THE FORMIDINE RIFT MYSTERY (Part 4)

[Saool]

Regarding what you know vs what your character knows: This is a reoccurring problem in many games (and not just computer ones).

I take a simple solution: My character knows what i know. He hears rumours in bars, he reads intel, he has connections, he is the son of an Imperial senator, he is an Alliance agent.

 

[Archon Valec]

I've been out of here for a while, I want to help Salome on the 29th, what, where & how?

I'd love to see a thread about how to help if your not (or cant be) part of a larger group.

Official sticky thread here.

 

[Assimilator1]

Official sticky thread here.

Thanks guys

 

[SpocksOddSocks]

Something just occurred to me regarding Rebecca's mind wipes. I don't think the Zurara find is the reason for them. If that was the thing that they wanted forgotten, they would have surely made some provision to eliminate the remnants of evidence lest anyone else stumble upon it. What if Rebecca actually discovered something shocking on return. Perhaps what she forgot about the Rift as a result of a mind wipe to remove something else, and the powers behind it were not aware of the Zurara*...

I'm getting slightly confused and can't even work out if I'm making any sense. Think I might need a break and a rest.

*Edit: or at least, they never became aware that it hadn't been destroyed.

 

[Mathew of Tegalus]

Something just occurred to me regarding Rebecca's mind wipes. I don't think the Zurara find is the reason for them. If that was the thing that they wanted forgotten, they would have surely made some provision to eliminate the remnants of evidence lest anyone else stumble upon it. What if Rebecca actually discovered something shocking on return. Perhaps what she forgot about the Rift as a result of a mind wipe to remove something else, and the powers behind it were not aware of the Zurara*...

I'm getting slightly confused and can't even work out if I'm making any sense. Think I might need a break and a rest.

*Edit: or at least, they never became aware that it hadn't been destroyed.

Your edit seems more likely, atleast when we're talking about Powers in charge who are aware of this whole show to begin with.

The powers involved in this sent the Zurara out with the intention of it never returning, thus the whole thing to do with the crew mind wiping and turning on each other.

The Zurara was on a mission - the point of which we still try to find out today

This mission was deemed important enough that Rebecca, and those on board the Zurara, and any others who learned of it, had to be mind wiped to ensure the missions security.

The existence of the Zurara on its own means nothing. It literally could have been a cruiseliner that encountered issues and clonked out. The information we know from its logs, and from elsewhere however give the existence of the Zurara meaning, and if we knew the real, full meaning, it would warrant us being mind wiped too.

Therefor, the mission that sent the Zurara out is the cause for mind wiping - the Zurara is just evidence the mission existed; but without context, finding the ship doesn't mean much.

Rebecca getting mind wiped unrelated to the crew suggests to me she found out the mission the Zurara was on, and its significance - which brings us to the discussion we had last night/earlier today re: Patreus, Aisling, the CoR theories Erimus posted, and so on.

I hope that makes sense, it's just an attempt to articulate what we have based on my interpretation, so hopefully it helps somewhat. I've always found that the theorycrafting behind all of this is perhaps more enjoyable for me than the legwork of finding the actual pieces - also helps save on expectational dissapointment

 

[Saool]

Something just occurred to me regarding Rebecca's mind wipes. I don't think the Zurara find is the reason for them. If that was the thing that they wanted forgotten, they would have surely made some provision to eliminate the remnants of evidence lest anyone else stumble upon it. What if Rebecca actually discovered something shocking on return. Perhaps what she forgot about the Rift as a result of a mind wipe to remove something else, and the powers behind it were not aware of the Zurara*...

I'm getting slightly confused and can't even work out if I'm making any sense. Think I might need a break and a rest.

*Edit: or at least, they never became aware that it hadn't been destroyed.

It is one of the story elements that does not really add up (to me). Why is she alive at all. Why go to the trouble of mind wiping when a bullet would do the job quicker, easier, cheaper and be somewhat more permanent. The people behind all this don't strike me as the sorts who would be too bothered about making someone vanish.

Unless of course we do have the wrong end of the stick. What if the instigators of all this are genuinely trying to do what they think is right, but due to all sorts of possible complications, not least the risk of mass panic and unrest if what they know was common knowledge, are having to do it all in secret. What if they really do have humanities best interests a heart and not just there own? What if they are actively not trying to hurt of kill people? This does not really fit in which what happened on the Zarara however, but it is just a thought.


