asynchronous timewarp disabled = not butter smooth

[kiario]

Hi,

When I have it on auto in rift debug tool I get butter smooth movement in game but if I disable it there is a tiny bit of jerkiness to the movement.Like it is around 85 fps not 90.

Is this normal?

But what I notice when it is disabled, the game is more smooth when dipping below 90 fps. Not as stuttery.

 

[apachesquirrel]

As far as I understand, the whole point of the sync setting is to deal with significant loss of frame rate and drop the frames rendered to smooth out your experience.

If you can run without it on, and have a reasonable experience then you should, as all frames are rendered in time.

running it when you are getting close to 90 all the time, will likely make it worse as the frame rate is halved to 45.

I have Vive, so the tech is slightly different but it's essentially the same. You could try reducing the HMD quality with sync off, just to fix those last few frames you aren't seeing.

I don't know about the Rift, but steamVR has a graph tool you can use to monitor when the re-projection is being used.

 

[kiario]

Hi,

The slight jerkiness/microstutter when ASW is disabled is there all the time no matter how low you set HMD quality and other settings. It never gets as smooth as with it on.

 

[X-Terminator]

For Rift it will activate to cap to 45fps if under 90fps regardless what mode you select. If you notice the added frames then Disabling cancels these. It's supposed to help slower systems but obviously it does not! In fact, if you were able to sustain 90fps then you would not need the added frames would you. However, at least it makes all the frames steady at either 45 or 90 without jumping much. Mine gets as low as 25 amongst Asteroids and I find it perfectly fine. I want a Disable Switch for this in Oculus Home yet they all seem more concerned about pushing us into being "non-compatible" and force us to buy new systems - that's just fraud!

 

[kiario]

Yeah, I have the rift. But why is there a tiny stutter when ASW is disabled. It is there all the time even with all settings at min. With ASW set on auto the movements in game are very smooth like on my Plasma: ) But when ASW is disabled there is a tiny bit if stutter like the game is running at 85 fps not 90.

 

[HeavyGroovez]

Yes its normal, take a look at an FPS render timeline in Afterburner and you will see frequent dips below 90.

ATW i believe is enabled by default when ASW is switched off so you are getting some background render sorcery to ensure that there is no orientation latency but there isnt a fixed fps reprojection in the same manner as ASW.

 

[kiario]

Yes its normal, take a look at an FPS render timeline in Afterburner and you will see frequent dips below 90.

ATW i believe is enabled by default when ASW is switched off so you are getting some background render sorcery to ensure that there is no orientation latency but there isnt a fixed fps reprojection in the same manner as ASW.

Ok, but how come game is not able to maintain 90 fps when ASW is disabled. It does not matter if I put HMD to 0.1 and all min. It still is not butter smooth

 

[TorTorden_VR]

Ok, but how come game is not able to maintain 90 fps when ASW is disabled. It does not matter if I put HMD to 0.1 and all min. It still is not butter smooth

Because elite isn't perfectly optimised for vr and your computer isn't from the future and it can't actually maintain that fps.
Hence the need for interpolation techniques like ASW.

Vr is like strapping a three ton trailer to vw up, and people wonder they can't get anywhere.

 

[xondk]

Hi,

When I have it on auto in rift debug tool I get butter smooth movement in game but if I disable it there is a tiny bit of jerkiness to the movement.Like it is around 85 fps not 90.

Is this normal?

But what I notice when it is disabled, the game is more smooth when dipping below 90 fps. Not as stuttery.

Don't turn off async timewarp?
It amongst other things works to keep your framerate stable and high even if your system cannot output the 'true' fps.

 

[vic]

Maintaining constant fps is much more important than actual high fps for VR. It is better to have constant 60fps, than have 90fps with dips . From my testing, even a small temporary dip of 2-3 fps will cause a microstutter.

 

[HeavyGroovez]

Ok, but how come game is not able to maintain 90 fps when ASW is disabled. It does not matter if I put HMD to 0.1 and all min. It still is not butter smooth

Because the complete render pipeline has only 11.1 milliseconds at a 90hz refresh rate to prepare, distort and render a frame.

If it doesn't hit that target frames get dropped.

 

[kiario]

Because elite isn't perfectly optimised for vr and your computer isn't from the future and it can't actually maintain that fps.
Hence the need for interpolation techniques like ASW.

Vr is like strapping a three ton trailer to vw up, and people wonder they can't get anywhere.

But its not a performance issue. I can run the game at 4K on a screen at 60 fps ultra settings.

Please check, the elite loading screen in the rift. When ASW is on it is smooth when moving head. WHen it is off there is a slight stutter. Nothing to do with performance of pc

- - - Updated - - -

Because the complete render pipeline has only 11.1 milliseconds at a 90hz refresh rate to prepare, distort and render a frame.

If it doesn't hit that target frames get dropped.

But I hit the target. Its not a pc performance issue. Its something to do with the Tech of ASW. Just want to know the reason.

And also, Hud lines distort with ASW on. SO if my pc is capable of running the game at 90 fps + why is there still a slight stutter?

