a heartwarming story about how the game has to be made super easy because of X emotionally loaded reason. Please don't take that as me being heartless (painfully quite the opposite) but inbetween that and then "oh i'll just keep killing players" thing it's all feeling so manipulative. Play it your way is turning into Make The Whole Game For ME! when it should be Make the game amazing, and I'll play it my way.
I was shocked by the huge improvement in the AI.
I will happily agree that the old AI was inadequate. I'm not a great fighter, and the only single ship that posed a significant risk to me in my FDL was an Anaconda; virtually everything smaller was easy meat. If I could take everything on that comfortably, it must have been very boring for really good players.
Under the new AI, I've struggled against a few ships like Imperial Clippers, been seriously by a very nasty Python, and I'd go nowhere near a high level Anaconda without other ships in support. It does seem that the level of the enemy ship now has a big impact on its combat effectiveness. AI ships make good use of things like shield cell banks, and their manouverability is far, far better. I almost wonder if it's too good. My FDL has gone from feeling fairly agile fighter to quite clumsy; I find it hard to out-turn or get a positional advantage over a lot of ships like Clippers, Federal Assault Ships, etc. I have tried my Vulture out and in many ways if feels more effective because it is so manouverable and easier to maintain an advantage. On the other hand, I now worry that it's low speed could end up getting me killed if I run into trouble as I'll be unable to run away. AI level seems to increase generally with the player's combat rank. I think as long as players can still experience a wide range of AI skill levels, it'll be okay. Combat rank can be earned with time rather than great skill, and middling players will not want to constantly face high risk fights against powerful, Dangerous/Deadly/Elite opponents just because they've been grinding a long time.
So I'm glad the AI has received a big boost, although I'll need to play more to get a better feel for overall balance. I have a sense that maybe it's a little too dangerous out there in the galaxy.
I will happily agree that the old AI was inadequate. I'm not a great fighter, and the only single ship that posed a significant risk to me in my FDL was an Anaconda; virtually everything smaller was easy meat. If I could take everything on that comfortably, it must have been very boring for really good players.
Under the new AI, I've struggled against a few ships like Imperial Clippers, been seriously by a very nasty Python, and I'd go nowhere near a high level Anaconda without other ships in support. It does seem that the level of the enemy ship now has a big impact on its combat effectiveness. AI ships make good use of things like shield cell banks, and their manouverability is far, far better. I almost wonder if it's too good. My FDL has gone from feeling fairly agile fighter to quite clumsy; I find it hard to out-turn or get a positional advantage over a lot of ships like Clippers, Federal Assault Ships, etc. I have tried my Vulture out and in many ways if feels more effective because it is so manouverable and easier to maintain an advantage. On the other hand, I now worry that it's low speed could end up getting me killed if I run into trouble as I'll be unable to run away. AI level seems to increase generally with the player's combat rank. I think as long as players can still experience a wide range of AI skill levels, it'll be okay. Combat rank can be earned with time rather than great skill, and middling players will not want to constantly face high risk fights against powerful, Dangerous/Deadly/Elite opponents just because they've been grinding a long time.
So I'm glad the AI has received a big boost, although I'll need to play more to get a better feel for overall balance. I have a sense that maybe it's a little too dangerous out there in the galaxy.
I applied the first engineering mod to a weapon yesterday. Level 1 double shot to the large frag cannon on my Vulture. The ship already feels significantly more powerful now. I can't imagine what it must be like to have level 3 double shot, level 3 overcharge and level 3 high capacity mods, and that would be just for one weapon! And then I will buff up the power plant and shields.
I can see now how the problem before was that the NPCs were heavily modded when everyone was flying a stock ship and that it wasn't the fault of the AI.
In all fairness though, it's very easy to create a bot that can compute the best shot to take at the optimal time in a matter of milliseconds and it's much harder to create a bot that plays like a human being. So it was always going to look suspicious when the AI kills you in a few seconds.
If they very carefully balance the mods that the NPCs have according to their rank, and have far fewer NPCs of the high level ranks then I think this will balance it out nicely for everyone. Maybe constrain the higher ranked NPCs in specific areas like a Haz Res and give them much higher bounties so players can seek them out if they want.
So if the poll was being re-run and was specifically about the AI and not the engineering mods I would vote just right.
I can see now how the problem before was that the NPCs were heavily modded when everyone was flying a stock ship and that it wasn't the fault of the AI.