As a complete aside, I was also wondering about the other thing that seemed a bit forced: the whole need for this chase. If Salome has info, broadcast it. Job done. Out of trillions of people there will be enough people willing to start looking under stones even if all major powers deny and dismiss. Well a possible answer is she does not have the final peace of the puzzle, but she knows where it is. So she need to physically go there to activate something. For example something back in the Tionisla graveyard, and it is being done publicly to make it impossible to be swept under the carpet again. But that comes at considerable risk. A risk however, that she is willing to take.

 

[Edelgard von Rhein]

Something just occurred to me regarding Rebecca's mind wipes. I don't think the Zurara find is the reason for them. If that was the thing that they wanted forgotten, they would have surely made some provision to eliminate the remnants of evidence lest anyone else stumble upon it. What if Rebecca actually discovered something shocking on return. Perhaps what she forgot about the Rift as a result of a mind wipe to remove something else, and the powers behind it were not aware of the Zurara*...

I'm getting slightly confused and can't even work out if I'm making any sense. Think I might need a break and a rest.

*Edit: or at least, they never became aware that it hadn't been destroyed.

Interesting thoughts.
My interpretation of what Rebecca did is that she wiped some of her own mind after leaving clues to her later self. She did not want whoever she expected to cause her trouble to know exactly what she had found out.
.
Say it was INRA (just speculating), then INRA would have known about the Dynasty Expeditions, maybe even helped organise them, but did not know that any of the ships had survived. When Rebecca returned, they might have suspected that she had found something but would probably have interrogated her at length to be sure, even if they had not. Rebecca suspected that they might do that and wiped from her memory the key details of what she had found, so that INRA would not know that the Zurara was intact. Rebecca was relying on her clues being found and deciphered first by her future self, or future allies like Salomé, perhaps leading her to a cache of evidence that she might be able to make public before INRA could stop her.
.
Perhaps that is what this event on 29th will lead us to. Evidence of the conspiracy. Whilst it could be that Salomé et al. will try and reach a certain starport somewhere, would that be as interesting as e.g. leading us to an 'evacuation' megaship? If it's just a question of docking safely at their destination, fine, we might get a speech or something will show up in Galnet at a later date telling us something of the consequences. That's a valid way of providing information by in-game means. Leading us to a huge hulk (possibly still under construction - maybe also defended!) in deep space that, from logs on board e.g. , is clearly to be used to transport millions to safety out in the Rift would be more dramatic - and blow the conspiracy wide open. In contrast, words in Galnet are something that could be disputed, or ridiculed as the claims of a convicted criminal. For this reason, I do not think Salomé will only have words for us on 29th!

 

[Saool]

Interesting thoughts.
My interpretation of what Rebecca did is that she wiped some of her own mind after leaving clues to her later self. She did not want whoever she expected to cause her trouble to know exactly what she had found out.
.
Say it was INRA (just speculating), then INRA would have known about the Dynasty Expeditions, maybe even helped organise them, but did not know that any of the ships had survived. When Rebecca returned, they might have suspected that she had found something but would probably have interrogated her at length to be sure, even if they had not. Rebecca suspected that they might do that and wiped from her memory the key details of what she had found, so that INRA would not know that the Zurara was intact. Rebecca was relying on her clues being found and deciphered first by her future self, or future allies like Salomé, perhaps leading her to a cache of evidence that she might be able to make public before INRA could stop her.
.
Perhaps that is what this event on 29th will lead us to. Evidence of the conspiracy. Whilst it could be that Salomé et al. will try and reach a certain starport somewhere, would that be as interesting as e.g. leading us to an 'evacuation' megaship? If it's just a question of docking safely at their destination, fine, we might get a speech or something will show up in Galnet at a later date telling us something of the consequences. That's a valid way of providing information by in-game means. Leading us to a huge hulk (possibly still under construction - maybe also defended!) in deep space that, from logs on board e.g. , is clearly to be used to transport millions to safety out in the Rift would be more dramatic - and blow the conspiracy wide open. In contrast, words in Galnet are something that could be disputed, or ridiculed as the claims of a convicted criminal. For this reason, I do not think Salomé will only have words for us on 29th!