 

[dogbite]

I want a Disable Switch for this in Oculus Home yet they all seem more concerned about pushing us into being "non-compatible" and force us to buy new systems - that's just fraud!

Seems more like an effort to include weaker systems in VR than an effort to get people to upgrade and would garner more VR users. Don't really see the fraud there, but perhaps I am missing your point.

If one wants to manipulate ASW on/off/45 on the fly in a game depending on where they are and what demands are being put on the fps then having CTRL/NP 1-4 works great. Binding CTRL/NP1 to Voice Attack or a controller, if the keyboard is difficult to get at, is a simple enough solution for turning it off. I get your desire for a permanent off switch though, as those of you with 1080's or better would certainly find ATW sufficient for handling any minor drops in fps. With a 980, I turn off ASW in less demanding areas of Ed and on when things get more complex. Both options would be nice to have, though.

 

[HeavyGroovez]

But its not a performance issue. I can run the game at 4K on a screen at 60 fps ultra settings.

Please check, the elite loading screen in the rift. When ASW is on it is smooth when moving head. WHen it is off there is a slight stutter. Nothing to do with performance of pc

- - - Updated - - -


But I hit the target. Its not a pc performance issue. Its something to do with the Tech of ASW. Just want to know the reason.

And also, Hud lines distort with ASW on. SO if my pc is capable of running the game at 90 fps + why is there still a slight stutter?

Set ASW to disabled in the debug tool, run Afterburner and detach the stats.

Start the game and run through a normal play sequence from static in dock all the way out to combat in a RES.

Take a look at the FPS timeline and you will clearly see that you are not getting 90fps all the time.

That is what is causing the stutters. When ASW is turned on reprojection will mostly nullify this as the rendering target is only 45fps. You will however get artifacts from the reprojection despite it being smooth - that's what the HUD lines blurring is.

I'm running a heavily overclocked 1080 and I get loads of minor drops. Even a 1080Ti/Titan cant keep it pinned at 90.

Bottom line is that there isn't a single card solution (SLI cannot be used because of the bridge latency) that is capable of perfect 90fps VR rendering in ED.

 

[kiario]

Set ASW to disabled in the debug tool, run Afterburner and detach the stats.

Start the game and run through a normal play sequence from static in dock all the way out to combat in a RES.

Take a look at the FPS timeline and you will clearly see that you are not getting 90fps all the time.

That is what is causing the stutters. When ASW is turned on reprojection will mostly nullify this as the rendering target is only 45fps. You will however get artifacts from the reprojection despite it being smooth - that's what the HUD lines blurring is.

I'm running a heavily overclocked 1080 and I get loads of minor drops. Even a 1080Ti/Titan cant keep it pinned at 90.

Bottom line is that there isn't a single card solution (SLI cannot be used because of the bridge latency) that is capable of perfect 90fps VR rendering in ED.

Did you try just moving head while ED is loading in the rift? Its just flat 2d Picture with Elite. Moving head while this image is showing with ASW of is not 100 smooth. ASW on = 100 % smooth.
It is exactly the same in the game. So the loading screen with a flat 2d photo a 1080 GTX ´can not maintain 90 fps?

 

[HeavyGroovez]

Did you try just moving head while ED is loading in the rift? Its just flat 2d Picture with Elite. Moving head while this image is showing with ASW of is not 100 smooth. ASW on = 100 % smooth.
It is exactly the same in the game. So the loading screen with a flat 2d photo a 1080 GTX ´can not maintain 90 fps?

That's not an issue with the GPU.

The master thread (running on the CPU) is flat out transferring assets across the bus from disk into cache. Loading screen render stalls are common in all games because of this.

If you want to understand it properly you need to read up on hardcore C++ programming.

 

[Tyger]

ATW over ASW when capped at 45 fps anytime. ASW sucks in my view.

 

[kiario]

To me it clearly looks like the rift can not show 90 fps without ASW. Its showing someting like 85. Without ASW ingame it runs at same fps(85) when all options are on ultra and 1.85 iHMD qualiry as compated to all on min and HMD at 1.0 or less.

 

[dogbite]

To me it clearly looks like the rift can not show 90 fps without ASW. Its showing someting like 85. Without ASW ingame it runs at same fps(85) when all options are on ultra and 1.85 iHMD qualiry as compated to all on min and HMD at 1.0 or less.

No surprise there, Ed not being a native VR title. Add to that, pushing pixel density above 1 wasn't even possible when the CV1 shipped. Now we're trying to do 90 on a gen1 Rift at higher than default PD. Unless FD is willing to create a specific graphics assets package for VR, we may be stuck trying to get there with brute force for a while. It's like trying to turn a Cavalier into a F1 while having only regular gas to burn and a 4 cylinder engine.
It will be interesting to see if ED can be beaten into submission when the 2080 or 3080 arrive.

 

[Tyger]

It will be interesting to see if ED can be beaten into submission when the 2080 or 3080 arrive.

You do mean the Xp version right?

oh wait............i mean XP. Nope..........TI. Nope.............Ti.

Bah