In all fairness though, it's very easy to create a bot that can compute the best shot to take at the optimal time in a matter of milliseconds and it's much harder to create a bot that plays like a human being. So it was always going to look suspicious when the AI kills you in a few seconds.
If they very carefully balance the mods that the NPCs have according to their rank, and have far fewer NPCs of the high level ranks then I think this will balance it out nicely for everyone. Maybe constrain the higher ranked NPCs in specific areas like a Haz Res and give them much higher bounties so players can seek them out if they want.
So if the poll was being re-run and was specifically about the AI and not the engineering mods I would vote just right.
Um... AFAIK, you can only ever apply one mod to a module..... unless i misread something.
Ah I didn't know that. That balances things quite a bit. Thanks.
verminstar
Banned
So...since yesterday, still being ed fairly regularly though nowhere near as bad as before. Did die once to an elite, with a submit/run scenario but to be fair, it was an anarchy system and I had managed to dodge the guy the first time and it is a mission for one of the mafia families which is why I was there in the first place. Oh and I finally killed something...a deadly who ed me about 10 seconds from a station and I just lost the rag and thought to hell with it because I had no missions on at the time. Not a bad fight fer someone like me whose guns cost less than 10k and are rated about F or G with absolutely nothing on my mk3 higher than a b rating. Have been reading up so had a shield booster fitted and swapped out the heat sink for chaff...managed to lose the shield and about 5% hull, but...I beat the guy.
Anyway in short...I did take a big hit last night getting wiped out because it also meant another mission failure, and I have a bug report about another mafia mission in anarchy that I can't hand back in, even after several attempts at relogging...but even after that, I did make some progress and managed to finally get a 3b power plant...that incidentally being the only b rated module which will mean frak all to most here, but to me, it's a big deal and proof if nothing else, that this game is now a hell7va lot more playable than it was a couple days ago.
Still being ed fairly frequently, but like I said...been doing some reading and listening to advice and my success rate at evading has increased dramatically. Oh and one more tiny little detail...I do know some guys here from other games so have decided to quit being a bollox and have started playing in open as I'm starting to catch up with some old folks. So yeah...I got the bug now and ain't going anywhere...and sooner or later I will misbehave...habits of a lifetime pvp addict can only be contained for so long before the beast has to be unleashed, although this may well be some time away yet as playing against the environment is a novelty I don't often indulge in...it's a lot more fun that I imagined it would be.
No idea what the future holds fer me but the immediate future will be inevitable grind so time to get to work then...sorry fer bein a bollox before and thanks fer all the advice and tips ^^
Anyway in short...I did take a big hit last night getting wiped out because it also meant another mission failure, and I have a bug report about another mafia mission in anarchy that I can't hand back in, even after several attempts at relogging...but even after that, I did make some progress and managed to finally get a 3b power plant...that incidentally being the only b rated module which will mean frak all to most here, but to me, it's a big deal and proof if nothing else, that this game is now a hell7va lot more playable than it was a couple days ago.
Still being ed fairly frequently, but like I said...been doing some reading and listening to advice and my success rate at evading has increased dramatically. Oh and one more tiny little detail...I do know some guys here from other games so have decided to quit being a bollox and have started playing in open as I'm starting to catch up with some old folks. So yeah...I got the bug now and ain't going anywhere...and sooner or later I will misbehave...habits of a lifetime pvp addict can only be contained for so long before the beast has to be unleashed, although this may well be some time away yet as playing against the environment is a novelty I don't often indulge in...it's a lot more fun that I imagined it would be.
No idea what the future holds fer me but the immediate future will be inevitable grind so time to get to work then...sorry fer bein a bollox before and thanks fer all the advice and tips ^^
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I think you are just so damn good, because I had issues even with lower ranking
I fully agree about AI combat being beautifully realistic AND cinematic. SJA got beauty and base combat skills in one update....give her a raise! Also I don't think she will quit on adding more unpredictable things for NPCs. She's just getting started.
As for difficulty - again, it really depends on player skillset Ziljan. It feels hardcore players will find Elite still easy, but majority of playerbase will learn to fight them hard way. After all, FD have tools - both AI and Engineer mods - to up the game in later updates. This is just a start.
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Yeah, no effect stacking on module.
Wait.
You're doing MAFIA missions and asking why you're getting high level hassle? Have I got that right?