Good point about who did the mind wiping. If she did it to herself, she may not have known that herself. When Salome met her in the hospital, she may have believed some big bad did it to her, not realising she did it to herself. Indeed, that fact she she though it was someone else may indicate that she did the job well.

 

[Mathew of Tegalus]

It is one of the story elements that does not really add up (to me). Why is she alive at all. Why go to the trouble of mind wiping when a bullet would do the job quicker, easier, cheaper and be somewhat more permanent. The people behind all this don't strike me as the sorts who would be too bothered about making someone vanish.

Unless of course we do have the wrong end of the stick. What if the instigators of all this are genuinely trying to do what they think is right, but due to all sorts of possible complications, not least the risk of mass panic and unrest if what they know was common knowledge, are having to do it all in secret. What if they really do have humanities best interests a heart and not just there own? What if they are actively not trying to hurt of kill people? This dose not really fit in which what happened on the Zarara however, but it is just a thought.


As a complete aside, I was also wondering about the other thing that seemed a bit forced: the whole need for this chase. If Salome has info, broadcast it. Job done. Out of trillions of people there will be enough people willing to start looking under stones even if all major powers deny and dismiss. Well a possible answer is she does not have the final peace of the puzzle, but she knows where it is. So she need to physically go there to activate something. For example something back in the Tionisla graveyard, and it is being done publicly to make it impossible to be swept under the carpet again. But that comes at considerable risk. A risk however, that she is willing to take.

Some more good questions and points to make.

 

[CMDR Zadian Lichtfrost]

…
Unless of course we do have the wrong end of the stick. What if the instigators of all this are genuinely trying to do what they think is right, …

That's the big unknown in the equation, isn't it?
What if Salomé, while trying to help, is in reality only making things worse?
(A bit like the Prism incident. Without Salomé showing up the story would have ended almost exactly the same - just with much less dead people.)

As a complete aside, I was also wondering about the other thing that seemed a bit forced: the whole need for this chase. If Salome has info, broadcast it. …

Apparently they (Salomé and her co-conspirators) are trying to do something at a certain location in the bubble (according to D. Wagar in the CQC live stream interview about the event).
That doesn't sound like they have information to share, more like they need to do something to get the final proof. Maybe they have the key to a data save and they need to unlock it to get to the information - something like that.

 

[Belthize]

Something just occurred to me regarding Rebecca's mind wipes. I don't think the Zurara find is the reason for them. If that was the thing that they wanted forgotten, they would have surely made some provision to eliminate the remnants of evidence lest anyone else stumble upon it. What if Rebecca actually discovered something shocking on return. Perhaps what she forgot about the Rift as a result of a mind wipe to remove something else, and the powers behind it were not aware of the Zurara*...

I'm getting slightly confused and can't even work out if I'm making any sense. Think I might need a break and a rest.

*Edit: or at least, they never became aware that it hadn't been destroyed.

That was one of the points I was getting at. She was wiped before (multiple times before) 3270. She wasn't going to the Rift to look for Dynasty Ships, the Dynasty Ships were sent to the Rift to look for whatever she found. Maybe not because she found it but they were looking for the same thing.

Spoiler

My current theory is they weren't looking, they were monitoring. In 3270 Rebecca turned up, was discovered by the Men in Gray and re-wiped once they realized she'd been out there and may have talked. In 3270 Dynasty ships set sail. My guess is the Men in Gray sent them out there to monitor for other folks poking around. They sent them in unmarked ships and then killed off the crew to make sure they didn't talk or return. If true they're going to be right annoyed they were found, and probably go to some lengths if somebody can connect the dots, for instance if Salome' can connect them

The ships were either sent by a very powerful independent agency (e.g Sirius or DW) or were sent by a power without any designation. I've always been relatively certain it was not a power that was wiping her (like the Feds), in Altera it appears to be some clandestine group.

My guess is Sirius is good at making technological advances because they're steal from the source and they don't want anybody horning in on their Golden Goose. They wiped Rebecca and they funded the Dynasty Ships.

The Men in Grey stated they merely wiped her because they don't want to get rid of potentially useful tools. Rebecca had proven to be an incredibly valuable asset, if she's wiped should could be again, if she's dead she's really only useful for growing flowers.

