Anarchy systems and murder...
- Thread starter Slim_Sumo
- Start date
I've noted an increase in faction rep if you kill pirates associated with them. Provided they're not a pirate faction.
Are you sure about that? Killing faction ships will decrease your reputation with that faction, but does it decrease the faction influence? There's a huge difference between reputation and influence.
What you are noticing is that the reputation increase from claiming bounties is more than the reputation drop for killing one of their wanted ships. This doesn't count with anarchy factions as they don't offer bounties.
Yeah, I'm not talking about reputation at all, I'm talking about system control influence of the faction in question.
Example, target faction is anarchy, controls the system with 45% of the influence. There is no "crime" in the system. Normally when you kill a miner or system authority you get a 4-6k bounty on you for the murder, and that murder goes in the influence bucket, do 500k worth of murder in a democratic system and you will drop the controlling faction by 5ish% depending on population. But there is no bounty in anarchy systems, if you kill a miner or civilian merchant from supercruise does it still take influence out of the controlling anarchy influence bucket for the murder act? This is what we are trying to figure out.
Simplified I suppose is to say does the simple act of murder have the same effect on a faction that is "lawless" as it does on a "lawful" system?
Example, target faction is anarchy, controls the system with 45% of the influence. There is no "crime" in the system. Normally when you kill a miner or system authority you get a 4-6k bounty on you for the murder, and that murder goes in the influence bucket, do 500k worth of murder in a democratic system and you will drop the controlling faction by 5ish% depending on population. But there is no bounty in anarchy systems, if you kill a miner or civilian merchant from supercruise does it still take influence out of the controlling anarchy influence bucket for the murder act? This is what we are trying to figure out.
Simplified I suppose is to say does the simple act of murder have the same effect on a faction that is "lawless" as it does on a "lawful" system?
All this talk of murder, and you are working against the Anarchy faction?
Especially to questions like "Should FD remove engineer mods on rebuy?"
Well I decided to test it out. I found a system that has a tiny population, small amount of traffic, no player factions in the system, controlled by an anarchy faction, and the nearest outpost is over 200,000 LS away. Below are the stats:
Population = 55,923
Faction = Partnership of anarchy faction
Government = Anarchy
Influence = 68.9%
Current State = Boom
Pending States = None
Traffic = 26 ships in past 24 hours
Nearest Outpost = 214,100 LS away
I killed/murdered 51 ships, all of these ships were from the anarchy faction (if it was 5k bounty per ship that would equate to 255,000cr bounty). Killing 50 clean ships in a system with a low population would cause the influence to drop A LOT in 2.3, it would of also pushed a lockdown and civil unrest into pending states.
Reputation before Murdering = Neutral
Reputation after Murdering = Unfriendly
After the tick, the following are the stats:
Faction = Partnership of anarchy faction
Influence = 70.4%
Current State = Boom
Pending States = None
So it is confirmed, murdering in an anarchy system DOES NOT effect the influence.
In the future, before you post up answering peoples questions, make sure you actually know the correct answer (which means you have tested it yourself or use that tactic in game yourself), otherwise you are just spreading misinformation, others will pick up on it and will believe in the garbage that you are typing.
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Is that a joke?
You try an experiment with no control, kill 51 ships over a whooping one tick of the BGS, observe the influence of the target rising from 68.9% to 70.4%, and you conclude that murder doesn't effect the influence ?
If anything, with such rigourous methodology, shouldn't you have concluded that murder actually helps the target faction, since their influence went up?
So why didn't you jump to that conclusion instead? Is it because that would be a ridiculous claim, easily countered by anyone pointing out the fact you have no idea what factors were at play in this instance due to the lack of control experiment and ridiculously small sample?
In that case, how could you even think about relying on that 'test' to make any claim in either direction?
I appreciate the sentiment and share it, but I'd advise that people who live in glass houses should try diplomacy and civilized discussion before going nuclear like you did.
For the record, my previous post was based on the knowledge that blowing up a faction's ship is a commonly used method to reduce influence and that there has been no evidence so far that this doesn't apply to anarchy factions. You'll also note that in the list of actions and their impact on influence buckets, Murder and Piracy are separate from Gaining bounties/fines, and are therefore not conditionned by the legal status of these actions.
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The test is polluted there, 26 ships? You can't seriously expect us to think that's an absolute truth when we can't accoutn for what other players have done.
Find a system where the traffic is only your ship you flew yesterday, or at least less than 10 - then repeat it.
My personal tests have shown that Killing Wanted ships does not affect Influence, only reputation on its specific level - what happens with turned in bounties changes influence.
Murder can work for Anarchies, but you need to be mindful - DO NOT USE A KWS. Once the ship has a scanned bounty, its counted as a wanted ship, not murder.
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