Glad to hear you managed to partially turn your luck around Commander. Stick to high sec and medium sec and build your faction rep there is my advice. Police response is swift, and if you get a bit more adventorous, you might decide to help the police punish your assailant, for a bit of a bonus for your mission
verminstar
Banned
No you have that wrong...I'm not asking because I already know...rebel by nature what can I say? Must be the irish in me ^^
True I got killed in anarchy but I went there eyes open...I knew what I was getting into...spent enough time researching different sources to make sure I could find them. Hey, I'm getting the basics and will no doubt suffer worse losses, but at least it's not as bad as it was and that's saying something ^^
We spend our summers here having riots during the marching season (northern ireland) so really with an online persona being a reflection of who we are in rl, there was just no way I was gonna stay law abiding once I figured out some of the basics.
Rage against the machine...f$%£* the law ^^
(here next week crying poverty because I end up having my rear end handed to me after this comment)...chat filter edit ^^
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AI difficulty is always going to be a challenge, look at how many people complain about it but don't offer a viable multi-player solution as it's hard to do so, so that's carefully avoided.
It's also a commercial game and it's obvious that it has to be aimed at the median player skill level as that's where your biggest chunk of players will be. Notice I said median, not average as they are completely different things that are often conflated, which is wrong. People will always, always, with 100% absolute certainty complain that X is too hard, or too easy and we go around and around in this minority echo chamber. "Really?" said Dougal, "Yes," said Zebedee.For me, the thing I notice most is that the combat level of the AI that spawns against me is vastly higher than my own combat level. I'm Master and was chain interdicted by wings of Elite Anaconda's last night, so adjusting what spawns against you, based on your combat rating would also help the situation.
verminstar
Banned
In all fairness, the times I'm being ed, they are all still much more superior to me in terms of rank...3 hours of studying various getaway tactics have left one better able to deal with them now though but it still doesn't take away from the fact that they are all substantially higher ranking than me. While I did die in an anarchy to an elite, I was able to stay one step ahead in safe space and only failed to notice them in time in unsafe space cos I was trying to make a cuppa tea and lost probably the better part of ten seconds afk...ye know how it is ^^
Also while discussing AI it is worth to remember that for majority of games AI is really a window dressing. They have very limited roles in certain scenes, which they fulfill. Devs always struggle to put more work into AI as no one actually see it and even few reviews even pay attention to it, as games grow more and more of interactive cinema pieces and less actual interesting challenges.
I like the new AI in high res and ETC. i'am not a great fighter but its more fun and big ship has to be a threat even with help. But i'am a bit afraid of the assassination mission? honestly even before 2.1 it wasn't easy when you have to fight an anaconda wings alone.
with the new AI? i don't want them to change the AI but maybe they need to tone down the mission. who was artificialy made harder stacking big ship. we don't need that anymore and it's not fun
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with the new AI? i don't want them to change the AI but maybe they need to tone down the mission. who was artificialy made harder stacking big ship. we don't need that anymore and it's not fun
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this is one of the big reasons I'm so grateful about how everyone youtubes and streams games now - you can actually get to see the game in action and not just read pages of effusive hyperbole because they had a laugh and liked the way the protagonist's bodyparts bounced in glorious cutscenes - or games that sound action based then turn out to be all menus that noone seems to mention as genre fans just assume they'll be there
in elite it's HUGE and the difference good AI will make in terms of the footage people see online will be an order of magnitude greater - good exciting fights will sell this game - the old AI did not and many of the videos are kinda laughable as enemies just sit in your sights getting blasted. why would people come for that? Instead we get a lot of sightseers and they complain when they have to live in a cut-throat galaxy
in elite it's HUGE and the difference good AI will make in terms of the footage people see online will be an order of magnitude greater - good exciting fights will sell this game - the old AI did not and many of the videos are kinda laughable as enemies just sit in your sights getting blasted. why would people come for that? Instead we get a lot of sightseers and they complain when they have to live in a cut-throat galaxy
Let's say NPC AI so far didn't made combat outside PVP very watchable. Now...it is different matter. We are on good road.
I'd take avoidable NPC's any day over players who could chase you to the end of the galaxy - then again ,high wake is so OP that neither NPC or Player could ever kill you.
Not only that but you can't devote much processing power to game AI because this would detract from the graphics which is the biggest seller. I've never developed game AI myself but I did go to a job interview for an AI post at a games company once. The AI developer there was asking me about all these classical AI techniques, which didn't do me any good because I research strong AI in academia and normally have computers running 24/7 for weeks on end.
This is why I am impressed by SJA's work. I find it really interesting watching how the NPCs adapt to different situations.
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