 

[Lobey]

After the 29th - everyone will be mind wiped so we wont have a clue what happened

 

[cleonymus]

Someone suggested Lave as an endpoint, so Salome could get the word out via the Radio station.

On a similar thought - anyone know where Radio Sidewinder is based for a second end-point?

Also perhaps Salome is coming back for a coffee - A final chase along the 1+ hour trip to Hutton? For the Mug!

 

[Mathew of Tegalus]

Someone suggested Lave as an endpoint, so Salome could get the word out via the Radio station.

On a similar thought - anyone know where Radio Sidewinder is based for a second end-point?

Also perhaps Salome is coming back for a coffee - A final chase along the 1+ hour trip to Hutton? For the Mug!

More chance of Kow letting you read your own drabble

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

Then why your build includes:
Hardpoints:
2X Frag Cannon (M) (G) G5 Lightweight 1X Drag Munitions
1X Beam Laser (M) (G) G5 Lightweight 1X Regeneration Sequence

Seriously. For all explorers, rifters and whatever beings out there (who don't read the discord-channel):

The PAC has declared the region a Gun-Free-Zone. Anyone with guns will be considered a possible threat (as we all know, the story of the Galaxy is rich in betrayal, murder and assassinations). Yes, there are a few CMDRs at discord, who are maybe slightly exaggerating their pvp-skillz. But if you turn up in the area, carrying guns without being on the whitelist the following will happen:

scouts will spot you, and report you up the command chain as possible threat.

You will then be
a) chain-interdicted by the fast builds (read: you will be chasing the escape-vector for the whole event)
or
b) jumped by complete wing opening up with plasmas, rails, and whatnot. Think CG-gank, but in 'serious'. SO even If you rate your pvp-skillz as en-par with the skillset of the defenders ... It will be not enough too survive a 4vs1 engagement, right?
or
c) you will enjoy the possibilities a) and b)

Additionally, there will be no comms-activity during the whole process. You will not be able to explain yourself. The 'Thing' will be fast moving, and "Ain't nobody got time for that!" So seriously: If you do not plan to shoot at the VIPs, don't bring guns. Except if you are on a whitelist, or a well known white-hat - your chances are slim to ejoy the event.

Yes, I do know, the noises the pvp-crowd tends to make when boasting with their abilities are sometimes slightly irritating. But believe me: the no guns directive is probably the only way for slimming down the chances of some assailant/traitor/whatnot killing one of the VIPs from point-blank range. I don't have a better Idea, and I haven't heard of a better Idea.

TL;TR: If you want to attend the event as visitor, come UNARMED. At least the pro VIP-Side will very likely not open up on you. The opponents probably will, for blowing of steam due to their frustration. Bring Heat sinks, and some decent shields (if you pop a Heatsink when >2km out the attacker will likely lose target-lock, giving you time FSD-Out).

And to be extra clear: anything fitted in a hardpoint is considered a gun. So: no healing lasers, no mines, no missiles, no anything.

And spread the word along your friends: NO GUNS
Always remeber: Friends don't let their friends bring guns to the event!

Such inclusive.
Many community.
Wow.

 

[Edelgard von Rhein]

That's the big unknown in the equation, isn't it?
What if Salomé, while trying to help, is in reality only making things worse?
(A bit like the Prism incident. Without Salomé showing up the story would have ended almost exactly the same - just with much less dead people.)



Apparently they (Salomé and her co-conspirators) are trying to do something at a certain location in the bubble (according to D. Wagar in the CQC live stream interview about the event).
That doesn't sound like they have information to share, more like they need to do something to get the final proof. Maybe they have the key to a data save and they need to unlock it to get to the information - something like that.

I listened to the interview with Drew tonight as well. I am increasingly feeling that there is more than one 'stage' to the event. The 'chase' from 46 Eridani into the bubble is the part that we know about. Then comes the 'reveal', which we know nothing about, not even which systems it will be in. How that is done we will find out on the night. A speech would only be picked up by people in the instances of the characters that make it. A Galnet article would be read by everyone. A something in game would be seen by everyone.
.
Many people on this thread (and doubtless just reading) have been speculating which systems Salomé and the other protagonists have been heading for. I think what I will do now is transfer a capable ship to each location I suspect, so that if some other 'activities' are required, then I can just stop off at a station and change ships in a few minutes and quickly be on the scene in something a bit more suitable than the ship I'll be using for the 'chase' which has a focused loadout configured for that stage of the event.
.
You make a good point about Salomé potentially making things worse. That is an outcome everyone helping her has to accept is possible. She has a moral compass that she sticks to relentlessly and might have anticipated it herself and decided that the truth must out, regardless of how people respond to it. I (and my character) are happy to support her in her attempt to reveal the truth, as a wise man once said: 'I need to know everything. How else am I supposed to know whether or not I need to know?'.

 

[Saool]

After the 29th - everyone will be mind wiped so we wont have a clue what happened

Wait... what if we have all already been mind wiped? What if we have been doing this again and again for years? But we keep missing the clues each cycle!

 

[Mathew of Tegalus]

Such inclusive.
Many community.
Wow.

Meanwhile, I'm off touring some new Asteroid Bases and looking a cool thing whilst letting my mind wander.

Gods todays been a rough day in the Elite universe.

- - - Updated - - -

Wait... what if we have all already been mind wiped? What if we have been doing this again and again for years? But we keep missing the clues each cycle!

Reminds me of that one Stargate episode.

We've yet to derange into increasingly humerous ways to pass the time yet, although if we realise the 29th is the switch point for us all to revert back a week, I guess we'll never know...

We could have been at this for years by now! (The were certainly at it for months in that episode)

 

[Han_Zen]

Wait... what if we have all already been mind wiped? What if we have been doing this again and again for years? But we keep missing the clues each cycle!

Thats the Eranin Peal Whiskey, not Hexedit.

 

[Trafalgar Law]

Then why your build includes:
Hardpoints:
2X Frag Cannon (M) (G) G5 Lightweight 1X Drag Munitions
1X Beam Laser (M) (G) G5 Lightweight 1X Regeneration Sequence

Seriously. For all explorers, rifters and whatever beings out there (who don't read the discord-channel):

The PAC has declared the region a Gun-Free-Zone. Anyone with guns will be considered a possible threat (as we all know, the story of the Galaxy is rich in betrayal, murder and assassinations). Yes, there are a few CMDRs at discord, who are maybe slightly exaggerating their pvp-skillz. But if you turn up in the area, carrying guns without being on the whitelist the following will happen:

scouts will spot you, and report you up the command chain as possible threat.

You will then be
a) chain-interdicted by the fast builds (read: you will be chasing the escape-vector for the whole event)
or
b) jumped by complete wing opening up with plasmas, rails, and whatnot. Think CG-gank, but in 'serious'. SO even If you rate your pvp-skillz as en-par with the skillset of the defenders ... It will be not enough too survive a 4vs1 engagement, right?
or
c) you will enjoy the possibilities a) and b)

Additionally, there will be no comms-activity during the whole process. You will not be able to explain yourself. The 'Thing' will be fast moving, and "Ain't nobody got time for that!" So seriously: If you do not plan to shoot at the VIPs, don't bring guns. Except if you are on a whitelist, or a well known white-hat - your chances are slim to ejoy the event.

Yes, I do know, the noises the pvp-crowd tends to make when boasting with their abilities are sometimes slightly irritating. But believe me: the no guns directive is probably the only way for slimming down the chances of some assailant/traitor/whatnot killing one of the VIPs from point-blank range. I don't have a better Idea, and I haven't heard of a better Idea.

TL;TR: If you want to attend the event as visitor, come UNARMED. At least the pro VIP-Side will very likely not open up on you. The opponents probably will, for blowing of steam due to their frustration. Bring Heat sinks, and some decent shields (if you pop a Heatsink when >2km out the attacker will likely lose target-lock, giving you time FSD-Out).

And to be extra clear: anything fitted in a hardpoint is considered a gun. So: no healing lasers, no mines, no missiles, no anything.

And spread the word along your friends: NO GUNS
Always remeber: Friends don't let their friends bring guns to the event!

I was thinking this might be a fun RP event before this post. Instead it sounds increasingly like it'll be completely pointless pvp gank fest. I'm wondering whether it'll be even worth bothering now.